kdrk888 wrote:
I will consider when they add a front dial and a couple more buttons, and 42MP.
And I want A7c with A9 tech. Somebody wants it 100g lighter. And then there is the guy who wants it when price is down
Sony has dilemma. There are so many perfectly capable FE cameras available at different generations and pricing that A7c has hard time differentiate itself from the rest. And on top of it A7c has to compete against crop offerings that are (we must admit it) good enough for almost anything where compact camera is needed.
Here we have it, the embodiment on crisis of camera industry: a perfectly fine camera that is barely good enough for the spoiled audience.
I was about to say “well when I replace my A7R3 someday this would make a good 2nd body” and then I realized I’d be better off just keeping the A7R3 and buying a new primary body. My A7R3 has a lot of mileage on it anyways.
Probably not. I don't care about the small viewfinder (I could easily live without one), even though I shoot 99% manual focus lenses. But the screen... I want it to flip right up, not sideways and then half a turn.
Too bad, because a small(er) FF body with IBIS is exactly what I've been waiting for. I don't want or need a better camera than my a7 II. I want a smaller one.
My regular Sony bodies are small enough if I put my small lenses on them. IT is about the combination of lens and body. The a7c convenience will be more about what lenses are mounted than the camera size.
Since i am a stills shooter, the video capabilities are not important to me. I have yet to even push the video button on my cameras. In fact I wish they could be mapped to a custom menu choice like all the other buttons.
If i am willing to make the ergonomic compromises that the a7c does in order to save size/weight on an outing, I will go with a fixed zoom lens pocket sized camera even with a smaller sensor.
It’s a compelling shape and size. Especially for smaller manual focus lenses. But I have complaints.
Would it have been so hard to make a taller grip? The body height exceeds the grip height. Why?
EVF is a shame. I feel like I read max shutter is 1/4000, why? 42-61mpx would be a must for me for the applications (hiking, backpacking) I would use it for. Why doesn’t it have a joystick?
I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, this camera lacks focus. It doesn’t have a good enough reason to exist so it excites very few people.
A few tweaks though, and it’s lit (as the kids say). Bring on the a7rc or whatever ridiculous name it’ll earn.
Sony A7 cameras have gone up in size and weight with every generation.
When I bought my A7ii 4 years ago I didn't realize how much bigger and heavier it was over an A7, otherwise I might've gone with the A7. I've resisted updating because the A7iii got even bigger, and I have to assume the A7iv (when it comes out) will be bigger still.
So, I'm glad the A7C takes a different turn. I might've liked a different set of compromises to get there. A cheaper A5, with the body size of the A7, an updated sensor, new processor... I'd start there. But, clearly, a bunch of people really wanted IBIS, so there was no going back to the A7 (the big jump in size and weight on all A7 series cameras came from adding IBIS).
Someone also clearly felt that the viewfinder hump had to go... but that it also needed a viewfinder, and that it shouldn't popup.
And those, to me, are the defining features of this camera. It's a more compact camera, but it must have IBIS. Since that's hard (and it's the thing Sony most boasts about), it couldn't be a cheap camera. Since it couldn't be cheap, it needs a new design language to clearly convey compactness (no hump)... even if it isn't that much lighter (because IBIS). But even with no hump, it still needs an EVF. And a flip out screen for vlogging. And to work as a second body (and handle long video sessions) it needs to share batteries with the big boys.
That's how you get to the A7C. Everything else seems to be compromised to achieve the above. Viewfinders have gotten bigger, in part because humps have gotten bigger. No hump, no big viewfinder optics, never mind electronics (at this body size). Compact IBIS is not as effective, and the shutter is not as good. Grip appears to be as small as possible to fit the battery, but with IBIS and that battery the A7C couldn't be all that light. The flip out screen makes it thick. The internals are from the A7III, so some things (the touchscreen) are as crippled as on the A7iii.
Surprisingly, and maybe thanks to vlogging, some gotchas have been removed. Some only affect video (HDMI while recording) some are useful for photography. AF seems to be improved. AWB and colors as well. Realtime tracking seems to be decent. I also like that these screens can be rotated for storage.
These might not be the compromises I would've made for smaller and lighter (IBIS I guess really unravelled this). But if I can live with them, and I'm assuming I can, this will probably be my next camera.
As a strong left eye shooter, these rf style bodies just feel awkward for me. But I like that Sony is going smaller/lighter. Unfortunately the A7C might feel going backward from my A7III which already feels almost perfect for me. Only thing giving me some thought is the reports of A7C having improved focus peaking (not sure if it's really true or just some placebo caused by the small evf magnification factor). The Sony peaking traditionally have felt like crap (after using Fujis), which is my only real gripe, as a mostly manual shooter.
Maybe for a second body I could consider it, but only buying it used for a lower price.
I love the form factor but the problem for me is the megapixels. I already own a 24mp camera (a9) and i am interested in a7rIII like resolution. I know i will never get that camera because they will cram 50-60-70 mp’s in future bodies. I feel a7rIII resolution is decent enough, even for cropping if i want. Not going for ultra high resolutions as well as another 24mp.
