p.4 #1 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
1bwana1 wrote:
The very last? I am honored. Oh but it wasn't a lecture, I was just pointing out that the prediction was accurate. You confirmed that. You notice that I didn't even include your post in the quote, yet you feel it was about you. It was not about just you, but a series of posts that fulfilled the prediction . But thanks for volunteering. Why get so personal and so upset?
You can twist it any way you want, if we don't know much about OP, we certainly know a lot about you.
If I were you, one term I would definitely avoid in Nikon forum, predictability, because, you are so predictable here..
p.4 #2 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
cvrle59 wrote:
You can twist it any way you want, if we don't know much about OP, we certainly know a lot about you.
If I were you, one term I would definitely avoid in Nikon forum, predictability, because, you are so predictable here..
Well I hope I am predictable in the sense that I am consistent. Even though I know that is not your intent, I don't take offence at the compliment.
But now you admit that you don't know much about the OP. Yet he was slandered, accused, labeled, and assigned bad intent As it is now abundantly clear incorrectly and without evidence. If one is predictable in doing that it is not a compliment that is for sure. I would think people might want to apologize to him rather than double down on this poor behaviour. But I predict you won't step up and do that that. Please prove me wrong.
p.4 #3 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
woof2025 wrote:
Wow, I had no idea that a slight focus issue would be seen as a hand grenade? You guys are really sensitive!
If only it was just a slight focus issue - unfortunately it's just symptomatic of the many issues that have resulted in Nikon loosing massive market share over the past few years.
Lots of sensitivity about that but generally only from a small group of vocal hobbyists, most of whom you can safely ignore. It's pretty easy to tell who they are because:
- they won't offer any useful advice, they will tell you that pro cameras don't just work straight out of the box, it takes years of study to figure out the intricacies of the system, point and shoot is no good just not enough control for a real pro ()
- they will accuse you of being a troll
- they will accuse you of being a Sony/Canon fan threatened by the superiority of the Nikon lenses (yeah I know right !!)
- they will tell you to pick the lens first as that's the only really import thing and as everyone knows Nikon lenses are superior
- they will tell you that Nikon have the best software development teams and keep improving their cameras by adding new features via firmware updates (v5 and still not fixed the AF but instead v5.1 adds some useless video feature - yeah I know anyone else would see the writing on the wall right!)
- they will tell you that next year Nikon will be releasing Z9m2 with a new hardware platform (or maybe just a firmware upgrade) with global shutter, infinite DR and AI subject detection and will become the dominant brand (as if that will somehow help take in focus images today !!)
Anyway good luck with the A7r5 - I loved the D850 and the A7r5 is the first camera I would consider a true upgrade to the D850 in terms of both image quality (resolution/DR) and usability (AF system).
p.4 #4 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
I'll be the first to admit I was wrong. So: "I'm sorry Woof2025."
However, its sadly commonplace -- on the internet in general, not just the Nikon forum on FM, that people make sock accounts, drop a nugget/thread somewhere to watch the masses fight it out and bask in the argument they've created.
Why do people do this? Human nature. People invest a lot of money in gear and possess greed and envy over other products that might be better than what they have. People also like drama. Drama sells.
This isn't a stretch and isn't a unique phenomenon only known to the FM Nikon forum.
p.4 #5 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
1bwana1 wrote:
Well I hope I am predictable in the sense that I am consistent. Even though I know that is not your intent, I don't take offence at the compliment.
But now you admit that you don't know much about the OP. Yet he was slandered, accused, labeled, and assigned bad intent As it is now abundantly clear incorrectly and without evidence. If one is predictable in doing that it is not a compliment that is for sure. I would think people might want to apologize to him rather than double down on this poor behaviour. But I predict you won't step up and do that that. Please prove me wrong....Show more →
It's not abundantly clear at this point. Only time will tell. Put a note on your calendar, and I will on mine and lets review the evidencein 6 mos.
p.4 #6 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
cmm1398 wrote:
I'll be the first to admit I was wrong. So: "I'm sorry Woof2025."
However, its sadly commonplace -- on the internet in general, not just the Nikon forum on FM, that people make sock accounts, drop a nugget/thread somewhere to watch the masses fight it out and bask in the argument they've created.
Why do people do this? Human nature. People invest a lot of money in gear and possess greed and envy over other products that might be better than what they have. People also like drama. Drama sells.
This isn't a stretch and isn't a unique phenomenon only known to the FM Nikon forum. ...Show more →
Thanks, that's very kind and decent of you to say.
p.4 #7 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
1bwana1 wrote:
Those kinds of posts were predicted. They view it as you made them behave badly, so it is still your fault. Even the bratiest of children can't get away with that kind of statement in most homes.
