p.19 #1 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
It is a matter of degree. Perfect focus breathing compensation in the lens would probably be difficult and take the cost of the lens to cinema zoom territory. This is especially difficult in a lens that focuses really close, like the 1:4 in these long zooms. But Nikon has managed to make lenses that have only a little breathing and this residual breathing may be practically invisible when switching between two subjects that would be part of a single clip of video. A slight breathing is not nearly as disturbing as strong breathing in some other lenses. Nikon has had quite bad cases of focus breathing in many of their F-mount lenses from some time ago and it's nice to see that they now work to minimize it.
Clearly a two-part collar+foot solution with dovetails, velvet lining inside the collar, and additional screw threads and locking knobs and a slide prevention mechanism in the foot lead to a higher cost of manufacturing and more complex assembly than a simple collar which is one component (+ a locking knob). I am confident that Nikon knows the cost of manufacturing and how to optimize their lower priced designs to meet their goals. A less nice collar can be a way for Nikon to signal to certain customers who appreciate nice mechanical things and can be persuaded to purchase more expensive lenses that this product may not be an ideal fit for them. It is clear from this thread that a lot of people are happy that Nikon makes this lens and the images (which is after all the main thing) look pleasing, especially many of those from the more experienced and skilled photographers. It is also telling how some of the best photographers posting in this forum have purchased this lens and are using it with good results.
It is then the customer's task to choose the right lens for their needs. If the collar seems unsatisfactory and if this is important to you, don't buy the lens. It doesn't make any sense to spend one's life suffering something that doesn't feel right.
molson wrote:
You can't really compare a boutique product for wealthy hobbyists with mass produced small parts like this.
Once you deduct the design and manufacturing costs for the inferior collar, the net cost of adapting an existing product will be very much lower. It would also spread the cost of some components over Nikon's entire telephoto line, reducing the unit cost even more. With Nikon not choosing this obvious cost saving opportunity, it makes me think the lens is produced by an outside supplier (either that, or it was a deliberate attempt to "cheapen" the lens to provide an incentive for buyers to upgrade to an S series lens...)
I'm not sure whether this calls into question the competence of the product manager, or makes me optimistic that a better (faster?) S-line supertele zoom is in the works...
After watching Steve Perry's latest video, it seems the Nikon 180-600 also has a substantial amount of focus breathing, so if Nikon went with a more complex design, it didn't seem to solve that particular problem....Show more →
p.19 #2 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
Just some quick snaps fooling around in the backyard convincing me more and more that I made the right decision trading this lens for my Sigma S. These Nikon images just seem to have more "pop" to them compared to what I was used to from the Sig. OOF areas are also much more pleasing IMHO. Looks like another Nikon winner.
There's been some talk about the tripod collar. I can confirm, it's terrible. You need to unscrew it so far before it loosens and there's no in between. Either it's tight or loose. Also feels gritty. Poor, cheap design. That's my only complaint. Sure, would have loved a dedicated control ring but you have to take price point into consideration so that's a wish not a complaint. I find I need to use the MF ring much more often to gain initial focus with the Z9 than I did with the D500.
Gary
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens550mmf/6.31/400s800 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens550mmf/6.31/400s800 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens600mmf/6.31/400s800 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens600mmf/6.31/1000s800 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens600mmf/6.31/640s800 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens530mmf/6.31/400s800 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens550mmf/6.31/400s800 ISO-1.0 EV
p.19 #3 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
sum1sgrampa wrote:
Just some quick snaps fooling around in the backyard convincing me more and more that I made the right decision trading this lens for my Sigma S. These Nikon images just seem to have more "pop" to them compared to what I was used to from the Sig. OOF areas are also much more pleasing IMHO. Looks like another Nikon winner.
There's been some talk about the trip collar. I can confirm, it's terrible. You need to unscrew it so far before it loosens and there's no in between. Either it's tight or loose. Also feels gritty. Poor, cheap design. That's my only complaint.
