p.2 #2 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Why do you think it is $46? For a start it won’t fit on the 7D without an adapter. Mirror lenses tend to be the cheapest and worst-performing lenses made. They give ugly bokeh, if you know what that is.
Once again you are just looking for the cheapest gear but don’t know enough about that gear. You would be better off buying a camera with a fixed lens that lets you both manual focus and auto focus.
Kalimar was an import company of low-to-fair quality Japanese lenses, mostly in the 60's and 70's. The T-mount needed can be had at B&H for $15. And that leaves you with no mechanical/electronic linkage between the two. I've tested similar lenses and found the resulting photos disappointing. Even better quality 500's, such as Sigma, Nikon, and Tamron, are not ideal when it comes to bird photography (I've owned all of them at one time or the other).
Mirror lenses for this price will be iffy at best. You're stuck with f/8, and will likely have lots of donut-style rings under a lot of conditions, especially shooting into the light. Focus will be difficult, and you're likely to be disappointed with results.
I've bought lots of equipment from Roberts, and they're a really good dealer; and they stand by their products. But, what you're going to get for $46, just isn't worth the money.
Now, if your dead set on buying a 500 mirror lens, find a Tamron 500mm f/8 55B. It's a good quality lens, and can be had for just a bit more than the Kalimar. It uses the same T-mount.
p.2 #5 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
That is a great price for a 7D! The 7D was my first DSLR and is still the camera I use today…so I’m probably biased, but I think it’s a great choice.
That Kalimar mirror lens is probably of very poor quality—just about any of the other lenses that you’ve found or that folks have suggested to you will almost certainly be better. If you want the cheapest lens possible, I’d go for the Tamron 400mm f/6.9 or Tamron 60-300mm you linked in your first post (plus adapter) before a generic mirror lens like that Kalimar. If you want a mirror lens, spend a little more for one made by Tamron or Nikon (plus adapter). And if you’re willing to spend more and are open to lenses other than mirror lenses, a Canon EF-S 55–250mm STM or Canon EF 70-300mm IS USM is going to be tough to beat. Or, if you want something offbeat, any 300m f/4.5 in your price range (e.g. Nikon or Olympus + adapter) or any version of the Tokina 400mm f/5.6 (with adapter if manual focus) is probably worth considering. And while I doubt it’s the highest-quality option that fits your budget, the Tamron 200-400mm is probably a better choice than that Kalimar mirror lens too (at the very least, it’s a stop faster and has autofocus!).
p.2 #6 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Based on what usedphotopro has in stock right now, I'd suggest that mint condition Samyang 500mm f8 Mirror Lens. It's probably much newer than the Kalimar lens. The glass and coatings are going to be better quality and better condition. You'll need a "T-mount" (threaded telescope mount) to "EF-mount" (Canon auto focus mount) adapter such as this Fotodiox. I don't see any of these on usedphotopro today. I'd expect to pay ~$15-20 for the adapter.
p.2 #7 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
To me, that Samyang 500mm f/8 looks identical to the Kalimar, just with different branding! So I disagree that OP could expect it to be any better...and even if it isn't identical, I don't think that it would be a good choice either. Here's a review of the Samyang—the quality of the sample images is pretty poor! A Kalimar, Samyang, or other cheap, generic mirror lens might get the job done for OP if the goal is merely for the lens to be a birding companion and image quality doesn't matter as much as low price, light weight, or compact size. But if OP wants high-quality images, I'd recommend pretty much anything else—even if it means giving up some reach (e.g. going for a 250–300mm lens instead of a 400–600mm) or going for a bridge camera instead of a DSLR.
Roberts/UsedPhotoPro is a good seller, but OP should look for gear at other shops too! KEH is always worth checking, and there are lots of great local/regional dealers that sell used equipment. I've had great experiences with National Camera Exchange, and they currently have a used Tokina RMC 400mm f/5.6 like the one OP linked a few posts back—and for a better price, too (~$40 vs. ~$90). And they also have several used Nikon D300s, a couple of Canon 40Ds, a Canon 50D, and a couple Canon 7Ds. If OP wants to try a DSLR with a manual focus supertele, I'd suggest they grab that lens and any of those bodies (plus a Nikon F lens to Canon EOS body adapter if choosing a Canon body—NatCam has one of those too). There might even be room left in OP's budget for a used Canon 55–250mm STM or Nikon 55–300mm if they'd enjoy having a decent long zoom with autofocus and image stabilization...or, OP could buy either of those lenses instead of the 400mm and not have to deal with manual focus!
