25% tariffs put on Japanese products today, effective 8/1. Not a political post at all, but, this obviously impacts us as photographers quite a bit as Voigtlander, Sony, Canon, Nikon, Fuji (among others) all have products coming out of this area. Voigtlander just raised their refreshed 35, 40 and 50 Nokton's, from $800 range to $1,150. I wonder if this increase was made factoring this in or were they only thinking 10%? MAP camera was also a favorite of mine for buying, that will definitely be coming to an end now.
I have not followed Sony/Canon/Fuji lately, have they announced increased prices recently? I know Nikon just had an increase
My assumption is - if you were considering buying Voigtlander, or any other Japanese produced gear, plan to buy in the next few weeks
This will impact both Sigma and Fuji to a great degree. The irony is that Fuji had recently moved production of North American bound cameras, such as the X100vi, from China to Japan in order to avoid very large tariff impacts. All of their GFX gear is made in Japan afaik so this gear will likely see a major price hike soon.
RoamingScott wrote:
Almost nothing from the big 3 is made in Japan anymore (Canon being the biggest exception). I do agree this will impact CV almost immediately.
Most of this is produced in Thailand I believe...which has been threatened with a 36% tariff!
wolfloid wrote:
And the Japanese are compliant US allies. Sickening.
Not compliant enough to make a trade deal with Trump apparently.
In the end I am hopeful this will all work out. But Trump is a bit unpredictable. So, I reserve judgment.
In the mean time I have my eye on possibly adding the new Voigtlander 28mm APO to my lens collection. I may end up having to buy in Europe and claim my VAT refund. I won't pay Trumps ridiculous tariff no matter what.
wolfloid wrote:
And the Japanese are compliant US allies. Sickening.
I just returned from Japan. No U.S. produced cars. You say that is a Japanese preference. OK, agree, but no cars. I didn’t even see a Corvette, Mustang, or Camaro over a three week period. So, Japan has some pretty heavy tariffs on some U.S. products, sickening…right.. Lots of American made cars in Germany…right? I haven’t been for decades, so that is an actual question. I’ve lots of respect for Japan and the Japanese people. The Japanese that I met were quite hospitable. I’ll treat new purchases with a bit more reserve, especially the purchase of expensive equipment. In the end, I’ll complain, maybe buy more on the used market, but my buying patterns won’t change much.
I’ve been out all day, buy usually read some Japanese news via their English websites. They are mentioning that they have been given an extension until August 1st and between now and then Japan will hold some house elections. All in all, sounds like there is still active negotiations going on.
The Japanese buy plenty of iPhones and US services, and are a pretty critical regional ally. As I recall, they already struck a trade deal with Trump back in his first administration. The issue, from my point of view, is how any country could reasonably trust such a mercurial administration.
bwcolor wrote:
I just returned from Japan. No U.S. produced cars. You say that is a Japanese preference. OK, agree, but no cars. I didn’t even see a Corvette, Mustang, or Camaro over a three week period. So, Japan has some pretty heavy tariffs on some U.S. products, sickening…right.. .
To be fair, Japan hasn't had a tariff on US vehicles since the late 70s.
bwcolor wrote:
I just returned from Japan. No U.S. produced cars. You say that is a Japanese preference. OK, agree, but no cars. I didn’t even see a Corvette, Mustang, or Camaro over a three week period. So, Japan has some pretty heavy tariffs on some U.S. products, sickening…right.. Lots of American made cars in Germany…right? I haven’t been for decades, so that is an actual question.
Somewhat silly argument given that the vast majority of Japanese cars sold in the U.S. are made here by U.S. workers. The other sad part of this for Japan is that the current U.S.-Japan Trade agreement to reduce tariffs was created late in Trumps first administration. Talk about being blindsided. The irony is that should this crazy tariff come to pass, it would likely force Japan to sell U.S. treasury bonds. Given that Japan is the largest foreign holder of U.S. Treasury bonds, with over $1 trillion, this would not be so great for the U.S. imo.
Betacamman wrote:
To be fair, Japan hasn't had a tariff on US vehicles since the late 70s.
