I've only been in the M system for about a month, and I'm still getting a feel for things. I picked up an M240 and have been shooting it with a Voigtlander 35mm f/1.7, which is the only M mount lens I own, but I've been overall happy with it. The fact that I can see the edge of the lens in the finder is kind of weird coming from SLRs/Mirrorless cameras, but hasn't been a huge problem.
So I'm considering adding 1 or 2 lenses down the road and trying to get a sense of what is out there, and it's a bit overwhelming. Leica lenses in general seem to be above my pay grade, but luckily the modern Voigtlander stuff seems pretty solid.
If you were looking for a 50mm that is a competent all around 50, where would you start?
I generally shoot stopped down, so an f/1.2 is mostly wasted on me. I find f/2 to be fast enough most times, and prefer to stop down more for DOF. Finder blockage is still a little weird to me, and big lenses are annoying to carry, so I suppose size should be a consideration. I don't have any real interest in the vintage/glowing look of older glass.
The Voigtlander Nokton 50mm f/1.5 seems like it might be a good option? The Voigtlander 50 APO looks really nice, but does is have a lot of finder blockage? I know Zeiss made the 50mm f/2 ZM lens, but I know nothing about it optically speaking.
You can't go wrong with the 50 1.5 Nokton. It really does everything very nicely, it also looks great on the camera.
For a first 50 on a Leica M body, the 50 1.5 Nokton is about as good at it gets for the price .You can shoot wide open if you want to, stopped down its very sharp across the frame and in an extremely small package. Also the build, focusing ring etc are all just a joy to use.
Recently, I bought a first version of the Voigtlander 50 1.5 Nokton ASPH to use with my M4-2. It's a little on the large side and has the knurled focusing ring. There is a bit of finder blockage with the hood on, it just catches the edge of the 50 framelines. These can be found in barely used condition at a reasonable price. Have fun searching!
M4 Voigtlander 50 1.5 Nokton ASPH V1, Tri-X, Rodinal (before I learned how to treat Tri-X in Rodinal)
If budget plays a role and when stopping down the 50 mm lens often in the first place, another good option are some vintage 50 mm lenses in LTM mount which can be obtained for a few hundred dollars. The Canon 50/1.4 LTM is one - some vignetting in the corners wide open, but when stopped down it is track sharp.
If the budget is higher, a good choice you can't go wrong with is an earlier quite compact Leica 50/2 Summicron lens - for example the pre-ASPH version V of this lens. It costs about $1500 used.
retrofocus wrote:
If budget plays a role and when stopping down the 50 mm lens often in the first place, another good option are some vintage 50 mm lenses in LTM mount which can be obtained for a few hundred dollars. The Canon 50/1.4 LTM is one - some vignetting in the corners wide open, but when stopped down it is track sharp.
If the budget is higher, a good choice you can't go wrong with is an earlier quite compact Leica 50/2 Summicron lens - for example the pre-ASPH version V of this lens. It costs about $1500 used.
Ideally I'd like to be in the $500-600 (used) range just because I know from experience I'm going to use my 35mm more often. I'm hoping I can get something good in that range as my understanding is 50mm lenses are relatively simple to design.
nehemiahphoto wrote:
Take a look at the ZM 50/1.5 or the Syoptic 50/1.1. Both pretty great and within your budget. Different draws though.
Yeah, the ZM 50 f1.5 is a great lens, I have the CV 50mm 1.2 but either on the M9 or my Z6 I more than often take the Sonnar ZM, it’s not as sharp or perfect but it’s more about the overall image it gives.
While I understand that f1.2 is not important for you, the Voigtlander Nokton 50/1.2 is truly wonderful. It has gorgeous rendering. That is a lens that I plan to keep forever.
Abuttolph wrote:
While I understand that f1.2 is not important for you, the Voigtlander Nokton 50/1.2 is truly wonderful. It has gorgeous rendering. That is a lens that I plan to keep forever.
I don’t dislike the lens, it gives great results, I’m quite fond of the 1.2 aperture capability, in street photography being able to isolate a subject at some distance is very valuable. I’m not fond of blown out backgrounds but that separation feat was always very important to me, it has only been recently that I gave in to f2 lenses to try some new restrictions and new things.
The Sonnar has gained my preference recently for its unique rendering, I like some particularities of older design and the size of it is quite handy.
I still have my 50 1.2 and I wouldn’t mind the sonnar to be 1.2 also.
Abuttolph wrote:
While I understand that f1.2 is not important for you, the Voigtlander Nokton 50/1.2 is truly wonderful. It has gorgeous rendering. That is a lens that I plan to keep forever.
