p.28 #1 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
WestTexas Sky wrote:
Specs listed look disappointing. While the form factor looks nice it's too heavy. Not sure anyone understands compact should mean lightweight.
Drop IBIS
Use the W battery
Use the NEX6 chassis
Camera would be under 400g
Go polycarbonate like an A6100 save a bit more.
I really wanted to get this camera but it's too heavy and at $2000+ keeping my gen 1 A7R or my A6100 seems like a better fit as a compact travel camera.
I think we may have different definitions of 'heavy'. Getting a FF sensor in a compact body with IBIS and keeping it A6600 weight is solid engineering. I wouldn't buy the camera you described above and I suspect I'm not alone...poor-ish build, no IBIS and a crappy battery? No thanks, I'll continue to use my A7R.
Besides, 100 grams is irrelevant to me and I suspect to most. Three sips of my water bottle remove that much or more weight from my pack when I'm hiking. I'm far more size sensitive than weight sensitive...a few pounds this or that way don't matter much given the, uh, let's call it 'unsprung' weight that I carry around. There are lots of decisions I make when leaving the house from my shoes/boots to my jacket to my sunglasses that have as much or more impact than 100 grams on a camera body.
p.28 #2 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Most people describing the need for ultra light cameras should just get a high end phone with a good camera. Or an rx100
There are limitations on what you can do in favor of practicality. An interchangeable lens camera with ff and many features like this 7c in its current form is better than the alternative (nothing). If it doesn't fit someone's needs simply don't buy it. Wait a few generations. But for those who want it and buy it, enjoy it.
p.28 #3 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Jorge Torralba wrote:
Most people describing the need for ultra light cameras should just get a high end phone with a good camera. Or an rx100
There are limitations on what you can do in favor of practicality. An interchangeable lens camera with ff and many features like this 7c in its current form is better than the alternative (nothing). If it doesn't fit someone's needs simply don't buy it. Wait a few generations. But for those who want it and buy it, enjoy it.
I know some people think the whole 'get a phone' comment is facetious, but I'm often quite serious when I make that recommendation haha. I used to not be a fan of phone cameras by the Pixel 2 finally changed that. Now I have a Note 10+ and, honestly, if I'm not willing to put with with an extra few pounds of gear in my shoulder bag, I'll just use my phone. If I'm not looking to really focus on photography, it honestly does a great job. Otherwise, I'll put up with the weight.
p.28 #4 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Dave Sanders wrote:
I think we may have different definitions of 'heavy'. Getting a FF sensor in a compact body with IBIS and keeping it A6600 weight is solid engineering. I wouldn't buy the camera you described above and I suspect I'm not alone...poor-ish build, no IBIS and a crappy battery? No thanks, I'll continue to use my A7R.
Besides, 100 grams is irrelevant to me and I suspect to most. Three sips of my water bottle remove that much or more weight from my pack when I'm hiking. I'm far more size sensitive than weight sensitive...a few pounds this or that way don't matter much given the, uh, let's call it 'unsprung' weight that I carry around. There are lots of decisions I make when leaving the house from my shoes/boots to my jacket to my sunglasses that have as much or more impact than 100 grams on a camera body....Show more →
For me it's never the extra weight in the pack...that's easy to accommodate a few extra pounds. For me, it's the weight hanging off my wrist for the day...that is where every gram saved is felt at the end of the day.
But I agree...start stripping a bunch of features out of this new camera and I'll just stay with my A7R...which I might do in any case.
p.28 #5 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
chez wrote:
For me it's never the extra weight in the pack...that's easy to .accommodate a few extra pounds. For me, it's the weight hanging off my wrist for the day...that is where every gram saved is felt at the end of the day.
But I agree...start stripping a bunch of features out of this new camera and I'll just stay with my A7R...which I might do in any case.
Chez, I've tried to replace my A7R many times over the years but I just can't haha. I like new gear as much as the next guy, but the size, weight and IQ of the A7R makes it tough to get rid of. I'm not a demanding AF user so the slow but steady AF of the A7R works just fine for me. It may just be me, it may be some sort of confirmation bias, but there's something special about that 36mp sensor and its lack of any sort of phase detect. Mine is currently out of commission due to a cracked rear screen but as soon as I can I'll fix it and get it back up and running as a permanent home for my Sigma 45/2.8. I have a feeling that they'll be a fantastic combo.
As for weight, my cameras are in a Domke shoulder bag, a backpack or I hold them by the grip. I don't hang them that often, unless it's cross body. I spent many years walking around holding a D2X/D3 and then a D810 so, honestly, 100 grams on a camera isn't something I'd notice. Choosing my Loxia 25 over my Zony 35 or Sigma 45 is a more significant decision. Even that, though, I don't notice.
p.28 #6 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
I now wonder what will be Sony's move regarding the change in LCD design for other products. I would be happier than a bucket of ice cream if the new articulating screen made it into an a6xxx body with IBIS. The regular tilting screens are too limiting for prolonged tripod work at low or high levels in portrait orientation. Been contemplating modding my a6300 LCD to pivot on an extra axis somehow.
p.28 #7 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Looks like this new camera has very little to offer over A7m3.
But for those who use A7m1 or m2 might be interrested to upgrade. Even though improvemets in image quality are small faster operation and better af might be tempting.
Also newcomers to FE-system might be interrested in this compact full frame. And maybe for some it is the substitute of RX1 that Sony seems to have quit.
Personally I am not interrested in A7c but I think it is a good move from Sony. Low end full frame mirrorless market is growing and when price drops a little this will a good camera to that segment. And maybe a A5c will follow sometimes next year.
chez wrote:
For me it's never the extra weight in the pack...that's easy to accommodate a few extra pounds. For me, it's the weight hanging off my wrist for the day...that is where every gram saved is felt at the end of the day.