There are some reviews of the Tokina RMC 400mm f/5.6 at Pentaxforums, and based on those reviews, it strikes me as a decent choice—and certainly much better than a cheap mirror lens! Two folks compare the Tokina to Pentax's own 400mm f/5.6 from the same era and rate the Tokina's sharpness only a little behind—so, while it may not be the best supertele ever, it hardly sounds bad (especially for <$100)—and the sample images clearly show that folks successfully use (or have used) the Tokina 400mm to make nice images of birds and that it produces images with much nicer bokeh than a mirror lens. Its faster aperture compared to most mirror lenses (f/5.6 vs. f/8) is a big advantage too, IMO.
p.2 #8 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Hello, after a series of unexpected events I end up buying a Nikon D5300 so this part of my conundrum has been solved.
Now the lens part is to be resolved. I prefer a 400mm and don´t care if its manual focus. Discarded the mirror lenses. My budget is $100-120.
p.2 #9 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Congrats on getting a camera!
Unfortunately, the Nikon D5300 is one of the Nikon bodies that does not provide full functionality with all Nikon-mount lenses: it will not meter with manual lenses, and it will not autofocus with lenses that have screw drive autofocus. IMO, you absolutely need metering (especially for bird photography, and especially since you’re a beginner), so you should not consider manual lenses to be an option anymore.* Thus, I would advise you not to buy either of the Novoflexes you linked. (Both of those Novoflexes are also missing critical parts, so it would be inadvisable to purchase them for that reason too.)
In order to get metering with the D5300, you will need an autofocus-capable lens. For a 400mm (or longer) lens under $120, your best bet is probably either the Tokina AT-X 400mm f/5.6 or Tamron 200–400mm f/5.6. The only other two possibilities I'm aware of are the Sigma 500mm f/7.2 and Cosina/Phoenix/Promaster/Tokina/Vivitar/etc. 100–400mm f/4.5–6.7; they may be worth considering too, but I'd prefer either the Tamron or Tokina for their faster maximum aperture. You should be aware that third-party lenses don't always meter properly on Nikons, so while I think any of these lenses should work fine for you, I can't guarantee it (while I'm trying to give you the best advice I can, we've reached the limit of what I know...). Unfortunately, all of these lenses have screw drive autofocus—which, as I mentioned above, will not work on the D5300—so you’ll have to focus them manually...but you've made it clear you don't mind manual focus, so hopefully one of these options will work out fine for you!
*It was once possible to modify manual lenses to provide metering on lower-end Nikon bodies by gluing a CPU chip (called a Dandelion AF chip) to them that would cause the camera to treat the lens like an autofocus lens...but it appears as though those chips may no longer be available. If you wanted to try to purchase one, the eBay seller andreykuryanov would be the person to contact. And installing a CPU chip can be tricky, so I would recommend paying a professional to do it. I'd ballpark the cost of the chip + installation at $60 minimum (possibly more); add that to the cost of a lens, and your total cost is going to be comparable to a lens with autofocus... Given the complication and cost, I don't recommend that you go this route—IMO, finding an autofocus lens for your camera is going to be the easier and better option!
or this one: https://www.ebay.com/itm/386286409342?hash=item59f076d67e:g:x~4AAOSwrvtlVTHZ&amdata=enc%3AAQAIAAAA0BcpJg%2BQIcIxAzvKi9GuF6xzCcEBe4f3N3kE06ibt3GCtOWoQCIA%2Fz2g3XuxynD%2FYjIbP5mVPZc3gVnKjEwgc0qTTpmC8QmsEY5tRivARY6Gh3%2Botvj6pndl0J%2BQQ5UMPeOSf%2B44pyub%2FaExvbw7RvdgBz4NMrtuB964tz3x8MO5lAaMwU0mWnYiRFcWm2Mmtro6i1AfGHqtkhi4Y7wJVTaoPXXZA9uMBpX4pJ9izxm6F3N7kFUF%2FAuUJ8R1riTc8IYaztK8wQNoB%2Fbc7ha1g24%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR9ql7_OIYw
p.2 #11 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Or this one, or this one? Note that in the description of that last one it says As is, no returns
despite it saying otherwise elsewhere.
You could have bought a new, or used in great condition, point & shoot, or compact camera with a 400mm equivalent lens already attached with both MF and AF for $400 or so.