Gary...Show more →
These squirrel shots are super clean... I really like the wild-type phase squirrels on the mossy trunk...
Super good work that reflects how good the lens really is.
p.19 #4 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
sum1sgrampa wrote:
Just some quick snaps fooling around in the backyard convincing me more and more that I made the right decision trading this lens for my Sigma S. These Nikon images just seem to have more "pop" to them compared to what I was used to from the Sig. OOF areas are also much more pleasing IMHO. Looks like another Nikon winner.
There's been some talk about the trip collar. I can confirm, it's terrible. You need to unscrew it so far before it loosens and there's no in between. Either it's tight or loose. Also feels gritty. Poor, cheap design. That's my only complaint.
Gary...Show more →
Nicely done... what distance were the squirrels roughly at?
p.19 #5 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
robert_in_ca wrote:
Nicely done... what distance were the squirrels roughly at?
Probably about 30 feet. Pretty much filling the frame. Except for the black squirrel. That was more like 50 and a fair crop. I'm not telling you guys anything you don't already know but that's the key with these lower end optics I believe. If you can fill the frame they're right up there with the best. It's when you're at a distance and you start the big crops where they begin to suffer.
p.19 #6 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
sum1sgrampa wrote:
Just some quick snaps fooling around in the backyard convincing me more and more that I made the right decision trading this lens for my Sigma S. These Nikon images just seem to have more "pop" to them compared to what I was used to from the Sig. OOF areas are also much more pleasing IMHO. Looks like another Nikon winner.
There's been some talk about the tripod collar. I can confirm, it's terrible. You need to unscrew it so far before it loosens and there's no in between. Either it's tight or loose. Also feels gritty. Poor, cheap design. That's my only complaint.
Gary...Show more →
p.19 #7 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
Lance B wrote:
A selection of shots from a 34 shot sequence of an Osprey being harassed by a Magpie. The earlier shots cropped more than the latter shots, the last with little cropping. I only included the Magpie in the shots that had it close to the Osprey or the Magpie was not partly cut off. The Z9 didn't miss eye focus in any shot.
Z9 + 180-600, all at 600mm f7.1 and 1/3200sec with various ISO's from 1400 to 3600.
These are looking great Lance, love the shots with the magpie included. How are you feeling about the sharpness of the 180-600 now that you have used it some, I know you set a high bar. The BG's look very smooth BTW.
p.19 #8 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
Very impressive quality and character of shots (of the squirrel), hard to tell that this is from a "budget" lens. Tells a lot about the quality of the photographer.
I am wondering given the criticism of the tripod mount, do you use the 180-600 on tripod or shoot hand-held, or a mix of both?
I guess the key aspect in determining whether the tripod mount is adequate is whether it is good enough that use on a tripod is beneficial and tolerable.
Has anyone here planned on purchasing the Kirk collar and dual point support? They seem to be marketing it actively as there is a direct link from Kirk's website on the front page.
p.19 #9 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
ilkka_nissila wrote:
Very impressive quality and character of shots (of the squirrel), hard to tell that this is from a "budget" lens. Tells a lot about the quality of the photographer.
I am wondering given the criticism of the tripod mount, do you use the 180-600 on tripod or shoot hand-held, or a mix of both?
I guess the key aspect in determining whether the tripod mount is adequate is whether it is good enough that use on a tripod is beneficial and tolerable.
Has anyone here planned on purchasing the Kirk collar and dual point support? They seem to be marketing it actively as there is a direct link from Kirk's website on the front page....Show more →
I'm actually having second thoughts about purchasing a replacement collar. I've been using the lens on a tripod whenever I can... just my preferred way of shooting. A few things to note... the collar holds the lens fairly rigidly, so if you lock it down, it does not have the "give" that was prevalent in the 200-500. Secondly, the more I've rotated the lens, the smoother the action has become. Previously, there was a ton of friction that made the rotation "jerky." Since using the collar repeatedly, I've found that the action has improved.