But I agree...start stripping a bunch of features out of this new camera and I'll just stay with my A7R...which I might do in any case.
p.28 #9 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
with the incoming flood of hands-on first impressions all over the internet, we should play some bingo of the usual keywords to be used across the net about this camera
I think this will end up following the same theme around the ZV1, "not wide enough", but at least is a ILC this time
p.28 #10 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Fred Miranda wrote:
The Sony A7C's body design is more alike the A6100 than the A6600.
They share similar shorter/smaller grip design and the lack of custom buttons.
For the purpose of being a compact, I actually like this better. The only 2 things really holding me back at this point are the EVF and the 24mp. Maybe an "r" version will address this. Also I'm still holding out hope (less than 1%) we might still get an Rx1Riii that may finally get that curved sensor we didn't get in the A7c.
p.28 #11 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
nhsonyshooter wrote:
For the purpose of being a compact, I actually like this better. The only 2 things really holding me back at this point are the EVF and the 24mp. Maybe an "r" version will address this. Also I'm still holding out hope (less than 1%) we might still get an Rx1Riii that may finally get that curved sensor we didn't get in the A7c.
If they release a 61MP in the future, I would happily switch my R4 for it.
p.28 #13 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Fred Miranda wrote:
The Sony A7C's body design is more alike the A6100 than the A6600.
They share similar shorter/smaller grip design and the lack of custom buttons.
The "lack of custom buttons" and no mini joystick are deal breakers for me. The slightly smaller size and rotatable rear screen just aren't features that appeal to me or enough of an incentive to change from my a7ii or a7rii
I've previously owned a few A6xxx models, but didn't keep them long because I hated the ergonomics.
p.28 #14 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
jaybr wrote:
The "lack of custom buttons" and no mini joystick are deal breakers for me. The slightly smaller size and rotatable rear screen just aren't features that appeal to me or enough of an incentive to change from my a7ii or a7rii
I've previously owned a few A6xxx models, but didn't keep them long because I hated the ergonomics.
J
Yeah the lack of a front dial is rather unfortunate. I’ve been in the same boat. Had the A6500 and the A6400 and just couldn’t work with the ergonomics. I really don’t see these cameras as stills shooters but more for vlogging and livestreaming which is a growing area.
p.28 #15 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
I think I can deal with it
Record button > hold and scroll
Rear dial > aperture
Hold + rear > shutter
Hold + wheel > iso
Shutter button > shutter or video recording based on mode.
AF/MF in Fn menu or trash
AF on > AF hold
At least that’s how I would set it up. Of course would like more, but I think that’s usable.
2xbass wrote:
Yeah the lack of a front dial is rather unfortunate. I’ve been in the same boat. Had the A6500 and the A6400 and just couldn’t work with the ergonomics. I really don’t see these cameras as stills shooters but more for vlogging and livestreaming which is a growing area.
From what we know so far, a very interesting camera.
I would have liked to get an A7R with a little better autofocus, without shutter shock, and a little better ergonomics and responsiveness in this new housing.
But thanks to the cooling system, I hope at least the sensor might achieve similarly clear results in (real) long time exposures, like the A7R and not like the newer A7 models.
I also found the autofocus of the A7RI - ARIII very unreliable. In this respect, the camera could contain pretty much everything I wanted, except for the desired higher resolution.
Certainly Sony will intentionally keep room for their future models (as with every Sony model). So I think a model with an even higher resolution will come at some point (rather soon).
p.28 #17 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
jaybr wrote:
The "lack of custom buttons" and no mini joystick are deal breakers for me. The slightly smaller size and rotatable rear screen just aren't features that appeal to me or enough of an incentive to change from my a7ii or a7rii
I've previously owned a few A6xxx models, but didn't keep them long because I hated the ergonomics.
J
Like you, I have an A7ii, so as much as I wanted a joystick, I have been living without it with no major issues. And that’s with the old Sony AF system.
Not sure if I read it here or somewhere else, but apparently the current Sony AF-C tracking pretty much negates the need for moving the focus point manually. If you use single point focus, you can lock on your subject with half press and then recompose, the whole while the camera maintaining focus on your selected subject.
The bigger loss for me is the lack of front dial and custom buttons, but as CharlieN stated, there should be some good work around options for each user case. For me, the more compact size makes it worth it.
p.28 #18 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
Wanting a small, compact and lightweight full frame camera does not mean a phone or RX100.
If you are happy with A7III size weight that is great. Not everyone wants something that bulky though. It is possible to make a small lightweight full frame but with feature bloat has made this bigger than it could or should be.
There is a market for small.
Jorge Torralba wrote:
Most people describing the need for ultra light cameras should just get a high end phone with a good camera. Or an rx100
There are limitations on what you can do in favor of practicality. An interchangeable lens camera with ff and many features like this 7c in its current form is better than the alternative (nothing). If it doesn't fit someone's needs simply don't buy it. Wait a few generations. But for those who want it and buy it, enjoy it.
p.28 #20 · Pre-order: Sony A7C Compact Full Frame ($1,798)
This image on SAR pretty much sums up why the a7c is appealing to me. Yes the ergonomics are not the best, and yes it gives up some control wheels and custom buttons, and yes the size differences diminish when you use larger lenses.
All of that is besides the point of the camera though.
When paired with a compact prime and used in less critical shooting situations, the ability to easily slip the camera in a bag and just generally integrate photography into your day to day lifestyle is what the camera is all about. Getting rid of the hump and trimming down the grip is a pretty big deal in terms of packing a camera. If this is not a priority to you, treat it the way I treat it the a7sIII and move along.
