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Archive 2023How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
p.1 #1How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
I recently was gifted a santa sack of old, manky, expired film. As far as I can tell, some of it is 30 years old. It was 'appropriately' stored in a damp, warm basement.
So of course I'm gonna use it! What caught my eye was this one roll that had '20 shot' written on it. So my friend shot half of it 20 years ago, and then never developed it! The appropriate thing would be to toss it in the trash, because conventional wisdom and Kodak say to develop soon after exposure.
I think 20 years is soon enough. In the interest of science and me not having a social life, I shot the remainder of the roll to see how 20 year old images on 20 year old film would compare to shot yesterday images on that same 20 year old film.
The film in question, loaded into my professional Ricoh FF1 aka Sears Mini 35 to finish shooting the roll:
A couple of the images shot 20 years ago, but developed yesterday (they all looked like this):
My images shot over the last few days, on the same roll of film. I rated it at ISO 100 vs 200 that the film suggests. I did not adjust saturation. My only adjustments were to colour balance based on the unexposed strip per negativelabpro's recommendations:
So of course I'm gonna use it! What caught my eye was this one roll that had '20 shot' written on it. So my friend shot half of it 20 years ago, and then never developed it! The appropriate thing would be to toss it in the trash, because conventional wisdom and Kodak say to develop soon after exposure.
I think 20 years is soon enough. In the interest of science and me not having a social life, I shot the remainder of the roll to see how 20 year old images on 20 year old film would compare to shot yesterday images on that same 20 year old film.
The film in question, loaded into my professional Ricoh FF1 aka Sears Mini 35 to finish shooting the roll:
A couple of the images shot 20 years ago, but developed yesterday (they all looked like this):
My images shot over the last few days, on the same roll of film. I rated it at ISO 100 vs 200 that the film suggests. I did not adjust saturation. My only adjustments were to colour balance based on the unexposed strip per negativelabpro's recommendations:
Nov 18, 2023 at 02:43 PM
p.1 #2How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
My takeaway? I'm kinda shocked those 20 yr old pics resolved, let alone that good! There has been a colour shift, and the grain is I'm sure more pronounced than it would have been, but still. I think those look great.
What is interesting is I think the 20 yr old pics did better than the freshly shot ones on the same roll. Mine look grainier and with weirder colours. It seems that fresh light on ancient film yields a very different result than ancient light on ancient film developed twenty years later!
I actually really like some of the results. Yeah, there is no control but, for example, the back of that stop sign? Love the weird colours and drama. The problem is who knows how the next rolls will turn out? Then again, that's the fun!
I just shot a roll of 30 year old TriX from that batch. Rated at 400. It is drying...
What is interesting is I think the 20 yr old pics did better than the freshly shot ones on the same roll. Mine look grainier and with weirder colours. It seems that fresh light on ancient film yields a very different result than ancient light on ancient film developed twenty years later!
I actually really like some of the results. Yeah, there is no control but, for example, the back of that stop sign? Love the weird colours and drama. The problem is who knows how the next rolls will turn out? Then again, that's the fun!
I just shot a roll of 30 year old TriX from that batch. Rated at 400. It is drying...
Nov 18, 2023 at 02:49 PM
p.1 #3How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
Cool images even if not ideal. Multiple film emulsion layers reacting and chemically deteriorating. Even background radiation (cosmic and terrestrial sources) impacted that film. The grain I find interesting, but I think that's emulsion breakdown.
A side note is I have 60+ year old developed slides that still look great. So stability is obviously much greater once developed. The old nitrate-based negative film doesn't fare as well. "Safety" film or the cellulose-acetate films hold up pretty well once developed.
Fascinating looking at these.
A side note is I have 60+ year old developed slides that still look great. So stability is obviously much greater once developed. The old nitrate-based negative film doesn't fare as well. "Safety" film or the cellulose-acetate films hold up pretty well once developed.
Fascinating looking at these.
Nov 18, 2023 at 03:50 PM
p.1 #4How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
These are great!
Even Pan-F, which Ilford warns has poor latent image retention, stands up pretty well to delayed development:
https://www.erikgouldprojects.com/coldcoffee/2020/10/1/testing-the-latent-image-capability-of-ilford-pan-f
This test found noticeable changes when the film was left for three months, but the frames were still perfectly usable.