The remaining problem is not going to get better... the number of knob twists to loosen or tighten is annoying, but it is not a barrier to using the collar.
p.19 #10 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
Kirk has a replacement collar though I have not seen reviews. I would expect it to be high quality although it unfortunately does not look like it allows for separation of the ring and the foot, which is a complaint i've seen about the 180-600 foot.
p.19 #11 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
ilkka_nissila wrote:
Very impressive quality and character of shots (of the squirrel), hard to tell that this is from a "budget" lens. Tells a lot about the quality of the photographer.
I am wondering given the criticism of the tripod mount, do you use the 180-600 on tripod or shoot hand-held, or a mix of both?
I guess the key aspect in determining whether the tripod mount is adequate is whether it is good enough that use on a tripod is beneficial and tolerable.
Has anyone here planned on purchasing the Kirk collar and dual point support? They seem to be marketing it actively as there is a direct link from Kirk's website on the front page....Show more →
For the Squirrels, as I said I was just passing time in the yard so these were handheld. I've only had one opportunity for an actual outing and that was handheld also. https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1830834 My primary reason for getting this lens was for my kayak shooting. I can regularly get in pretty close to a lot of critters and that's where I wanted the zoom. I always shoot handheld from the kayak. Sometimes I'll shoot my 400 4.5 off a monopod with the Whimberley MH-100 and that's been working great. I'm hoping to do the same with the 180-600. I have a Arca-swiss plate attached to the 180-600 foot right now but I'm not sure if I'm going to like that setup with the MH-100. I'm worried that the extra piece will be wonky. I can't test it out because I left the monopod in California but I'm flying back to CA in two days so I can test it out then. I also tend to shoot from a tripod from time to time so most likely, I'll be looking for a replacement collar when they become available down the road. I greatly prefer the integrated Arca Swiss over a plate. The problem I have with removing the collar for hand held shooting is then I can't attach my RRS sling strap. I'm not attaching that to the body with this long lens.
Appreciate your input !
Just looked up the Kirk replacement. $325 ?? Yikes. I'll be making do for a while
p.19 #14 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
A few more edits from the other morning. I'm not into the technical stuff but this lens does seem to struggle with back lit subjects. It appears that contrast takes a really big hit. Lack of higher end coatings ??
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens440mmf/6.31/2000s1000 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens600mmf/6.31/400s1000 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens600mmf/6.31/1600s1000 ISO-1.0 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens520mmf/6.31/1600s1000 ISO-1.0 EV
p.19 #15 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
Well, despite the flare, the images look very nice. Not all flare is a bad thing, it can also be aesthetically pleasing.
The 180-600 has 25 elements in 17 groups, while e.g.,
the 400/4.5 has 19 elements in 13 groups, so a bit more flare is expected in the zoom.
sum1sgrampa wrote:
A few more edits from the other morning. I'm not into the technical stuff but this lens does seem to struggle with back lit subjects. It appears that contrast takes a really big hit. Lack of higher end coatings ??
p.19 #16 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
Alistair1 wrote:
These are looking great Lance, love the shots with the magpie included. How are you feeling about the sharpness of the 180-600 now that you have used it some, I know you set a high bar. The BG's look very smooth BTW.
Thank you very much, Alistair. Much appreciated!
It has excellent sharpness wide open and stopped down even a 1/3rd of a stop it gets a tad sharper. The primes are sharper wide open, but at f8 it is razor sharp and will match the primes. The bokeh is also very good. It is a consumer zoom but punches well above it's weight and I am very, very happy with it.
p.19 #17 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
The deer are in their breeding prime right now, so that's all I've got to share these days.