Interesting.. so it is a resistance to buying foreign made cars. South Korea is much the same with few foreign made cars, but a higher percentage than I saw in Japan. Also, some Chevrolet models are made in South Korea. That being the case, other issues must dominate these decisions, such as the tariffs on rice over 770,000 metric tons, also Trump previously raised import quotas on Japanese cars to 25% and steel at 50%. Regardless, I doubt that we have seen the final numbers since negotiations are still ongoing Tariq Gibran wrote:
Somewhat silly argument given that the vast majority of Japanese cars sold in the U.S. are made here by U.S. workers. The other sad part of this for Japan is that the current U.S.-Japan Trade agreement to reduce tariffs was created late in Trumps first administration. Talk about being blindsided. The irony is that should this crazy tariff come to pass, it would likely force Japan to sell U.S. treasury bonds. Given that Japan is the largest foreign holder of U.S. Treasury bonds, with over $1 trillion, this would not be so great for the U.S. imo.
Agreed.. Japan has for decades been manufacturing in the United States and it would be a shock to economy should Japan withdraw from the US Treasury Bond market. Ryosei Akazawa, Japan’s chief tariff negotiator, is tough and well respected, so we will see how this ends.
bwcolor wrote:
Interesting.. so it is a resistance to buying foreign made cars. South Korea is much the same with few foreign made cars, but a higher percentage than I saw in Japan. Also, some Chevrolet models are made in South Korea. That being the case, other issues must dominate these decisions, such as the tariffs on rice over 770,000 metric tons, also Trump previously raised import quotas on Japanese cars to 25% and steel at 50%. Regardless, I doubt that we have seen the final numbers since negotiations are still ongoing
Japan has a long history of growing it's own rice. Just like the U.S. and it's protection of farmers and domestically grown agricultural products (we famously protect our farmers and agricultural industries through subsidies and tariffs), seems fair for other countries to do the same maybe?
bwcolor wrote:
Interesting.. so it is a resistance to buying foreign made cars. South Korea is much the same with few foreign made cars, but a higher percentage than I saw in Japan. Also, some Chevrolet models are made in South Korea. That being the case, other issues must dominate these decisions, such as the tariffs on rice over 770,000 metric tons, also Trump previously raised import quotas on Japanese cars to 25% and steel at 50%. Regardless, I doubt that we have seen the final numbers since negotiations are still ongoing
The car thing may be as simple as US car manufactures are not export focused and do not make right had drive cars in the U.S.. Like the UK, Japan drives on the left side of the road.
US owned car manufactures have at various time tackled these issues by taking large minority stakes in Japanese car companies. One must dig a bit to understand the true nature of these kinds of issues.
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Japan has a long history of growing it's own rice. Just like the U.S. and it's protection of farmers and domestically grown agricultural products (we famously protect our farmers and agricultural industries through subsidies and tariffs), seems fair for other countries to do the same maybe?
All true and it is also true that Japan treats rice imports the same, regardless of which country is exporting the rice to Japan. So, behind closed doors the actual vs public issues are discussed. I suspect that Trump believes that there is a premium to access U.S. markets, but then again, I thought that was the basis for 10%.
Right now, what makes things difficult is the uncertainty and inability to plan, so there is real pressure to get this done fast.
Back to camera gear: I'm in Canada and have been hopeful that prices here would remain relatively stable if the US actually implements tariffs such as 25% on Japanese-made goods. Of the brands that interest me, and that would be affected by significant tariffs in the US, they have offices in Canada that apparently import directly from Japan. However, sources have suggested that some companies might float prices in Canada to keep relative track with tariff-impacted prices in the US, for whatever ridiculous reasons. Even if someone from the US were to buy at the unchanged price in Canada, they'd pay the relevant tariff rate on import to the US (assuming it's done by the book). I'd really like these companies to give up the apparent need/desire to keep MSRP prices very close from country to country if they insist on using US MSRP as the baseline. That maybe worked before, prior to all these tariffs. But now it looks like impacts from the tariffs may affect markets outside the US, and potentially significantly.