Even Pan-F, which Ilford warns has poor latent image retention, stands up pretty well to delayed development:
https://www.erikgouldprojects.com/coldcoffee/2020/10/1/testing-the-latent-image-capability-of-ilford-pan-f
This test found noticeable changes when the film was left for three months, but the frames were still perfectly usable.
Nov 18, 2023 at 04:35 PM
p.1 #5How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
Cool to see this. That first motocross shot it sweet!
Nov 18, 2023 at 05:55 PM
p.1 #6How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
OregonSun wrote:
Cool to see this. That first motocross shot it sweet!
That was not mine, but taken by someone who knows what he is doing! All looked like that - he didn’t miss one. Pretty impresive.
I can see using this film in a ‘b’ camera if you were shooting something that you wanted to get normal results. Then any funkiness wouldnt matter as you have captured the images with the fresh film too.
Amusingly this neolithic film looks way better than fresh Wolfen 400 and 500. That film is ‘orrible.
Cool to see this. That first motocross shot it sweet!
That was not mine, but taken by someone who knows what he is doing! All looked like that - he didn’t miss one. Pretty impresive.
I can see using this film in a ‘b’ camera if you were shooting something that you wanted to get normal results. Then any funkiness wouldnt matter as you have captured the images with the fresh film too.
Amusingly this neolithic film looks way better than fresh Wolfen 400 and 500. That film is ‘orrible.
Nov 18, 2023 at 06:20 PM
p.1 #7How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
That is really impressive!
Nov 18, 2023 at 06:22 PM
p.1 #8How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
1) the pan shot is in good focus...even with 20 yrs. old af tech.
2) the last beach image of the vball bikers has good balanced colors, at least on my phone screen..
2) the last beach image of the vball bikers has good balanced colors, at least on my phone screen..
Nov 18, 2023 at 07:56 PM
p.1 #9How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
ok, the 35 year old TriX... I rated it at 400, and it looks like 100 would have been a lot better. But you need to start with a base line, as who knows how it will be?
Still it had lots of fog, and super grainy. I actually used this roll to also test the focus on a film M of my newly acquired TTA 100mm Trioplan, so the idea was a mix of test shots from up close to infinity to see if it focused correctly.
M7, TTA Trioplan 100, 35 yr old TriX
Edited on Nov 20, 2023 at 09:13 AM · View previous versions
Still it had lots of fog, and super grainy. I actually used this roll to also test the focus on a film M of my newly acquired TTA 100mm Trioplan, so the idea was a mix of test shots from up close to infinity to see if it focused correctly.
M7, TTA Trioplan 100, 35 yr old TriX
Edited on Nov 20, 2023 at 09:13 AM · View previous versions
Nov 18, 2023 at 08:42 PM
p.1 #10How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
It's funny to look at these, and think how jaded some have become in the digital age, wanting ever cleaner/noiseless images. 
Nov 18, 2023 at 11:59 PM
p.1 #11How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
I was just informed by the donor that the TriX had an expiration date of 1988! So it actually is 35 years old.
Next roll will be shot at iso 100…
Next roll will be shot at iso 100…
Nov 19, 2023 at 12:22 AM
p.1 #12How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
PAFL-rev wrote:
It's funny to look at these, and think how jaded some have become in the digital age, wanting ever cleaner/noiseless images.
Actually, people were equally "jaded" back in the old BD (Before Digital) film days. I transitioned from 35mm to 120mm because I wanted cleaner, "grain-less" images with better dynamic range!
Nov 19, 2023 at 06:50 AM
p.1 #13How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
Both look good to me. With Tri-X grain is a feature, not a a bad thing. You might find link this interesting.
!00+ year old undeveloped film found and processed
!00+ year old undeveloped film found and processed
Nov 19, 2023 at 04:54 PM
p.1 #14How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
crf59 wrote:
Cool images even if not ideal. Multiple film emulsion layers reacting and chemically deteriorating. Even background radiation (cosmic and terrestrial sources) impacted that film. The grain I find interesting, but I think that's emulsion breakdown.
A side note is I have 60+ year old developed slides that still look great. So stability is obviously much greater once developed. The old nitrate-based negative film doesn't fare as well. "Safety" film or the cellulose-acetate films hold up pretty well once developed.
Fascinating looking at these.