Too late now, so good luck getting a compatible lens that works with your body, neither of which will have any warranty.
p.2 #12 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
I think you should ask yourself two questions:
1) Would you rather buy a lens from a reputable dealer with a good return policy (KEH), or from eBay? Both have their advantages and disadvantages, and I’ve personally had good and bad experiences with both, so there’s no right answer here. But FWIW, the particular lenses you’ve linked on eBay are ones I’d stay away from—not because I think they’re bad lenses, but because they strike me as being sold by folks who really don’t know what they’re selling or how to properly assess its condition, and so it feels like buying either would be something of a gamble. Maybe you’ll get a deal, maybe you’ll get a paperweight! I’d rather not take that chance myself, but some folks are happy to—are you one of them?
2) What functionality do you want in the lens? For example, if you were deciding between the Tamron 200-400mm and the Tokina 80-400mm, do you feel it’s important to have the 80-200mm range? If so, get the Tokina! Would you prefer a push-pull zoom? Then the Tamron’s the lens for you! Etc. I really cannot tell you what you should prefer. And I don’t know enough about these lenses to have an opinion on which is better!
Don’t buy the Tokina SD 400mm f/5.6—it won’t meter on your camera. If you wanted a Tokina 400mm prime, you’d need the AT-X version.
p.2 #13 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Users keep giving the OP good advice, and he just keeps ignoring it. Used modern kit telephoto AF lenses like Olympus 40-150mm f/4-5.6 cost $50 but he wants a DSLR without IBIS and a $120 vintage manual focus lens? What a waste of time, and money too.
p.2 #14 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Yes, the OP should have put some time and effort into learning about gear and compatibility issues before just going out believing the cheapest gear will work for him.
p.2 #15 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
OP certainly has not given us much to go on to help us understand their choice—it would be nice to hear more about their reasoning! But I can think of several reasons one might see a DSLR and manual lens kit as desirable (though I am of course biased, having bought and used such a kit myself), and since OP has made it clear that that is the approach they want to take, it seems more helpful to me to try to guide them in making the best choice within their parameters than to criticize them.
FWIW, I would hardly consider an Olympus body + 40–150mm a desirable starter kit for birding—personally, I’d prefer a DSLR + cheap 400mm lens myself! And I’d agree that it seems like OP could have put more effort into learning about what they were buying, but we don’t know their circumstances or who else they may have been getting advice from. It is hard not to feel like they’ve ignored good advice, though: Imagemaster’s suggestion of a bridge camera, runamuck’s suggestion of spending more on the lens than the camera, and AmbientMike’s suggestion of a shorter lens with autofocus were all very sensible…and I stand by the advice I gave re: manual lenses and bodies on which to use them if that is really what OP wanted.
I certainly hope OP enjoys their new camera and whatever lens they end up with…but if they don’t, then at least they’re buying cheap used gear that shouldn’t lose too much value if they decide to trade it for something else!
p.2 #16 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
I've read all the messages in this thread carefully and I appreciate the time and effort you guys put on those.
I agree that a should educate myself about the subject.
I used to have a bridge camera, several bird watchers in my community use them, they take great photos, specially the nikon 900/950/1000, are easy to use, has super long reach, really good option. But it feels to me a little too 'serial production' pictures. So after seeing a few youtube videos of people using old lenses for bird photography It struck me as a good idea, like some artisanal chore, more artistic.
The camera choice was unexpected, I contacted a girl who offered it in a bird watchers whats-app group, and she needed the money urgently for her son's health issues, so I bought it with no second thought.
p.2 #17 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
I think you could have gotten a bridge camera or a modern body/lens combination and apply a more "old school" or "artistic" look in post-processing. Modern cameras also have many in-camera settings for JPEG output such as picture modes or "art filters" (e.g. Grainy Film, Instant Film, Pinhole, Soft Focus, Cross Process, etc.) which would have easily given you any look you desired, without the "chore" of an old manual focus lens.
p.2 #18 · Super cheap telephoto (and camera) for bird photography
Thanks for giving us more insight into your reasoning, @carlosriaga! Your thinking sounds quite relatable to me! It can be very satisfying to do things differently in a way that takes skill, and manual focus can be a fun challenge that encourages you to approach your photography in a different way (though I think a kit with good autofocus would ultimately give you more creative freedom). I'd be curious to hear how you enjoy the experience of using your new camera once you've had some time to get used to it—please let us know how it goes!
I would also be curious to watch the YouTube videos you mentioned of folks using old lenses for birding—would you mind sharing the links?
As for the lens, I generally would be inclined to steer you toward a prime over a zoom (as I said previously), but I can't encourage you to spend beyond your means or skip Christmas presents! Only you can decide what choice makes sense for you and your situation...
