I recently did a midrange-lens landscape shootout which was mostly for Sony lenses but included the Nikon 24-70 f/2.8 Z as well. You can view the results here.
Steve Spencer wrote:
My experience is, yes, the Loxia lenses (I have the 21, 25, & 85, and I had the 50) are every bit as good on the Z7 as they were on the A7r II, and I like using them on the Z7 more with the better viewfinder. These manual focus lenses really work well on both systems.
Thanks, my main reason for wanting to sell the A7RII and use the Nikon Z7 for everything, is the viewfinder of the A7rII, which is a bit unpleasant to look through, especially with landscape photography.
Apr 30, 2020 at 10:49 AM
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ChrisMak wrote:
Thanks, my main reason for wanting to sell the A7RII and use the Nikon Z7 for everything, is the viewfinder of the A7rII, which is a bit unpleasant to look through, especially with landscape photography.
Oh, and if I might offer a bit of advice if you like the Loxia lenses take a looks at the E-mount Voigtlander lenses as well. You could replace that Loxia 35 with the new Voigtlander 35 f/1.2 SE. It should be available in mid May or maybe it was mid June. It looks like a very nice lens and the Leica M version is already quite good on the Sony camera, the E mount version should be if anything a little better. You might consider replacing the Loxia 50 with the Voigtlander 50 f/2 APO which is a stunning lens. Super high quality and surprisingly for what it is not that expensive. Both these Voiglanders are really nice options.
Sony and Nikon really come down to which body meshes with your hands and mind better, since they are both Sony sensors and very similar in specs. Can't really go wrong with either one IMO.
they are both Sony manufactured (not to be confused with the camera manufacturer) imagers. not the "same". then you have the processors which again of each companies own functional design. if you shot with and post-processed both, each requires its own nuances as the raw results are different. i find the nikon raw needs less to get to my final result. just my take/perspective on this debacle.
sjms wrote:
they are both Sony manufactured (not to be confused with the camera manufacturer) imagers. not the "same". then you have the processors which again of each companies own functional design. if you shot with and post-processed both, each requires its own nuances as the raw results are different. i find the nikon raw needs less to get to my final result. just my take/perspective on this debacle.
If people are buying Z7 for landscapes and shooting JPEG, well, then... That's just my 2 cents.
Oh I agree that shooting jpg with a camera like that would be rather counterproductive. But even then the results are different between the two mentioned bodies.
Steve Spencer wrote:
Oh, and if I might offer a bit of advice if you like the Loxia lenses take a looks at the E-mount Voigtlander lenses as well. You could replace that Loxia 35 with the new Voigtlander 35 f/1.2 SE. It should be available in mid May or maybe it was mid June. It looks like a very nice lens and the Leica M version is already quite good on the Sony camera, the E mount version should be if anything a little better. You might consider replacing the Loxia 50 with the Voigtlander 50 f/2 APO which is a stunning lens. Super high quality and surprisingly for what it is not that expensive. Both these Voiglanders are really nice options. ...Show more →
Well. I just sold my A7RII an hour ago, so it's Nikon Z7 from now on. Hope the Schoten dumb Sony e to Nikon Z adapter arrives in not too long.
I am only sure of one lens, and that is the Loxia 25mm. I hope there's no (magenta) color cast on the Z7 in the corners, which tends to be the case with mirrorless if the lens is not 100% tuned to the sensor stack. I would have not dared blind with the Loxia 21mm, but assumed that 25mm should be ok.
Furthermore I could sell the Loxia 35 and 50, and could even forego on a 35mm by using the stellar Loxia 25mm in DX mode (not really needing f2 at 35mm) and add the intruiging Voigtlander 50mm f2 apo, which would give me a nice 75mm in DX mode. Can I ask you one thing though: knowing that you have experience with lenses like the Loxias and the better Voigtlanders: is the Nikon Z35mm f1.8S a serious alternative? That would leave me with only one exif-less lens, which would greatly simplify adding the lens mm in exif later on.
Edit: I just browsed through the Voigt 50/2 apo thread. What a superb lens that looks to be!!!
Thanks for bringing it under my attention. A set with the Lox 25 and the Voigt 50/2 apo would be great. Can the Voigtlander send the right exif to the Z7 with the Techart adapter?
Apr 30, 2020 at 04:09 PM
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ChrisMak wrote:
Well. I just sold my A7RII an hour ago, so it's Nikon Z7 from now on. Hope the Schoten dumb Sony e to Nikon Z adapter arrives in not too long.
I am only sure of one lens, and that is the Loxia 25mm. I hope there's no (magenta) color cast on the Z7 in the corners, which tends to be the case with mirrorless if the lens is not 100% tuned to the sensor stack. I would have not dared blind with the Loxia 21mm, but assumed that 25mm should be ok.