At least in respect to Voigtlander lenses here, the new f/1.2 trio appear to be priced consistently with the previous versions, if not even slightly lower, surprisingly. So at least the Voigtlander importer appears to be resisting the urge to take advantage of the US tariff threats to inflate prices. At least for now.
rscheffler wrote:
Back to camera gear: I'm in Canada and have been hopeful that prices here would remain relatively stable if the US actually implements tariffs such as 25% on Japanese-made goods. Of the brands that interest me, and that would be affected by significant tariffs in the US, they have offices in Canada that apparently import directly from Japan. However, sources have suggested that some companies might float prices in Canada to keep relative track with tariff-impacted prices in the US, for whatever ridiculous reasons. Even if someone from the US were to buy at the unchanged price in Canada, they'd pay the relevant tariff rate on import to the US (assuming it's done by the book). I'd really like these companies to give up the apparent need/desire to keep MSRP prices very close from country to country if they insist on using US MSRP as the baseline. That maybe worked before, prior to all these tariffs. But now it looks like impacts from the tariffs may affect markets outside the US, and potentially significantly.
At least in respect to Voigtlander lenses here, the new f/1.2 trio appear to be priced consistently with the previous versions, if not even slightly lower, surprisingly. So at least the Voigtlander importer appears to be resisting the urge to take advantage of the US tariff threats to inflate prices. At least for now....Show more →
If Canadian prices are tied to the U.S. - even for manufacturers that import directly into Canada - the other possible negative impact on price could be the recent and dramatic decline in the value of the U.S. dollar. Combine this with tariffs and at some point, the argument becomes even stronger to decouple U.S. MSRP prices from those of other countries.
Sell US treasury bonds and replace with what? Gold? Bunds? There is no alternative to US Treasury bonds today and no other security has the same liquidity. Mass selling of US Treasury bonds is mutually assured destruction - the holder will suffer as well, not just the issuer.
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Somewhat silly argument given that the vast majority of Japanese cars sold in the U.S. are made here by U.S. workers. The other sad part of this for Japan is that the current U.S.-Japan Trade agreement to reduce tariffs was created late in Trumps first administration. Talk about being blindsided. The irony is that should this crazy tariff come to pass, it would likely force Japan to sell U.S. treasury bonds. Given that Japan is the largest foreign holder of U.S. Treasury bonds, with over $1 trillion, this would not be so great for the U.S. imo.
Silver lining: rather than endless upgrade cycles, we can focus more on using the existing equipment for longer.
rsolti13 wrote:
25% tariffs put on Japanese products today, effective 8/1. Not a political post at all, but, this obviously impacts us as photographers quite a bit as Voigtlander, Sony, Canon, Nikon, Fuji (among others) all have products coming out of this area. Voigtlander just raised their refreshed 35, 40 and 50 Nokton's, from $800 range to $1,150. I wonder if this increase was made factoring this in or were they only thinking 10%? MAP camera was also a favorite of mine for buying, that will definitely be coming to an end now.
I have not followed Sony/Canon/Fuji lately, have they announced increased prices recently? I know Nikon just had an increase
My assumption is - if you were considering buying Voigtlander, or any other Japanese produced gear, plan to buy in the next few weeks...Show more →
Jaree wrote:
Sell US treasury bonds and replace with what? Gold? Bunds? There is no alternative to US Treasury bonds today and no other security has the same liquidity. Mass selling of US Treasury bonds is mutually assured destruction - the holder will suffer as well, not just the issuer.
If Japan were pushed into that corner (hopefully they will not be), they might use the proceeds to purchase their own currency which would further decrease the value of the U.S. dollar and confidence in U.S. debt. Depending on how much they sold, it certainly could have very negative effects globally and also increase the cost of Japanese exports to the U.S.
1bwana1 wrote:
The car thing may be as simple as US car manufactures are not export focused and do not make right had drive cars in the U.S.. Like the UK, Japan drives on the left side of the road.
US owned car manufactures have at various time tackled these issues by taking large minority stakes in Japanese car companies. One must dig a bit to understand the true nature of these kinds of issues.
So do we and we’re flooded with giant stupid American trucks now. They don’t fit in any car space here properly but the local bogans (rednecks) love them. We’re also the largest market for Toyota Lancruisers (including the real one not the Prado the US gets and the 70 series) in the world.
Likely the issue is as simple as cost and size. It costs a lot to ship vehicles all over the world. Japan makes a shit ton of vehicles already. Enough to send all over the word. Imported vehicles just cost more than what you can get locally. Also, generally their local vehicles are much much smaller than many other countries. They have no interest in something as big as an F150 or even a Mustang. A camry is a big car in Japan.
