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50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3

  
 
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3




rico wrote:
[Leica fanatics are weird.


We are haha!



Jun 10, 2023 at 07:26 PM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3




steve.chang wrote:
https://wiki.l-camera-forum.com/leica-wiki.en/images/3/3a/Puts-2002-M-lenses.pdf
Their soul and secrets
by Erwin Puts

Some interesting read on P.43-44


Very interesting!



Jun 10, 2023 at 07:26 PM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


Itís a strange coincidence, but a friend happened to bring over a 50 asph that he wanted to sell, and for a price I couldnít refuse. So, I now have SIX 50mm lenses. Please send help.

Anyway, just for fun Iíll include the asph version as well if I get time tomorrow.



Jun 10, 2023 at 07:41 PM
cbass
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


lifeandmylens wrote:
Itís a strange coincidence, but a friend happened to bring over a 50 asph that he wanted to sell, and for a price I couldnít refuse. So, I now have SIX 50mm lenses. Please send help.

Anyway, just for fun Iíll include the asph version as well if I get time tomorrow.


You are in the best position to do a comprehensive and meaningful comparison to help others in the future. At close to MFD the V2 and V3 will have obvious spherical aberrations that are largely cleaned up by f/2.8. Does V1 also clean up by f/2.8 at that distance? I assume the ASPH with the floating element design cleans up before f/2.8 and may even perform very well at f/1.4?

The other question is coma. The Summilux's were designed with coma correction in mind. At least V2 and V3. How does V1 do with coma and does the ASPH retain the coma correction or even improve upon it?



Jun 10, 2023 at 10:40 PM
mulberry2006
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


lifeandmylens wrote:
For distortion?


No, that I can see. But your analysis of OOF rendering, colors, contrasts, etc.




Jun 11, 2023 at 04:26 AM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


cbass wrote:
You are in the best position to do a comprehensive and meaningful comparison to help others in the future. At close to MFD the V2 and V3 will have obvious spherical aberrations that are largely cleaned up by f/2.8. Does V1 also clean up by f/2.8 at that distance? I assume the ASPH with the floating element design cleans up before f/2.8 and may even perform very well at f/1.4?

The other question is coma. The Summilux's were designed with coma correction in mind. At least V2 and V3. How does V1 do with coma and does the ASPH retain the
...Show more

Some of that may be more work than I can put into it (my wife has me refinishing floors right now...with a 4 month old baby haha), but will try to get to some of it

These were with the lens on each set to 5m (the scales are not the exact same). Coma/SA is not corrected on the v1 (which you can also see on some of the specular highlights on the out of focus rendering photos). Coma/SA seems very well corrected on the asph and somewhere in the middle on the v2/v3 (I'm no lens expert!). I'll do MFD later.







The scene
























Jun 11, 2023 at 05:48 AM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


Another quick test with a flashlight and some fairy lights on the side and the scene for the next set.




  LEICA M10-R    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v1 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/1s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA M10-R    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v2 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/1s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA M10-R    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v3 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/1s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA M10-R    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Asph lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/1s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  







Scene for set below



Edited on Jun 11, 2023 at 08:55 AM · View previous versions



Jun 11, 2023 at 05:53 AM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


Hereís a few shots at ~1m (MFD for v1 and v2). A CLA could change these results. I actually did this test twice. The first time I didnít adjust focus with every aperture change, the second time I adjusted focus each time to eliminate any focus shift, but then I think I introduced some focusing errors.

So this is the set where I only focused once wide openÖhere weíll be able to see focus shift in all its glory, which may or may not be useful.

Adjusting for focus shift for every aperture change and taking several pictures (with adjusted focus each time) at each aperture and picking the best would be the correct way to do this testÖbut I donít want to spend all day on this. So I wouldnít read too much into these.





f1.4 center







f1.4 corner







f1.4 center







f1.4 corner







f2 center







f2 corner







f2 center







f2 corner







f2.8 center







f2.8 corner







f2.8 center







f2.8 corner



Edited on Jun 11, 2023 at 08:52 AM · View previous versions



Jun 11, 2023 at 08:43 AM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


.





f4 center







f4 corner







f4 center







f4 corner







f5.6 center







f5.6 corner







f5.6 center







f5.6 corner







f8 center







f8 corner







f8 center







f8 corner




Jun 11, 2023 at 08:45 AM
Oldwino
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


These are great and very informative. Thank you!


Jun 11, 2023 at 09:19 AM
 


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lifeandmylens
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


Last few from a quick test outside, this time also including the ASPH. The last set of the house is near infinity and zoomed into 100%.




  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v1 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/800s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v2 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/500s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v3 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/500s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Asph lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/320s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v1 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/250s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v2 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/200s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Pre Asph v3 lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/200s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  






  LEICA SL (Typ 601)    Summilux 50mm f/1.4 Asph lens    50mm    f/1.4    1/200s    100 ISO    0.0 EV  







A little glow on the windows



















Jun 11, 2023 at 11:21 AM
nehemiahphoto
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


Wonderful threadóthank you.