Furthermore I could sell the Loxia 35 and 50, and could even forego on a 35mm by using the stellar Loxia 25mm in DX mode (not really needing f2 at 35mm) and add the intruiging Voigtlander 50mm f2 apo, which would give me a nice 75mm in DX mode. Can I ask you one thing though: knowing that you have experience with lenses like the Loxias and the better Voigtlanders: is the Nikon Z35mm f1.8S a serious alternative? That would leave me with only one exif-less lens, which would greatly simplify adding the lens mm in exif later on.
Edit: I just browsed through the Voigt 50/2 apo thread. What a superb lens that looks to be!!!
Thanks for bringing it under my attention. A set with the Lox 25 and the Voigt 50/2 apo would be great. Can the Voigtlander send the right exif to the Z7 with the Techart adapter?...Show more →
Yes, the TechArt adapter does send basically the right EXIF (50 f/2 lens) to the camera, and because it is a 50mm the TechArt adapter ought to work well with it. The TechArt has the weird quirk that it reports for IBIS purposes that every lens is a 50mm lens. This works fine if it is indeed a 50mm lens, but for wide angles especially and telephotos to some extent, it messes up the IBIS.
Personally, I decided against getting the Nikon 35 f/1.8S. I don't think I like the bokeh from the samples I have seen and it has more CA than I would like. I am going to get the Voigtlander 35 f/1.2 SE when it becomes available, but that is just my preference. You might feel very differently.
Steve Spencer wrote:
Yes, the TechArt adapter does send basically the right EXIF (50 f/2 lens) to the camera, and because it is a 50mm the TechArt adapter ought to work well with it. The TechArt has the weird quirk that it reports for IBIS purposes that every lens is a 50mm lens. This works fine if it is indeed a 50mm lens, but for wide angles especially and telephotos to some extent, it messes up the IBIS.
Personally, I decided against getting the Nikon 35 f/1.8S. I don't think I like the bokeh from the samples I have seen and it has more CA than I would like. I am going to get the Voigtlander 35 f/1.2 SE when it becomes available, but that is just my preference. You might feel very differently....Show more →
I then think that I will get the Voigtlander 50/2 apo and a Techart smart adapter. That way I can have the Techart permanently attached to the Voigt 50 and the dumb Schoten adapter permanently attached to the Lox 25, and I can easily fill in the Loxia exif afterwards to get the manufacturer profile distortion correction in Capture One.
Thanks a lot, you have been very helpful and that Voigtlander FE50/2 apo looks a classic!
ChrisMak wrote:
I then think that I will get the Voigtlander 50/2 apo and a Techart smart adapter. That way I can have the Techart permanently attached to the Voigt 50 and the dumb Schoten adapter permanently attached to the Lox 25, and I can easily fill in the Loxia exif afterwards to get the manufacturer profile distortion correction in Capture One.
Thanks a lot, you have been very helpful and that Voigtlander FE50/2 apo looks a classic!
I have heard that (a) the Techart adapter has some issues related to mechanical quality, and (b) simply moving the lens closer and farther away from the sensor may result in aberrations that are not present in the original optical formula of the lens. While (a) is more an issue of convenience, as you can fall back to manual focus if the adapter fails, it might be worth to check out (b), especially with a lens such as the Voigtländer Apo 50/2 which strives to eliminate most aberrations.
Apr 30, 2020 at 07:26 PM
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AcuteShadows wrote:
I have heard that (a) the Techart adapter has some issues related to mechanical quality, and (b) simply moving the lens closer and farther away from the sensor may result in aberrations that are not present in the original optical formula of the lens. While (a) is more an issue of convenience, as you can fall back to manual focus if the adapter fails, it might be worth to check out (b), especially with a lens such as the Voigtländer Apo 50/2 which strives to eliminate most aberrations.
Two different TechArt adapters. You are discussing the one for Sony E mount lenses, which does have the issues you are describing, but I was talking about the one for Nikon Z mount lenses, which is not an AF adapter, does not move the lens closer or further from the sensor, and does not have mechanical problems. It does have the other problems I described, however, but does work well for 50mm lenses.
I continue to ponder the Z7 for landscape and I an really intrigued by the automated focus stacking as a means to improve my landscape output, in addition to the 24-70's quality.
The question that focus stacking raises is if I would need to spend $400-600 on XQD cards? Shooting 50-150 frames per set up is one thing when you can buy 128 GB SD for $20. It is something different when the XQD cards are running closer to $200.
Am I missing something or is this a real concern? Do you end up shooting JPEG or compressed images for focus stacking? Or is this going to be the expensive memory hog that I fear it will be?
billsnature wrote:
I continue to ponder the Z7 for landscape and I an really intrigued by the automated focus stacking as a means to improve my landscape output, in addition to the 24-70's quality.
