p.1 #1 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I have had Leica digital M cameras in the past, and now use the Hasselblad X2DII and 907x. However, sometimes I think about picking up a Leica M camera again (perhaps the EV1), along with a tiny lens like the 28mm Summaron which I briefly owned, for a really nice compact solution to bring with me more easily. Also, while the Hasselblad files are fantastic, I also would enjoy the different renderings I can get with lenses like the 28mm Summaron or the 50mm Summilux.
However, whenever I had a Leica, I always added a hand and thumb grip as a matter of course to make them more stable to use, but of course this just increases the size of the camera, especially a hand grip. This kind of defeats the purpose for me, as once it starts even remotely approaching the size of my X2DII with the 28P or 45P on it, I start to wonder whether whether I would just reach for the Hasselblad instead (I also had the Q3, but with its protruding lens it actually wasn't dramatically smaller than my X2D/28P combo so I sold it).
So I am wondering if many people happily do without any grips on their M camera to keep their kit as compact as possible? If so, do you find it slipping out of your hand on occasion or hurting your hand after using it all day? Do you find it noticeably more difficult to hold the camera steady enough to get sharp photos without a grip? (It's interesting to me how the Leica M is considered such a masterpiece of design whose essential shape hasn't changed in many decades, yet a hand and/or thumb grip is often cited as an essential accessory).
p.1 #4 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
1bwana1 wrote:
I use a half case with a small padded area on the right side. The added texture and softness makes it very comfortable.
I do the same for my two current M bodies. Previously, when I had the M10, I just used a Thumbie thumb rest and no grip or half case and it worked fine.
p.1 #5 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I have always used my Leica's naked. For myself I find them comfortable and have no problem gripping or holding the camera all day long. I have different generational body sizes M9M, M246(the big fat one), M10M and M8. Even when using multiple bodies on a walk around they feel fine for me. I think part of it is when I got the M246 it reminded me so much of my Canon AE-1 and F-1 (although they have a small grip) it seemed natural for me.
p.1 #6 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I use a thumb grip on both my M-E 240 and the M 246. Easier especially when holding the camera in portrait position. Disadvantage of thumb grip: to remove it first when using the optional electronic viewfinder on the hot shoe. Some thumb grips sit very tight on the hot shoe and take some time to be removed!
I am not using any grip support for my Leica M film cameras.
p.1 #8 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
No accessories here. I hold the camera by the body and lens when shooting. Otherwise it's hanging cross-body.
I suppose if I was using a wrist-strap I'd think differently.
p.1 #9 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
petermendelson wrote:
So I am wondering if many people happily do without any grips on their M camera to keep their kit as compact as possible? If so, do you find it slipping out of your hand on occasion or hurting your hand after using it all day? Do you find it noticeably more difficult to hold the camera steady enough to get sharp photos without a grip?
My experience is the grip (I have the classic Leica M grip, 14405) helps with:
- holding the camera more stable, with long / heavy lenses, especially in portrait-orientation
- holding camera more securely, especially in summer with sweaty fingers - a good thing if you don't use a strap
- getting the camera out of the bag quick
But I have found that without the grip my hand / my fingers wrap around the camera body differently - and in a way that my index finger is more relaxed (less "clampy") - and this helps me push the shutter more fluidly / more smoothly.
It's "nicer" to shoot without the grip, for me.
But it has it's advantages.
I thought it would be good also for carrying the camera around on the side of the body, but that doesn't work well for me (grip is too small, not really "molded" to the hand, so the hand gets very clampy after a short while, and it's not a secure feeling to begin with).
