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Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica

  
 
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Light Lens Lab will produce a 50mm f/1.2 ASPH ď1966Ē lens for Leica M-mount. It will be a Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica...

https://photorumors.com/2022/06/20/light-lens-lab-50mm-f-1-2-asph-1966-lens-for-leica-m-mount-sample-photos/

First samples:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/96801808@N06/52161249955/in/album-72177720299946460






from photorumors.com






from photorumors.com






from photorumors.com






from photorumors.com




Jun 20, 2022 at 01:26 PM
retrofocus
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Curious how it compares in performance and price with the Voigtlander 50/1.2 and 50/1.0 lenses.


Jun 20, 2022 at 01:38 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Fred Miranda wrote:
Light Lens Lab will produce a 50mm f/1.2 ASPH ď1966Ē lens for Leica M-mount. It will be a Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica.


If I'm not mistaken, this is the same company that produced the 8-element 35/2 homage to the original Summicron-M. I'd say either Leica doesn't have a legal recourse against it or Light Lens Lab is counting on them not finding it worth the money to pursue any action.

After looking at those samples, though, I wonder who will buy it. That is some fugly bokeh.



Jun 20, 2022 at 03:16 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


freaklikeme wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, this is the same company that produced the 8-element 35/2 homage to the original Summicron-M. I'd say either Leica doesn't have a legal recourse against it or Light Lens Lab is counting on them not finding it worth the money to pursue any action.

After looking at those samples, though, I wonder who will buy it. That is some fugly bokeh.


From the limited samples, I found the rendering reminiscent of the current Leica 50/1.2 Noctilux in production right now. (which was also a copy of the older 50/1.2 Noct)
Yes, the character is not for everyone's taste and Leica vintage.

I was told there is already a big waiting list and the first batch is set to be delivered by the end of the year. Not sure about the price yet.



Jun 20, 2022 at 04:54 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


I saw thisóitís a replica of the pre-Mandler Noct, which uses an ASPH and I havenít enjoyed as much.

I would like to know LLís rational for which lenses they pickówhy this Noct and the 35 Cron of the old school Leica glass? There are others just as loved.



Jun 20, 2022 at 05:04 PM
freaklikeme
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Fred Miranda wrote:
From the limited samples, I found the rendering reminiscent of the current Leica 50/1.2 Noctilux in production right now. (which was also a copy of the older 50/1.2 Noct)
Yes, the character is not for everyone's taste and Leica vintage.

I was told there is already a big waiting list and the first batch is set to be delivered by the end of the year. Not sure about the price yet.


Hopefully Leica did a better job polishing the aspheric surface on the $8K reissue.

I do think, when you're looking at a small batch operation like them, a "big" waiting list could be fifty names or less.



Jun 20, 2022 at 05:54 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


retrofocus wrote:
Curious how it compares in performance and price with the Voigtlander 50/1.2 and 50/1.0 lenses.


I would guess poorly for technical IQ. The LL Noct is mimicking a 1966 lens ultra fast lens. I think the even current 50 Noct is technically inferior to the new CV 50/1 from Fredís testing. I know my Mandler 50/1 Noct is a technical mess compared to the current stuff.

What I am personally curious about is how it compares the original. Iíve noticed some shooters that were not as happy with the Leica re-issue because it is higher contrast, had a bit more pop and is sharper which somewhat goes against whole purpose of buying that glass for many. It would for me.

This might be of interest to some:

https://tahusa.co/lens-review/noctilux-50mm-f12-asph-original-vs-reissue/



Jun 20, 2022 at 06:44 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


freaklikeme wrote:
Hopefully Leica did a better job polishing the aspheric surface on the $8K reissue.

I do think, when you're looking at a small batch operation like them, a "big" waiting list could be fifty names or less.


Leica's aspherical polishing is good but not great either. Even their latest 35/2 APO shows onion inner structure pattern.
I think you are right about the number of pre-orders. This is a very small production factory.



Jun 20, 2022 at 06:50 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


nehemiahphoto wrote:
I would guess poorly for technical IQ. The LL Noct is mimicking a 1966 lens ultra fast lens. I think the even current 50 Noct is technically inferior to the new CV 50/1 from Fredís testing. I know my Mandler 50/1 Noct is a technical mess compared to the current stuff.