But, please be aware that is not the majority of people here on FM. It is a small group with bad PTSD. Look at all the sincere post by people trying to help. Welcome to FM.
p.4 #8 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
woof2025 wrote:
Thanks, yes it hasn't been the warmest welcome! I was quite amazed when I did my initial post and came back to the comments! It was like, I posted that 20 hours ago, I wonder what helpful advice people have for me! Seems while I was away I got put on some kind of a Nikon Terrorist list!
It is unfortunate you have had this experience and I am sure legitimate members of this board will join me in apologising for any offence given. The reality is that this board has become a pretty weird place, frequently overrun by a small number intent on promoting alternate camera platforms, usually Sony and making sweeping personal attacks on Nikon users. Although I do note one particularly nasty post in this thread characterising us as all as retired old fools visiting the canyon once a year has now been deleted.
That said, since you are already in the Sony mirrorless ecosystem, I feel another Sony body for stills is the right choice for you. Using adapted F mount and e mount lenses is not ideal. And buying into the Z mount alongside the e mount makes no financial sense. The Sony system is a great system.
But the Nikon system is fine too. I do not subscribe to it being complex. I just use auto area with subject id in both video and stills. Particularly in video (80% of my usage) the subject detection, eye AF and tracking I find to work very well, even shooting through foliage. Apart from the opening sequence, the brief clips clips below were shot using an 800mm lens, wide open, close in so DOF is minimal. Watch in 8k if you have the bandwidth.
I did have a brief time with the A1 but it does not have oversampled 4k/60 and neither does it have eye AF in video so it did not work out for me. I expect the mk11 version has addressed these issues along with other improvements.
I am an old retired fool and cannot afford multiple bodies so the one body has to do it all internally up to 8.3k/60 as well as 120 fps stills, internal GPS etc. etc.
p.4 #9 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
Alistair1 wrote:
The reality is that this board has become a pretty weird place, frequently overrun by a small number intent on promoting alternate camera platforms, usually Sony and making sweeping personal attacks on Nikon users.
p.4 #10 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
Note that the Sony A7RV has a >100ms readout speed, which means it can do AF calculations at most 10 times per second. I'm not sure about portraits, but I know people who tried it for sports and had a very difficult time.
p.4 #11 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
I see from time to time, somebody complain about eyelash, eyebrow focus so for benefit of the doubt, they do have that problem for sure. Also many many people denied having this problem at all. I am in the second camp and never understood why such discrepancy.
I certainly dont do anything esoteric with AF setting, eye detection on, human subject, if single person, auto area works perfectly well, if I want to choose a person myself among few people in the frame, wide area-L or S and that takes care of everything.
A side note, just yesterday, I was shooting buffy fish owl at a distance and the bird filled may be 15% of the frame at 560mm. There was a tiny branch a few inches in front of its face that I could barely see with my own eyes. It was too far for eye detection to work but focus square was on the face. I found that with my Z9, the focus was actually on the branch in front of the bird in most pictures using wide area-L. Funny enough, a friend who was right next to me, shooting A1 ii and 600GM, complained about exactly the same thing. She has been shooting A1 since its inception and got her A1 ii in November and used A9, A9 ii before that and knows what works for her A1 very well.
p.4 #12 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
woof2025 wrote:
Thanks, yes it hasn't been the warmest welcome! I was quite amazed when I did my initial post and came back to the comments! It was like, I posted that 20 hours ago, I wonder what helpful advice people have for me! Seems while I was away I got put on some kind of a Nikon Terrorist list!
Apologies for the comments, glad to see you are a real person.
My advise, in decreasing order of importance:
- Use your lenses as open as possible, f1.2 provides the best AF performance
- Use AF-C in Focus + Release mode (setting a1)
- Set setting a3 to the lower possible value (highest possible reactivity) of 1 and use erratic
- Use custom AF area with subject recognition limited to people (other types of subjects not selected), that's in the Photo shooting menu under "AF subject detection options"
- Deactivate IBIS if you don't really need it
- Set your EVF View mode to adjust foe use of viewing when possible (not setting reflected), setting d9
- When possible, shoot in short bursts instead of single shot. It provides a lot more data for the camera to get one absolutely perfect. All Sony bodies I tried also performed better this way as well.
p.4 #13 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
bernardl wrote:
Apologies for the comments, glad to see you are a real person.
My advise:
- Use your lenses as open as possible, f1.2 provides the best AF performance
- Use custom AF area with subject recognition limited to people
- Set the interruption setting to the lower possible value (highest possible reactivity)
- Shoot in short bursts instead of single shot
- Set your EVF mode to natural (not setting reflected)
- Desactivate IBIS if you don't really need it
Cheers,
Bernard
Respect for owning it Bernard. I predicted that would be the case as well. You are an honorable and sincere guy in my experience.
p.4 #14 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
duncangr wrote:
- they will tell you that next year Nikon will be releasing Z9m2 with a new hardware platform (or maybe just a firmware upgrade) with global shutter, infinite DR and AI subject detection and will become the dominant brand (as if that will somehow help take in focus images today !!)