So long story short I can mainly recommend it for shooting portraits with long, heavy lenses (which a Leica M is not at all suited for to begin with, let's be honest), but other than that I'd just use the camera without any grip at all - I still have it, but only mount it when I use the 75mm, or maybe again in summer when it gets really hot / sweaty.
p.1 #10 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
After trying half case, thumb grip, I decided to keep it minimal. I keep this M11 setup with Omnar Pantessa in a small Jordan cross body camera bag, and take it everywhere with me. The retractable IDS thumbgrip is all I need to feel secure. It's much better than traditional thumb grip that sticks out.
p.1 #12 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I am in the firm grip crowd and in the constant re-examination what is the perfect small kit evolution, at this moment it is, M11 EV1, because it lighter than a M11P I have, I like the silk strap because it seems better in the heat than leather, and I have grips, after trying a few I seem to be liking the really right stuff grip because it has the finger groove in front and an arca at the bottom. The finger groove for me is simply better than the others. I have an owl crown thumb rest in the back since it has a pass though in case I want a mini flash but it has been a long time since I bothered. For lenses at the moment I seem to favor a 50 apo summicron, not the smallest but small enough, and as close to perfect as I can get for a nifty 50, and for the character lens a 35 steel rim shown or the LLL 35 mm 8 element. Until the next redesign this it, this gives me the firm hold on the IBIS-less M so I can shoot slower and for me to do so smaller lenses are better, perhaps no larger than the apo summicron.
p.1 #14 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I hold the camera with my right hand and cradle the lens with my left hand using an underhand grip (thumb away from me). This allows me to support the lens and camera with my left hand if need be.
I think some folks might be using an overhand grip with the left hand (thumb and index finger closer to themselves), which means the right hand has to grip the camera more.
But I also favor smaller lenses for the for the M. E.g. the 35/1.4 ASPH pre-FLE or 50mm Summicron are the largest lenses I'd ever want to use.
p.1 #15 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I've shot the M8, the M9, and now the M10 with no hand or thumb grip with zero issues. It hasn't mattered what lens I have on them either. I'm not shooting anything crazy lens-wise on them, but not limited to only super small/lightweight primes.
I also shoot a Q-P and a CL with no grips either. I've never had any issues with stability or hand fatigue shooting any of them this way.
p.1 #17 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I usually use the Leica hand grip with my M11. Occasionally I shoot with it off, but I just find the camera handles more comfortably for me with the grip.
> It's interesting to me how the Leica M is considered such a masterpiece of design whose essential shape hasn't changed in many decades, yet a hand and/or thumb grip is often cited as an essential accessory
Some might say that having the option to tailor the grip to exactly what you individually need is what makes it a good design.
p.1 #18 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
I use the camera without a thumb grip with most lenses on my M10s. A Thumbs Up helps with heavy lenses (sometimes with the 417g 50 Summilux Reissue and generally with most 90s and 135s).
I have found the thumb grip can be uncomfortable when carrying the camera over my shoulder as it protrudes slightly and rubs against my side if I'm wearing light clothing (I'm in Florida). The bare camera just feels better. However, there have been times when the thumb wheel "readjusts" itself by rubbing against my side (or when being put in and out of a snug fit bag) when the camera is bare. It never happens with the thumb grip in place so I use it when carrying the camera in a shoulder bag.
I have the Leica hand grip and medium finger loop which I rarely use and will likely sell.
An Arte De Mano 1/2 case is pretty much permanently installed on my M10-R. It feels and looks good, protects the minty body, and the flip door for battery and card access is sometimes handy.
p.1 #19 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
No grip. I used to have the Leica grip but only because i needed the built-in Arca-Swiss but that thing is never comfortable to me and makes getting the battery out very annoying...but now I have that uber-expensive Owlkrown baseplate (without the grip) because they're the only ones who sell a decent one that fits the M11 that doesn't interfere with the bettery and USB-C. that with the Leica/Cooph rope strap works well for me.
p.1 #20 · Do folks use Leica M cameras "naked" (ie without grips of any kind) and are still happy with the ergonomics?
gordec wrote:
After trying half case, thumb grip, I decided to keep it minimal. I keep this M11 setup with Omnar Pantessa in a small Jordan cross body camera bag, and take it everywhere with me. The retractable IDS thumbgrip is all I need to feel secure. It's much better than traditional thumb grip that sticks out.
what's that lens? i see Skyllaney ... is that a rehoused lens or something?
EDIT: found it.. Omnar Pantessa which is a rehoused Yashica/Zeiss 35/3.5 .. jesus that price.