What I am personally curious about is how it compares the original. Iíve noticed some shooters that were not as happy with the Leica re-issue because it is higher contrast, had a bit more pop and is sharper which somewhat goes against whole purpose of buying that glass for many.
...Show more

I have no personal experience with the 50/1.2 Noct (original or reissued) but I prefer the 50/1 Noct's rendering hands down.
None of these vintage ultra fast lenses are technically great, not even the modern 0.95 Noct. I guess the character rendering is what sets them apart and even that seems to cause a love or hate reaction.



Jun 20, 2022 at 06:55 PM
nehemiahphoto
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Fred Miranda wrote:
I have no personal experience with the 50/1.2 Noct (original or reissued) but I prefer the 50/1 Noct's rendering hands down.
None of these vintage ultra fast lenses are technically great, not even the modern 0.95 Noct. I guess the character rendering is what sets them apart and even that seems to cause a love or hate reaction.


Very much agree on the Noct 50/1 vs 50/1.2 images. Because of this, I have never been interested in the Leica or this LL re-issue.

Yesóitís only if you like the rendering or the collector/nostalgia aspect. Thatís what it all boils down with these spendy character lenses (build/haptics/size are very secondary in this context IMO). And oh yes do it bother some people other people will spend for character.



Jun 20, 2022 at 07:09 PM
 


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ocean2059
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


LLL has produced two replica lenses, a Summicron-M 35/2 v1 (8-element), and an Elcon 50/2. In addition to the Noct 50/1,2, there is also a Zeiss Hologon 15/8 replica next.

Regarding the image quality of the current Leica Noct 50/1,2, there are 18 pages of images in Leica forum,
https://www.l-camera-forum.com/topic/318586-the-50mm-f12-noctilux-image-thread/#comments

I actually really like the image quality this lens produces.



Jun 20, 2022 at 09:53 PM
panos.v
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


freaklikeme wrote:
If I'm not mistaken, this is the same company that produced the 8-element 35/2 homage to the original Summicron-M. I'd say either Leica doesn't have a legal recourse against it or Light Lens Lab is counting on them not finding it worth the money to pursue any action.

After looking at those samples, though, I wonder who will buy it. That is some fugly bokeh.


I believe any patent expires after 50 years at most, so these old lenses are fair game now.



Jun 22, 2022 at 07:27 AM
rscheffler
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


nehemiahphoto wrote:
I saw thisóitís a replica of the pre-Mandler Noct, which uses an ASPH and I havenít enjoyed as much.

I would like to know LLís rational for which lenses they pickówhy this Noct and the 35 Cron of the old school Leica glass? There are others just as loved.


The 50/1.2 was supposed to be the second replica after the 35 cron v1, at least according to the discussion over at RFF in the very long 35 Cron replica thread. But then Leica announced their own re-release of the 50/1.2 and LLL pivoted to the Elcan instead.

I think their original reasoning for which lenses to replicate was based on rarity and market value. The 35 Cron was probably a compromise of technical ease vs. availability. IIRC LLL samples each lens element to determine glass type, which likely destroys, or at minimum, damages at least one original copy. Considering a 35 Cron v1 is maybe ~$2k, it was probably a good 'inexpensive' original to start with. IIRC the Elcan is optically simpler (four elements?) but is quite rare and more expensive. The Hologon and 50/1.2 seem to fit based on rarity and cost of the originals.

I wanted to see them do a 35 Lux pre-ASPH, but that was back when the 35 Cron replica was offered for $500 through RFF rather than its current ~$1300 street price. I think it's cool what they're doing, but their current price points IMO push these products into a pseudo exclusive realm of their own.

I'd guess their 50/1.2 will come in at about half of the current Leica re-release's 'base model' price. Even if it's 'only' $2k, there's the question of manufacturer support, or lack thereof. How easy will it be to ship a lens back to China for service, and how long will it take? This is pretty much what I experienced with my 35 Cron replica, but fortunately the RFF 'rep' was helpful and facilitated the process. But I never dealt directly with the manufacturer in any sense and it took about 5 months...