The Z9II will most probably come this year.
No idea where you got those specs though, I think you are a bit over optimistic.
What I think the Z9II is going to be is:
- Same resolution as the Z9
- Slightly smaller/lighter body (10% difference at most)
- Either same sensor or one with an even faster readout speed
- New Expeed 8 probably 2 to 4 times faster than Expeed 7 with similar power consumption
- New EVF
- CF4.0 compatibility
- Red technology partially implemented (at least Red Raw)
p.4 #15 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
bernardl wrote:
The Z9II will most probably come this year.
No idea where you got those specs though, I think you are a bit over optimistic.
What I think the Z9II is going to be is:
- Same resolution as the Z9
- Slightly smaller/lighter body (10% difference at most)
- Either same sensor or one with an even faster readout speed
- New Expeed 8 probably 2 to 4 times faster than Expeed 7 with similar power consumption
- New EVF
- CF4.0 compatibility
- Red technology partially implemented (at least Red Raw)
Cheers,
Bernard
That would be an impressive camera and a more significant upgrade than we got with the A1II.
p.4 #16 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
suteetat wrote:
I see from time to time, somebody complain about eyelash, eyebrow focus so for benefit of the doubt, they do have that problem for sure. Also many many people denied having this problem at all. I am in the second camp and never understood why such discrepancy.
I certainly dont do anything esoteric with AF setting, eye detection on, human subject, if single person, auto area works perfectly well, if I want to choose a person myself among few people in the frame, wide area-L or S and that takes care of everything.
A side note, just yesterday, I was shooting buffy fish owl at a distance and the bird filled may be 15% of the frame at 560mm. There was a tiny branch a few inches in front of its face that I could barely see with my own eyes. It was too far for eye detection to work but focus square was on the face. I found that with my Z9, the focus was actually on the branch in front of the bird in most pictures using wide area-L. Funny enough, a friend who was right next to me, shooting A1 ii and 600GM, complained about exactly the same thing. She has been shooting A1 since its inception and got her A1 ii in November and used A9, A9 ii before that and knows what works for her A1 very well.
What do you think is causing this issue for some users and why the discrepancy for others? (If you had to guess)
I've seen chatter about the Z8/Z9 focusing on eyelashes for many months. I'm new to the Z8 and this "focus issue" made me hesitate in purchasing one in the first place. It always worried me as I shoot with a lot of fast (f1.2-f2) lenses at close distances. I don't have any fast portrait lenses to test it yet but I'm just curious what the theory is behind the issue and if it's something that can be fixed for those who experience it.
p.4 #17 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
AlphaPhotography wrote:
What do you think is causing this issue for some users and why the discrepancy for others? (If you had to guess)
I've seen chatter about the Z8/Z9 focusing on eyelashes for many months. I'm new to the Z8 and this "focus issue" made me hesitate in purchasing one in the first place. It always worried me as I shoot with a lot of fast (f1.2-f2) lenses at close distances. I don't have any fast portrait lenses to test it yet but I'm just curious what the theory is behind the issue and if it's something that can be fixed for those who experience it....Show more →
I can't really tell you honestly. I have 85/1.2s, 50/1.2s, 135/1.8 Plena, a whole bunch of manual lenses between 35-90mm, all f1.2 to f2 using Techart M to Z mount autofocus adapter, 58/1.4G, 200/2 VR ii and sure, on rare occasion, I may have one or two pictures where the eye is not in perfect focus but from full body to tight portrait range, lots of street photography, eyelash/eyebrow issue is never a concern, not even a little. I use both AF-S and AF-C mode, single shot as well as burst.
Over the years, I have been shooting Nikon, Sony, Leica SL, Fuji GFX but over time, gravitate to mostly Nikon and GFX system. If eyebrow/eyelash is as bad as someone else's claim, I would have ended up with other system instead of Nikon for sure. Of course I am not saying that those that have problem is not real but for whatever reason, I don't share that problem.
p.4 #20 · After testing Z8 and having focus issues I may go to the Sony A7RV
woof2025 wrote:
You guys need to get out more.
Now that we have all the emotion out of this thread, here is some information that should help. Some of it may have already been mentioned, but I’m not going back through all the posts.
First, the Z8 is not like the D850 with respect to autofocus. It’s more complex and flexible with respect to AF. That flexibility provides a wide range of photography capability, but you need to understand what AF options to use and when. The Z8 is not a smartphone “point and shoot”.
Second, you need to understand when to use the various options so you can set the camera up to the type of photography at hand - portrait, sports, dance. fashion, etc.
Third, you need to practice quickly changing AF modes and AF features so you can adapt to the photography you want to shoot.
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