Did someone mention slow pans? I LOVE slow pans and the creativity that it gives you. At this point in my career, I would rather shoot motorsports in complete darkness than during the day.
I don't want to hijack the thread but I like night time blurs too. I shoot a lot of daylight road and drag racing but like the image above the blur in the car and in the vehicle rock. - this at a1/10th of a second
regor601 wrote:
OK, well, my shots are unlikely to look as good as these...I appreciate the tips
Well my friend good panning pictures come with of one thing - practice.
It is an acquired talent and even after 35 years of photographing race cars I always find there are the good, the bad and the flukey thus there is no reason yours should be any worse than mine.
anyway, there's a lot more to panning than just shutter speed...i'd appreciate some discussion on the actual technique for panning.
for example, how far away do you usually start tracking the vehicle with the camera? do you use a monopod for panning? is your panning motion at the hips or the arms? if handheld, do you swivel around your hips as the axis? do you follow-through (continue the panning motion after the last frame is taken)? do you use IS/VR or no?
Since we're now talking about night stuff...
(Canon EOS-1D MkII, 70-200mm f/2.8L @125mm, ISO400, 1/10th, f/2.8)
(Canon EOS-1D MkII, 70-200mm f/2.8L @70mm, ISO200, 1/5th, f/2.8 - pop of fill)
21farms wrote:
how far away do you usually start tracking the vehicle with the camera? do you use a monopod for panning? is your panning motion at the hips or the arms? if handheld, do you swivel around your hips as the axis? do you follow-through (continue the panning motion after the last frame is taken)? do you use IS/VR or no?
Start tracking the subject as soon as you can, as it gives AF more time to get things in focus... it also helps you get in-sync with the motion of the subject.
I hand hold as much as possible, and that includes when panning with the 500mm f/4. There is no way to match the motion of a car/bike when you're anchored to the ground with a 'pod. It's nice when shooting with long lenses to help with the weight, but it just gets in the way most of the times.
Panning is a full-body thing at times (not just hips, but also legs). Depending on the shot, you can just use your arms (long lens, short panning motion)... or, you may need to rotate your whole body to get the motion right. The best analogy that I know of is throwing a discus... it is a rotation of the whole body in a smooth arch... exactly like panning (just don't throw your camera). In the end, you need to find what works for you... I tend to be smoother using my legs and a slight rotation of the shoulders, with my arms locked.
ALWAYS FOLLOW-THROUGH.
No IS/VR... it just gets in the way... and tries to remove the motion that you need. Even in "mode 2" (or panning, etc. - i don't know the VR settings) it still removes motion... it also causes things to jump around when you're tracking a subject.
todd, i'm a "pan with my whole body" guy too. however, i see a lot of guys swivel only at the hips and thought maybe i was doing something wrong. i learned to track early and follow-through from my spray painting days
Ok, I love this post as I am a complete novice and trying to learn this art... I have a 350d and 70-200f4L and will be at this Road Atlanta event. I want to try this but need some advise on setup of the camera. I assume that I am to be using AI Servo and shutter priority at the lowest possible setting to get the cars in focus but the wheels and background blurred but what about other settings like metering, AEB, white balance?
Sorry for the newbie questions but thought I would ask.
Todd Johnston wrote:
assume that I am to be using AI Servo and shutter priority at the lowest possible setting to get the cars in focus but the wheels and background blurred but what about other settings like metering, AEB, white balance?
Shutter speeds when panning has little to do with focus... you can have a properly focuses car, but an incorrect panning motion (most of the time, this is the reason for a soft/blurry shot). But you are correct; you want a shutter speed that allows for motion in the wheels in background, but a sharp car.
As for other modes... it depends on your shooting style. I started with the settings suggested by SI (http://www.siphoto.com/), but tweaked things to my style/needs (like sRGB color space - my shots go to the web most of the time). I would hesitate messing with this stuff too much from your normal, as you introduce more variables... but it’s a good guide.