Jun 23, 2022 at 04:28 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Same rendering comparisons to the original lens:

















Jun 26, 2022 at 12:12 AM
rscheffler
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Looks pretty faithful. At least in the center of the frame, bokeh seems slightly smoother-edged in the replica. Reminds me of the 35 Cron replica.

Unfortunately I don't have first-hand experience with the original 35 Cron v1, but I think my 35 Cron replica renders slightly differently than the original, based on images I've seen from it. At least my 'production' version. LLL made a bunch of tweaks during the preproduction stage to modify contrast, flare resistance, etc. I made my purchase decision based on their preproduction photos and feel like some of the characteristics may have changed very slightly in the production version. That said I'm still generally happy with the lens, considering it's a 50s-60s era design, with certain inherent optical weaknesses. IOW, character.

With the 50/1.2, I would wait to see user feedback once actual production units start shipping, to be sure things haven't changed much.

Regarding my repair concern above, that is for warranty servicing (assuming LLL even offers a warranty). Given these are quite faithful reproductions, any reputable Leica service technician, such as DAG, should also be able to service these. That said, IIRC, LLL makes small dimensional changes to the replicas to prevent parts being used to service the originals, so likely also vice versa.



Jun 26, 2022 at 11:38 AM
highdesertmesa
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Lots of samples on their IG: https://www.instagram.com/lightlenslab


Jun 26, 2022 at 12:22 PM
flash
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


I think if youíre after this look, why not. Choice is good. Not for me though.

I lusted after a 0.95 Noctilux for years. Had the old CV 1.1 until I could afford it when the local Leica importer put on a very rare sale (I believe Leica were about to take over the distribution). Honestly was the only Leica lens I shouldnít have bought. The CV 1.1 was better in my eyes. It worked out though. Ten years later I sold it for a bit more than I paid for it.

Now for a fast 50 I have both the new CV 50ís. The 1.2 and 1.0. I really like both of them. The difference in the 1.0ís CA control to the 0.95 is amazing. Iíve only just got the 1.0 and Iím super surprised at how much I like it. And I think the 1.2 CV is good enough as an every day lens as well as a super fast.

SO nice to have all these wonderful options in M mount.

Gordon



Jun 26, 2022 at 05:07 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


I've got some questions about pricing and availability for the Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica and that's still unknown.

I heard from Peter at photorumors that the first production copies should be available before the end of the year. Price is not released but he believes it should be under $2k.

LLL does not have a way to pre-order the lens directly. Hopefully they will design a website soon.

For those who want to pre-order it, contact Peter directly at:

https://photorumors.com/tips/



Jun 27, 2022 at 09:46 AM
highdesertmesa
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


flash wrote:
...Now for a fast 50 I have both the new CV 50ís. The 1.2 and 1.0. I really like both of them. The difference in the 1.0ís CA control to the 0.95 is amazing...


The Leica Noct 0.95 is 14 years old now (2008), so getting a "new Noct" from CV is nice. It will be interesting to see what Leica does for the next version of the modern 50 Noct.

In any case, I'm hoping they re-release the Noct f/1 as a classic reissue per the one pictured in the leaked M11 photos we saw a while back.



Jun 27, 2022 at 11:13 AM
rscheffler
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Light Lens Lab: Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica


Fred Miranda wrote:
I've got some questions about pricing and availability for the Leica 50mm f/1.2 Noctilux Replica and that's still unknown.

I heard from Peter at photorumors that the first production copies should be available before the end of the year. Price is not released but he believes it should be under $2k.

LLL does not have a way to pre-order the lens directly. Hopefully they will design a website soon.

For those who want to pre-order it, contact Peter directly at:

https://photorumors.com/tips/


That's the price point I would also expect, but I wouldn't hold my breath. Based on buying the 35 Cron replica through the RFF thread, LLL is not the same as the other recent Chinese lens makers, such as 7A, TTA, Laowa, etc. They're not competing in the general photography marketplace based on price. They're producing unique pieces aimed specifically at the Leica crowd, and will price accordingly. Right now they're building interest/hype in the lens, which will factor into determining the size of the production run, selling price, etc. Whether it will reach the same level of interest as the 35 Cron replica will be interesting to see.



Jun 28, 2022 at 10:40 AM
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