Since you mostly shoot stopped down, and you don't want a soft vintage look, I say go for a used Voigtlander 50 APO (or Popflash sells it new for well below retail at $799). The finder blockage isn't bad and never bothered me, especially without the hood, which it really doesn't need. The only issue I could foresee is very high frequency detail (certain fabrics, etc.) might provoke moire on the lower resolution sensor of the 240 with such a high resolving lens.
Just go with Voigtlander M lenses to start with. They are overall excellent in build and performance. Usually you can find good used ones on this site. Once you learn the M camera you will develop your own style of shooting and imaging. Then you can decide if one of the Leica lenses will fit you better.
The current 50/1.5 Nokton is probably a logical pairing with the VM 35/1.7 IMO, in respect to performance, and seems to meet your requirements. About 12 years ago I started with the ZM 50/2; it's a safe lens. No big surprises with it, and it does nice sunstars, if you like that. It's a little on the long side, though not necessarily longer than some other 50s, such as the 50 Lux ASPH or the VM 50/2 APO. If it has a weakness it's so-so veiling flare performance. Not bad but IME also not great when something bright is just outside the frame. A quirk with ZM lenses is third-stop aperture increments that doesn't necessarily mesh cleanly with the camera's half-stop shutter speed steps. Way back I thought it would be an advantage for more precise exposure control, but with the latitude of modern RAW files, there's less need IMO.
I agree that vintage 50s are also a good option. The Canon LTM lenses generally perform very well and once stopped down are close to modern lenses, if perhaps a little less saturated due to older coating technology. IMO where the Canon lenses fall a little short is build quality. They're generally not as mechanically robust feeling as what you'd get from VM or ZM options.
formula4speed wrote:
Ideally I'd like to be in the $500-600 (used) range just because I know from experience I'm going to use my 35mm more often.
So many options. A top contender, however, would be the Voigtlaender Heliar 50/3.5 which is a modern instantiation of the classic formula, and fits your budget nicely. FM link below shows everything you need to know. Take note that Fred is a big fan.
I have the Nokton f/1.5 and the VL Apo. Quite honestly, I have hardly used either because I mostly use wider lenses for street shooting. However, I'm moving to Europe and will have a lot more free time and I've decided to keep both. The Apo is apparently a stellar performer, but it's also a bit large and heavy for the M system while the Nokton is small and light. I figure I use the Apo if weight isn't an issue at all and the Nokton when it may be an issue.
I also currently have three 35mm lenses, all Zeiss 1.4, 2 and 2.8. The 1.4 is just too bulky for the system in my opinion and so I'm selling it, despite people saying it's the best 35mm for the M mount. I've decided that the f/2 is the ideal combo of size, speed and quality.
It's probably hard to go wrong with most choices from Leica (except for price), Zeiss or VL. They all make great lenses. For Zeiss and Leica, you can get new lenses on eBay from Rangefinder in Hong Kong for great prices, btw. Don't know about VL.
johnvanr wrote:
I have the Nokton f/1.5 and the VL Apo. Quite honestly, I have hardly used either because I mostly use wider lenses for street shooting. However, I'm moving to Europe and will have a lot more free time and I've decided to keep both. The Apo is apparently a stellar performer, but it's also a bit large and heavy for the M system while the Nokton is small and light. I figure I use the Apo if weight isn't an issue at all and the Nokton when it may be an issue.
I also currently have three 35mm lenses, all Zeiss 1.4, 2 and 2.8. The 1.4 is just too bulky for the system in my opinion and so I'm selling it, despite people saying it's the best 35mm for the M mount. I've decided that the f/2 is the ideal combo of size, speed and quality.
It's probably hard to go wrong with most choices from Leica (except for price), Zeiss or VL. They all make great lenses. For Zeiss and Leica, you can get new lenses on eBay from Rangefinder in Hong Kong for great prices, btw. Don't know about VL. ...Show more →
The last new M mount lens Zeiss released was the ZM Distagon 35 1.4. Which maybe was 10years ago? That shows how little they care anymore, while Voigtlander has been releasing killer lenses ever since. I have the Distagon 35 and optically it is great, but as you say it is just too big for an M.
So if I was to buy a 35mm M lens today, that one would not be a consideration. It is also really freakin expensive new! Something like $2500.
A top contender, however, would be the Voigtlaender Heliar 50/3.5 which is a modern instantiation of the classic formula, and fits your budget nicely. FM link below shows everything you need to know. Take note that Fred is a big fan.