Jun 11, 2023 at 06:23 PM
cbass
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3



lifeandmylens wrote:
Some of that may be more work than I can put into it (my wife has me refinishing floors right now...with a 4 month old baby haha), but will try to get to some of it



Sorry I didn't know you had a newborn and house projects. That is a lot on your plate.

I saw you did the coma test and others. I appreciate it. This is probably the only opportunity I will get to answer some of these questions. I have searched on the internet and came up empty. You are probably the only one that owned all of them at the same time.



Jun 11, 2023 at 06:30 PM
highdesertmesa
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


lifeandmylens wrote:
Last few from a quick test outside, this time also including the ASPH. The last set of the house is near infinity and zoomed into 100%.


Wow, wide open, the ASPH makes the pre-ASPH versions look like f/2 lenses.

I'm still preferring the v1 rendering over the v2 and v3. V1 also has the most differentiated look from that of the ASPH.



Jun 11, 2023 at 06:46 PM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3




cbass wrote:
Sorry I didn't know you had a newborn and house projects. That is a lot on your plate.

I saw you did the coma test and others. I appreciate it. This is probably the only opportunity I will get to answer some of these questions. I have searched on the internet and came up empty. You are probably the only one that owned all of them at the same time.


No worries at all! I like playing with these old lenses. I agree - when I was looking for info on which one to get I couldnít find any that even compared two of them let alone three. I found several forum posts but no actual picture comparisons.

Let me know if you have any requests while I still have all the versions.



Jun 11, 2023 at 06:49 PM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


highdesertmesa wrote:
Wow, wide open, the ASPH makes the pre-ASPH versions look like f/2 lenses.

I'm still preferring the v1 rendering over the v2 and v3. V1 also has the most differentiated look from that of the ASPH.


I agree.



Jun 11, 2023 at 07:04 PM
cbass
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p.2 #17 · p.2 #17 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


lifeandmylens wrote:
No worries at all! I like playing with these old lenses. I agree - when I was looking for info on which one to get I couldnít find any that even compared two of them let alone three. I found several forum posts but no actual picture comparisons.

Let me know if you have any requests while I still have all the versions.


If this is your first one, then I hope you get one that sleeps well. None of my kids were good sleepers. If yours is not sleeping and you are still refinishing the floors and comparing lenses, then you are more machine than man. I am jealous of your stamina.

Karbe claimed in an interview the Summilux Asph is actually an APO lens. I was always curious if that was true and honestly a bit skeptical. If you have time or desire, it would be interesting how these lenses behave in a night photography situation with a few streetlights or house lights or some form of very bright light sources. Typically, you will see purple outlines around strong light sources in the dark night.

The Summilux V2/V3 should cleanup to almost perfect by f/2.8 and pretty much perfect by f/4. The Summicron (non-APO) would be almost perfect by f/4 but could have some slight residual purple colors left over. It was always behind the lux in these scenarios. Basically, the lux was about 1-2 stops better than the cron in these night situations. I wonder how much better the apparently APO but not advertised Asph Summilux performs.

The Summilux lenses starting from V2 were always intended for night photography with focus on coma and ghosting from strong light sources.



Jun 11, 2023 at 09:25 PM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #18 · p.2 #18 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


cbass wrote:
If this is your first one, then I hope you get one that sleeps well. None of my kids were good sleepers. If yours is not sleeping and you are still refinishing the floors and comparing lenses, then you are more machine than man. I am jealous of your stamina.

Karbe claimed in an interview the Summilux Asph is actually an APO lens. I was always curious if that was true and honestly a bit skeptical. If you have time or desire, it would be interesting how these lenses behave in a night photography situation with a few streetlights or house
...Show more

He's my second kid, and luckily sleeps through the night! Although he does wake up at 4:30, which is also when I wake up now. Which also means I'm in bed by 9pm. .

So not sure about the night request, but I might be able to do it in the am one morning.

I can tell you from owning about 6 copies of the asph that it is near an APO lens. It will still have some CA wide open, but in my experience very little. Happy to play around with them.



Jun 12, 2023 at 02:23 PM
lifeandmylens
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p.2 #19 · p.2 #19 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


Currently Iím leaning towards keeping the v1, mostly for the reasons @highdesertmesa mentioned. I like structure of the out of focus areas on it and itís also the most different rendering to the asph.

Itís probably not the wisest financial decision...well actually this entire test wasnít , but I sent off the v1 and v3 for a CLA.

Should help resale value, and of course whichever one I keep will be freshly CLAíd. Should have them back in about a week and will do a few more play around tests then. Iím also hoping to get my Summarit 1.5 and Summicron Rigid v1 back soon from CLA to include those to make sure I wonít have redundant rendering among lenses. But they're in DAG purgatory right now, so will see.



Jun 12, 2023 at 02:24 PM
cbass
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p.2 #20 · p.2 #20 · 50 Summilux (pre asph) - v1, v2 & v3


I am surprised at how well the v2/v3 are doing compared to the asph. Now you will need to add the Summilux-R variants to the test. Just kidding about the last part.

I would also keep the V1. It's the most unique and had the shortest production run.



Jun 13, 2023 at 11:55 PM
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