What do you mean not ideal
? These are great and have a story to them, unlike so many bland digital images that are shot these days. I mean sure if you want non-psychedelic colours and grain that doesn't look like coarse sandpaper then I guess they are not ideal. But these are so fun to look at.
Cool images even if not ideal. Multiple film emulsion layers reacting and chemically deteriorating. Even background radiation (cosmic and terrestrial sources) impacted that film. The grain I find interesting, but I think that's emulsion breakdown.
A side note is I have 60+ year old developed slides that still look great. So stability is obviously much greater once developed. The old nitrate-based negative film doesn't fare as well. "Safety" film or the cellulose-acetate films hold up pretty well once developed.
Fascinating looking at these.
What do you mean not ideal
? These are great and have a story to them, unlike so many bland digital images that are shot these days. I mean sure if you want non-psychedelic colours and grain that doesn't look like coarse sandpaper then I guess they are not ideal. But these are so fun to look at.Nov 19, 2023 at 06:43 PM
p.1 #15How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
James Markus wrote:
Both look good to me. With Tri-X grain is a feature, not a a bad thing. You might find link this interesting.
!00+ year old undeveloped film found and processed
Whoa! There is still hope for what I just shot!
That was a very cool story (no pun intended). I just wish it was longer/ they went into more detail.
Both look good to me. With Tri-X grain is a feature, not a a bad thing. You might find link this interesting.
!00+ year old undeveloped film found and processed
Whoa! There is still hope for what I just shot!
That was a very cool story (no pun intended). I just wish it was longer/ they went into more detail.
Nov 19, 2023 at 06:54 PM
p.1 #16How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
I find this to be absolutely fascinating and so much fun! Thanks for sharing this.
My film Minolta was dropped many moons ago, and no longer functions. Dang it.
My film Minolta was dropped many moons ago, and no longer functions. Dang it.
Nov 20, 2023 at 07:33 AM
p.1 #17How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
Sharona wrote:
I find this to be absolutely fascinating and so much fun! Thanks for sharing this.
My film Minolta was dropped many moons ago, and no longer functions. Dang it.
I know places where you can get another..
I find this to be absolutely fascinating and so much fun! Thanks for sharing this.
My film Minolta was dropped many moons ago, and no longer functions. Dang it.
I know places where you can get another..
Nov 20, 2023 at 11:22 AM
p.1 #18How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
If you put the film in cassettes made from whisky barrels and leave it for 20 years does it age better?
Nov 20, 2023 at 11:54 AM
p.1 #19How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
Quick question....I recently found a roll of Tmax 3200 that I believe I exposed back in 2000 or 2001 but never processed. I'd like to see if the images are salvageable but I don't have the equipment to process it myself so will need to take it to a lab. What should I tell them to do with it to give it the best odds? Push?
Nov 20, 2023 at 12:24 PM
p.1 #20How long do you think a latent image lasts on undeveloped film?
panos.v wrote:
If you put the film in cassettes made from whisky barrels and leave it for 20 years does it age better?
What effect does alcohol vapour have on film? I would think there would be some sort of chemical reaction. I also think that you are the man for the job to test this out. To speed up the process, take five airtight tupperwear tubs. In each place the roll of film as well as a shot glass of whiskey. Careful not to spill. Place in a safe spot and check back in a year.
Do the same with a burgundy, a tequila, a gin and a rum. Vodka is too neutral so forget that nonsense.
I'd suggest using an ISO 400 film for improved sensitivity. A warm location out of the sun would be ideal.
Just don't do this, have at least a modicum of decorum:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/brigette-bloom_n_5639794
If you put the film in cassettes made from whisky barrels and leave it for 20 years does it age better?
What effect does alcohol vapour have on film? I would think there would be some sort of chemical reaction. I also think that you are the man for the job to test this out. To speed up the process, take five airtight tupperwear tubs. In each place the roll of film as well as a shot glass of whiskey. Careful not to spill. Place in a safe spot and check back in a year.
Do the same with a burgundy, a tequila, a gin and a rum. Vodka is too neutral so forget that nonsense.
I'd suggest using an ISO 400 film for improved sensitivity. A warm location out of the sun would be ideal.
Just don't do this, have at least a modicum of decorum:
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/brigette-bloom_n_5639794
Nov 20, 2023 at 12:24 PM