I bought the 180-600 for this type of photography where I can get fairly close to my subjects. I photograph a lot of deer throughout the winter as well as swans. I used to use the 200-400 f4 for a lot of this work, the 180-600 is definitely a step up in terms of optics and handling... I think that's really good news.
bruce
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens420mmf/6.31/500s3200 ISO-0.3 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens200mmf/6.31/500s3200 ISO-0.3 EV
NIKON Z 9NIKKOR Z 180-600mm f/5.6-6.3 VR lens430mmf/6.31/2500s3200 ISO-0.3 EV
p.19 #18 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
OwlsEyes wrote:
The deer are in their breeding prime right now, so that's all I've got to share these days.
I bought the 180-600 for this type of photography where I can get fairly close to my subjects. I photograph a lot of deer throughout the winter as well as swans. I used to use the 200-400 f4 for a lot of this work, the 180-600 is definitely a step up in terms of optics and handling... I think that's really good news.
bruce
beautiful buck Bruce!
is it wild or captive? you've posted a ton of "shooter" bucks that hunters all around the country would be jealous to see!
these images in here are really making me lean towards the 180-600 instead of the 100-400
p.19 #20 · Official Nikon Z 180-600mm f5.6-6.3 VR Image Thread
nmerc_photos wrote:
beautiful buck Bruce!
is it wild or captive? you've posted a ton of "shooter" bucks that hunters all around the country would be jealous to see!
these images in here are really making me lean towards the 180-600 instead of the 100-400
Hi and thanks for the note,
I never post captive animals, in fact I can't recall the last time I've been to a "wildlife sanctuary" where the wildlife is not free to roam beyond pre-defined boarders... Hmm maybe 'Ol Pejeta Conservancy" in Kenya (But it is 360 square km... so essentially free roaming).
I live in MN and we have a frightfully large deer population. Furthermore, the Mississippi National Wildlife Refuge is part of the NPS system and it is illegal to hunt there. This refuge runs into multiple state parks along the Mississippi and St. Croix River (another NPS controlled system). The parks allow for very tightly regulated hunts when the deer populations are exceeding park carrying capacity. As such, there are a few parks where deer have semi-permanent residence or migrate into the Mississippi and St. Croix Valley Refuges only to return to breed in November. Unlike the bucks, many of the does and fawns will winter in the state parks and the bucks return for a captive audience
For example, I photographed this same buck around the same time last year. There is one buck who died two years ago that I photographed for at least 4 consecutive years.
I have plans to move to California during the first quarter of 2024, so I am trying to pad my files with big bucks... My decade-plus run of "trophy" white-tail deer photography is about to come to an end
RE the 180-600 v 100-400.. I think this depends more on your weight tolerance, existing kit, and size rather than optical quality. While the 400 f4.5 edges out the 180-600 @ 400mm, it's not enough to make me pull out that lens. I will only use my 400mm lens when I need the extra stop or I know I will be shooting handheld all of the time (like from a kayak, canoe, or other watercraft). If 600mm is your max lens (like 600PF or 600S) or you use a 400mm f2.8S, I think the 100-400 is the right "other" lens. For me, I use the 800PF for some birds and distant or small mammals (coyotes, deer landscapes, otters, etc...). The 180-600 is the perfect "other" lens and will likely be my most used wildlife lens. I also continue to hold onto my 400 f4.5 and 1.4x. So when I go on a nature shoot, I always carry my 17-28 f2.8, 70-180 f2.8, Z6II, Z8, and Z9. If decide to go long, I will pack the latter in my Backlight 36L with the 800mm and 400mm lenses; if I decide to be a generalist or am planning a flight, I'll pack the "smaller stuff" in my FStop Tilopa w/ Pro-XL ICU and stick the 400 and 180-600 in that bag (yes it all fits nicely).
I carried the Tilopa kit into the state park yesterday with the Z9 on the 180-600, Z8 on the 400, and the 2 smaller lens + Z6II separated... I was able to hike comfortably for 3 miles on a lot of uneven and trail-free brush habitat with this stuff, and probably would be just fine with this kit into the future... even if I didn't have the 800PF.
bruce