The question that focus stacking raises is if I would need to spend $400-600 on XQD cards? Shooting 50-150 frames per set up is one thing when you can buy 128 GB SD for $20. It is something different when the XQD cards are running closer to $200.
Am I missing something or is this a real concern? Do you end up shooting JPEG or compressed images for focus stacking? Or is this going to be the expensive memory hog that I fear it will be?...Show more →
20 frames may be enough for a lot of landscape photography, but that depends on your subject, of course. There are some portable SSD units that work with cards and are cheaper per gigabyte, and may even lead to a smoother workflow on your computer due to faster random access and larger memory per storage item.
May 04, 2020 at 03:09 AM
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billsnature wrote:
I continue to ponder the Z7 for landscape and I an really intrigued by the automated focus stacking as a means to improve my landscape output, in addition to the 24-70's quality.
The question that focus stacking raises is if I would need to spend $400-600 on XQD cards? Shooting 50-150 frames per set up is one thing when you can buy 128 GB SD for $20. It is something different when the XQD cards are running closer to $200.
Am I missing something or is this a real concern? Do you end up shooting JPEG or compressed images for focus stacking? Or is this going to be the expensive memory hog that I fear it will be?...Show more →
A couple of things to keep in mind. First, with Nikon the compressed RAW files are actually lossless, so there is no reason not to use compressed RAW files. So, if you use uncompressed RAW on Sony, as some people do to ensure there is no loss or artifacts, then you will have smaller files with Nikon. I have actually found the compressed RAW (even though it isn't quite lossless) with the Sony to be fine, but not every one does. Second, XQD cards are very similar in price to SD cards of similar speeds (the XQD cards are both a little faster and a little more expensive than the top speed SD cards), but there are no low cost options for XQD cards. For many people, however, even a 32GB card will be plenty. You can get one for $90. You can get a 64GB card for $130. Personally, at this point I would get a 120 GB CF express card for $180, which is very likely to become the new standard. That should be plenty of storage for most people for a day of shooting and if it isn't I would look into a portable SSD solutions to download files to, or you could get a system that let's you copy from the CF express card to the older cheaper SD cards if that is what you like.
1bwana1 wrote:
Do you really need 50 to 150 frames to focus stack landscape images? I find that I am taking less than 5 images to do this in most cases.
Now if you are focus stacking what is basically a macro image, and blending it all the way to infinity, I can see the higher frame count.
I don't know. I am new to focus stacking and it isn't supported easily by the Sony bodies and lens that focus by wire.
When I look at Nikon videos or from webinars I have been watching they are setting up their camera to do 200 images, but end up with less if camera reached infinity before 200. That may be total overkill, and just an attempt to sell the automated feature, but that was their pitch.
That is why I asked the question. Do people use "1" as the setting for focus shift and upwards of 50 for frame number when doing landscape work with a Z7?
For those who have Z7 and practice focus shift what settings do you use?
Bill,
I often focus stack landscape images. I most commonly need only two images, rarely three, and I think the most I have ever used is 5 . Most times you need one focused close, one mid, and one infinity. This is easily done either in manual focus, or single focus AF modes. Touch screen focus works really well for this. In this method either the Nikon or the Sony cameras should work just as well, and just as easily.
These are then easily, and automatically merged in almost any modern image editing software.
Here is a link to a bunch of real World use case focus stacking tutorials on YouTube. I don't think any of them show a method that requires the number of frames you have talked about. Mostly just two.
Now macro focus stacking is a whole different thing...
Is there anyone following this thread that owns both a Z7 and a Sony A7R III or IV, and have you shot and compared the images from the two cameras with the same or similar lenses?
I do shoot raw files, but there seems to be something about the look of Nikon files that I struggle to replicate on Sony. I am still trying to figure out if that is in the lens and coatings or in the sensor/file treatment.
So if someone has tried CV 50mm APO on both cameras, I would be curious how similar or different the files look from a Z7 and a Sony.
billsnature wrote:
Is there anyone following this thread that owns both a Z7 and a Sony A7R III or IV, and have you shot and compared the images from the two cameras with the same or similar lenses?
I do shoot raw files, but there seems to be something about the look of Nikon files that I struggle to replicate on Sony. I am still trying to figure out if that is in the lens and coatings or in the sensor/file treatment.
So if someone has tried CV 50mm APO on both cameras, I would be curious how similar or different the files look from a Z7 and a Sony.
It's largely colour, Nikon has a very unique colour signature, especially in the blues.
I've only found Olympus to deliver similar colour to Nikon (and I've tried on a bunch of systems. Fuji's the hardest to duplicate Nikon colour from due to how they handle blues, but Sony's colour is enough different that matching the signature can be difficult.
That's just my 2 cents.