Xavier Rival wrote:
Great thread! We rarely hear about TS lenses here, even though it seems like a lot of fun. I do not see myself getting one soon due to their high price and the limited use one would get in my arsenal, but I appreciate to hear about these "exotic" lenses and to see what can be done with them. Thanks!
If you enjoy the fun of ordering from the former Soviet Union (Ukraine) and tolerate some rather long shipping delays there are a few low-cost alternatives. In addition to the 90TS-E I have what I am dubbing the NIVA (you heard it here first!) -- a Hartblei 45mm TS with a shifting adapter that's about half the cost of the Canon 45mm TS-E and though the image quality isn't quite as good it does have some additional features. No plastic on this baby and the combination will shift 23mm (or 12&11mm in two directions) as well as tilt in any direction relative to shift.
I'm so glad this thread got started but I'd love to explore using a TS in another thread too. There are 2 issues that I'd love to hear some input from others and wonder if I should start another thread---or if this one will just evolve here..
One--using a Canon in parallel or perpendicular mode. There was a thread on dpreview on this at one time--maybe we could explore that here. I'd like to know if those using a TS have reoriented their lens, if so why---and if they reorient back and forth (I'm getting ready to order the micro Phillips head #00 screwdriver so I can do my own--right now I can see me using it more in parallel fashion--but I would like to be able --and feel comfortable enough---to go back and forth). I suspect if I did a lot of panos, that having it perpendicular would be the mode I would prefer.
Two--in using tilt I'd like to discuss how the aperture affects the 'wedge' of in focus area and how people are making the decisions of how much to swing or tilt when the lens is rotated somewhat (meaning are you focusing for the near subject and then using the swing to bring the furthest subject into focus and adjusting back and forth--or are you focusing for the furthest area you want in focus and adjusting swing to bring the nearer subject into focus--of course, with repeated adjustments visually). I found that the good tip I had learned for 'focus far/tilt near' doesn't always seem to work too well when the lens is rotated and the swing/tilt isn't down/up.
Thouse wrote:
You can often tilt the focus plane so that you are able to use a fast aperture but still get a complete bloom in sharp focus without needing to stop down and lose any background blur or light. Tough to master but once done, results are cool!!
Let's face it, 95% of flower shots are boring. To take advantage of the artistic opportunities that flowers offer us you have to start getting creative and pull some rabbits out of the old hat. The TS-E lenses allow you to do that by manipulating the point focus and controlling the foreground and backgroud bokeh to a much greater extent than you could with an 85mm. Also, it can be a lot easier to fine tune your composition as you can you the shift to adjust things rather than move the camera. As a last point, referencing the 90mm TS-E, it is a VERY sharp lens with absolutely incredible bokeh even when used straight-up.
Doug Morgan wrote:
[If you enjoy the fun of ordering from the former Soviet Union (Ukraine) and tolerate some rather long shipping delays there are a few low-cost alternatives. In addition to the 90TS-E I have what I am dubbing the NIVA (you heard it here first!) -- a Hartblei 45mm TS with a shifting adapter that's about half the cost of the Canon 45mm TS-E and though the image quality isn't quite as good it does have some additional features. No plastic on this baby and the combination will shift 23mm (or 12&11mm in two directions) as well as tilt in any direction relative to shift.
It's a very fun lens!
Doug
Edited by Doug Morgan on Jul 13, 2006 at 09:31 AM GMT (Reason: Decrease embedded size)...Show more →
I'm glad you posted this--and I saw the larger earlier. I may be sorry that I didn't follow your lead for the Hartblei (the 45, not the 35 I had on order) and the adaptor LOL. I'm looking forward to seeing some other images with it.
My question--sort of OT--is how do you get so high to take the panos that you have of Victoria? Never having been there---is there a mt. range that runs along the coast right above the city? Or--are you able to find buildings that allow you access for shooting?
The 45mm T/S is usually not wide enough for nearer building shots though, hence most of my architectural shots are slightly tilted still or are cropped.
picnic wrote:
I'm so glad this thread got started but I'd love to explore using a TS in another thread too. There are 2 issues that I'd love to hear some input from others and wonder if I should start another thread---or if this one will just evolve here..
One--using a Canon in parallel or perpendicular mode. There was a thread on dpreview on this at one time--maybe we could explore that here. I'd like to know if those using a TS have reoriented their lens, if so why---and if they reorient back and forth (I'm getting ready to order the micro Phillips head #00 screwdriver so I can do my own--right now I can see me using it more in parallel fashion--but I would like to be able --and feel comfortable enough---to go back and forth). I suspect if I did a lot of panos, that having it perpendicular would be the mode I would prefer.