95% of the complaints here (and everywhere) about this camera are just completely off-base.
This is essentially like people who own an RX10M4 complaining about an RX100M7 for being too small and having a smaller viewfinder and fewer controls.
Sony is giving people a choice. Some want a large FF, camera, some want a small FF camera, some want both for different use cases.
I (and others) will gladly buy the A7C because of the size, and also look forward to additional models in the future (in particular, a high-resolution version).
The concept of small is good. When people complain about additional buttons, dials, extra finger room, bigger EVF, and the like they are really wanting a bigger camera...you know like the A73....or A7R4. Luckily these cameras exist so people can buy them.
The A7C should be more compact and light than what Sony did. Think what can we remove and not what can we add.
Take the NEX6 body add in the 36mp sensor and you would have an amazing compact. Does it lack some things? Yes. Does it work best with smaller lenses? Yes again. But that is kind of the whole point. This isn't the camera for the 24-70/2.8 crowd. It's for the 28-60 kit, Or Voigtlander 15, or Samyang 75.
Sony cameras keep getting bigger. I wish they could be smaller.
lightskyland wrote:
95% of the complaints here (and everywhere) about this camera are just completely off-base.
This is essentially like people who own an RX10M4 complaining about an RX100M7 for being too small and having a smaller viewfinder and fewer controls.
Sony is giving people a choice. Some want a large FF, camera, some want a small FF camera, some want both for different use cases.
I (and others) will gladly buy the A7C because of the size, and also look forward to additional models in the future (in particular, a high-resolution version).
I pre-ordered immediately. I always wanted a lighter, more compact body that I can use with one of my smaller lenses (Voigtlander 21/3.5, Sony Zeiss 35/2.8, Sigma 45/2.8 and Samyang 75/1.8). With just the 35/2.8, my kit will only weigh 629g. That's light and unobtrusive enough to carry around in a belt pouch while doing things other than photography. I know everyone's lifestyle and tolerance for carrying gear varies, but for me this is a camera I can have with me most of the time.
It’s a really interesting camera to me. Until recently I’d have my A7rIII and X100V, I sold the Fuji to try and simplify my kit. It would be nice to be able to share lenses, although it would probably just keep the 35mm 2.8 on it all the time. The price is the part that’s hard to justify, I really prefer RF style cameras but love all the tech in Sony cameras.
WestTexas Sky wrote:
The concept of small is good. When people complain about additional buttons, dials, extra finger room, bigger EVF, and the like they are really wanting a bigger camera...you know like the A73....or A7R4. Luckily these cameras exist so people can buy them.
The A7C should be more compact and light than what Sony did. Think what can we remove and not what can we add.
Take the NEX6 body add in the 36mp sensor and you would have an amazing compact. Does it lack some things? Yes. Does it work best with smaller lenses? Yes again. But that is kind of the whole point. This isn't the camera for the 24-70/2.8 crowd. It's for the 28-60 kit, Or Voigtlander 15, or Samyang 75.
Sony cameras keep getting bigger. I wish they could be smaller.
Yes, it's like complaining about the RX1R II's viewfinder or that it does not have enough custom buttons. Compact cameras can't offer the same level of customization and viewfinder quality increases with size as well.
I don't think Sony was trying to change the A7 III into a A7C. They still offer both cameras and now we have a compact alternative... Can't wait for the compact A7R IV.
I can definately see this camera getting out more than my RX1RII and 6500 combined, paired with A7RIII. Yes there are compromises of course and I will watch with interest, but once things have settled down - any bugs, firmware updates etc I can see me giving it a go.
I like my little Contax G's, Summicron 40, Voigt 15 and they might play well with this - and yes I would get the kit lens too at the price - and less than 170g - it doesnt look too shabby on the samples gallery and keeping expectations within reason.
lightskyland wrote:
95% of the complaints here (and everywhere) about this camera are just completely off-base.
This is essentially like people who own an RX10M4 complaining about an RX100M7 for being too small and having a smaller viewfinder and fewer controls.
Sony is giving people a choice. Some want a large FF, camera, some want a small FF camera, some want both for different use cases.
I (and others) will gladly buy the A7C because of the size, and also look forward to additional models in the future (in particular, a high-resolution version).
And some people don't fit at all in the marketing strategy. I've been looking for a small camera with IBIS, large sensor and tilting screen forever. It doesn't exist, if you also want a decent user interface not targeted at noobs. Not even if you go APS-C.
I don't care about AF and I don't even need a viewfinder since I shoot mostly from waist level. But the screen on the a7C is awkward since it doesn't flip straight up. Where am I gonna place my left hand if the screen is pointing to the left?
The functions I need buttons for would easily fit an even smaller camera, so that's not a problem. It's just not targeted at me, and no other camera is either. I almost broke down when Ricoh finally launched the GR III and STILL no tilting screen.
And now this... Another punch in the face.
I don't want or need a better camera than my a7 II. I want a smaller one.