I prefer to shoot in TV (shutter priority) with -1/3rd shot exposure compensation during the mid-day... but sometimes more (I make sure I'm not blowing much out on the histogram). Single-point focus, moved around to suit the composition. I use spot metering linked to my focus point. At dusk/night I'll change to manual exposure and adjust things to get the histogram I want... one thing to watch-out for with TV mode is the headlights of the cars will often throw it way off (resulting in a dark image). As for white balance, I've always just used auto... the results on my 1D MkII are just what I want most of the time.
The best thing is that you have 10 hours... and you can review your shots as you go, so don't be afraid to play around a little.
One thing I've found very helpful for increasing my keeper ratio is to shoot bursts of three or more shots. Often I'll find one out of a series is tack sharp, while the two on either side are blurry.
Todd Johnston wrote:
Ok, I love this post as I am a complete novice and trying to learn this art... I have a 350d and 70-200f4L and will be at this Road Atlanta event. I want to try this but need some advise on setup of the camera. I assume that I am to be using AI Servo and shutter priority at the lowest possible setting to get the cars in focus but the wheels and background blurred but what about other settings like metering, AEB, white balance?
Sorry for the newbie questions but thought I would ask.
I was at the 12:45 race. If you were at that one, did you see the crash with car #60 and two others ? Don't know which curve but it should have been near the finish line. It was two laps from race end. That was the guy who invited me.
I didn't get that many shots that I liked - it felt like I wasn' t in the right spots that would require speedy sweeping of the lens and therefore blurred background. That and the 1/125 speed also didn't generate too many sharp vehicles.
GeoffSobering wrote:
One thing I've found very helpful for increasing my keeper ratio is to shoot bursts of three or more shots. Often I'll find one out of a series is tack sharp, while the two on either side are blurry.
Cheers,Geoff S.
Thank god for digital - shoot, fail, delete. At my peak ten years back I shot 1000 rolls (80% Fuji Velvia rated at 40 ASA) in one year at the races and obviously you get a lot of failures. Practice, practice, practice.
tcorzett- Thanks for the info. I didn't have access to the cpu to reply. I tried and found that using 320 is a little safe for me as it didn't give the amount of motion in the photos as I like. So as you said at least there were 10 hours to get it right. I think I did a fair job.
regor601 - I wasn't at that race. I did find the best results shooting @ the entrance to turn 6 or 7, the exit of 7, the exit of 10b or the apex of turn 1. I was shooting with a 70-200f4L and found that this isn't nearly long enough of a lens for stopping the cars at apex and filling the frame but for panning at the locations that I stated it worked just fine.
Jon Van Daal - Thank god for digital - shoot, fail, delete.
I may have missed it but I have not seen any posts regarding the auto-focusing points used for these sharp panning-type shots. What are you experts out there using for your focus points in terms of number and expanding settings?
God, what a great thread!! I've learned a lot just reading it!
I shoot TT racing, and many of the techniques here are applicable to auto racing. One of my main settings is SS of about 250, at f/5.6 or 6, ISO 100 to 400, (depending on light, obviously) and ALWAYS AI Servo; my sharpness doubled in precision when I found that little nugget.
Here's the technique for getting the most out of AI Servo: capture your image in the viewfinder, depress the shutter 1/2 way, pause ever so briefly and let AI Servo acquire your focus points and compute the movement, and then shoot when ready! All the while moving with the pan, my IS set on mode 2. It does take practice, but this procedure will be second nature once you get it down.
Example:
Edited by phil hawkins on Oct 03, 2006 at 03:28 PM GMT
I use all focus points and it works great! My 5D is very good at finding what it should be focusing on... I find with the center point only it "slips off" the subject and i end up focusing the background, plus when I'm trying to compose for the rider traveling right-to-left, I place him at the right side of the image for effect, the center does not good, but when all focus points are activated, I get great results and don't have to worry about it.
I LOVE slow pans and the creativity that it gives you. At this point in my career, I would rather shoot motorsports in complete darkness than during the day.