Two--in using tilt I'd like to discuss how the aperture affects the 'wedge' of in focus area and how people are making the decisions of how much to swing or tilt when the lens is rotated somewhat (meaning are you focusing for the near subject and then using the swing to bring the furthest subject into focus and adjusting back and forth--or are you focusing for the furthest area you want in focus and adjusting swing to bring the nearer subject into focus--of course, with repeated adjustments visually). I found that the good tip I had learned for 'focus far/tilt near' doesn't always seem to work too well when the lens is rotated and the swing/tilt isn't down/up.
Good questions! It might be best to start a separate thread as this has been running awhile.
#1 - Every time I think one way is better than the other I feel the need to switch back. Not hard but certainly a pain.
#2 - Having a fair amount of view camera experience, I find the focusing with the TS-E to be pretty primative and much more a matter of trial and error. Focus far / tilt near really seems to work on only one plane and is less effective on the other. With a view camera you have the rear movements as well as the front and the combination of the two is really where a lot of the control is.
I don't know if Miklos Gaal uses Canon gear or a traditional view camera, but his pictures seem to be truly fantastic examples of what happens when you move the plane of focus relative to the film plane. There are some examples at http://www.anhava.com/?http://www.anhava.com/exhibitions/gaal/ but googling his name gets a few more. The combination of an elevated viewpoint and manipulated depth of field makes his subjects look like scale models. I love them!
Edit: that URL should all be one link, but I can't get it to work: you'll have to copy and paste!
I want to do landscapes and flowers, no architecture. If I had to get one ts-e lens, which should I get? I'm going to Wyoming in one week and will have a chance to do some big landscapes....
I guess what I'm really asking is whether I should get the 24 or the 45 for landscapes.... if I enjoy the first one I'd probably pick up the 90 sometime later for flowers....
What is the recommended set-up for the lens? Doens't it come with Shift and tilt in different directions? John - in your shots for example are you just using the tilt feature or are they used in conjunction? And if so, what is the set-up like? Thanks-Kevin
Doug Morgan wrote
If you enjoy the fun of ordering from the former Soviet Union (Ukraine) and tolerate some rather long shipping delays there are a few low-cost alternatives. In addition to the 90TS-E I have what I am dubbing the NIVA (you heard it here first!) -- a Hartblei 45mm TS with a shifting adapter that's about half the cost of the Canon 45mm TS-E and though the image quality isn't quite as good it does have some additional features. No plastic on this baby and the combination will shift 23mm (or 12&11mm in two directions) as well as tilt in any direction relative to shift. ...Show more →
Very interesting! Thanks for the information Doug; I take note and may search for this one in the future. By the way, your pano is great!
I remember reading a webpage about the creation of panos using T/S lenses, but lost it. Would anyone know about such a link ? (I am sure I found the original link somewhere here).
I find in shooting my TS-E 45 that I make use of the movements all the time for very subtle tweaks... not the dramatic ones most often shown. When you start shooting one of these lenses you start noticing how almost all photos can be made slightly better by either controlling your plane of focus or your perspective choice. Regarding how you want your axes alligned... well, either way it's going to be wrong sometimes. I've left mine as shipped and it seems to be right more often than not for me. The FSU Super-Rotators give complete flexiblity in movement and I plan on buying one of those at some point... though I'll probably get the TS-E 90 first. Regarding setup/usage, metering goes away with any movement, period. It's not that well publicized, but you pretty much have to shoot manually... make your settings prior to movements or just use a handheld meter. Sunny-16 works fine for me outdoors and I use my lens handheld for candids all the time using the movements. Excellent fun lens!
I want to do landscapes and flowers, no architecture. If I had to get one ts-e lens, which should I get? I'm going to Wyoming in one week and will have a chance to do some big landscapes....
I guess what I'm really asking is whether I should get the 24 or the 45 for landscapes.... if I enjoy the first one I'd probably pick up the 90 sometime later for flowers....
You might be surprised how effective longer lenses are for landscapes. Many people automatically gravitate to wide angles for landscapes but IMHO some of the very best shots are taken with long lenses from further back. The compressed perspective can be very effective. While the 90 certainly can't be considered long, it will create a very different image than one taken with the 45 or 24. Besides, Wyoming is a big place and has lots of room to take a couple of steps backward.
Kevin: When shooting in a more abstract fashion I often shoot fully tilted and shifted. You'll notice a near black corner on lots of the shots and that's what happens when you set everything to extremes. My lense is still set perpendicular.
You'll notice a sort of distortion on some shots too which is what happens when you shift the lense fully and then rotate the lense (most of these lenses rotate too!). In effect this is shifting diagonally, which of course keeps diagonals parallel, but then I recompose angled down towards the ground or however so that the horizon line is not in the middle where it shoot be. This distorts all the perspective lines.
I like shooting fully shifted sometimes because I can get a polarizer like effect or vignetting of the sky or certain elements. I do however shoot lots of shots conventionally too. The T/S lenses just give a lot more possibilities in terms of distortion and selective vignetting. Getting more or less based on settings and shooting angle. Just more tools in the toolbox.
