This Bald Eagle shot is just shy of 1:1 crop on the D500 and shot at 1/800. This is just an example, you couldn't crop this much with the D850 and get as much detail. for this FOV you'd likely have to crop 1:2 on the D850 on FX setting no TC.
First image al;most 1:1 crop D500 500mm PF 1/800 f5.6 ISO500. Second image same, just no crop.
6683 wrote:
Astounding shots @arbitrage@ on Page 152 Post 8
Do you know if Z50 AF’s as well/fast as my Sony a7iii ?
How would you take these shots with DSLR and still using flip LCD?
Thanks
Thanks.
I'm not sure how it compares to the A7III. My only Sony experience is with A9, A9II and A7RIV.
I assume the A7III is more in line with A7RIV but I think A7RIV does have some advancements.
I find the Z50 AF to be decently quick, it is very accurate for perched birds, floating birds, birds not moving much. I'd trust my A7RIV more for BIF. Z50 has a fairly disruptive slideshow if you want to shoot above 5FPS which is the bigger issue for BIF.
For the low down, water's edge shots I wasn't able to do that via the D500/D850 flip screen because the AF was too slow and there was bad blackout every shot. You can do it if the ducks aren't moving but it is frustrating. The D850 has a little better LV silent mode than the D500 so was a little better. In the past I did try a right-angle finder in order to have the camera on the ground. It works as long as you are dedicated to just doing the ground level shooting and not going to quickly react to a BIF at any moment. The places I shoot I often am doing ground level shots and then some ducks fly in so I like to be able to quickly raise the camera and shoot via the EVF. I coudn't do that with the right-angle finder. Of course you can also lie flat on the ground and just shoot via the DSLR's OVF.
Eric214 wrote:
This Bald Eagle shot is just shy of 1:1 crop on the D500 and shot at 1/800. This is just an example, you couldn't crop this much with the D850 and get as much detail. for this FOV you'd likely have to crop 1:2 on the D850 on FX setting no TC.
First image al;most 1:1 crop D500 500mm PF 1/800 f5.6 ISO500. Second image same, just no crop.
A D850 image cropped to DX is 20.3MP (45.7/2.25). The D500 is 20.9MP. There is no way 0.6MP makes any difference in the world. When I had both cameras I setup that comparison and no one could choose between them.
arbitrage wrote:
A D850 image cropped to DX is 20.3MP (45.7/2.25). The D500 is 20.9MP. There is no way 0.6MP makes any difference in the world. When I had both cameras I setup that comparison and no one could choose between them.
Good for you, glad your can't tell.
The image size I got was 19.2mp on my D850 when I had it. I can't remember now if I cropped an image or shit in DX mode but thought it was cropping the 45.7mp image, not shooting in DX crop mode. Someone else also looked and found it was 19.2mp, I think it was on DPReview but I would have to spend some time digging to find that at this point. Not to mention the pixel density difference (which it sight but the more for crop the more it will matter) and the loss of the ISO advantage once cropping down that far.
Anyway after comparing the D850 to the D500, for wildlife and BIF that I needed to crop, there was no advantage in IQ unless I mostly filled the frame and ISO performance over the D500 so I sold the D850 as it was a luxury to have a $3k camera for very little street and Macro photography.
Eric214 wrote:
Good for you, glad your can't tell.
The image size I got was 19.2mp on my D850 when I had it. I can't remember now if I cropped an image or shit in DX mode but thought it was cropping the 45.7mp image, not shooting in DX crop mode. Someone else also looked and found it was 19.2mp, I think it was on DPReview but I would have to spend some time digging to find that at this point. Not to mention the pixel density difference (which it sight but the more for crop the more it will matter) and the loss of the ISO advantage once cropping down that far.
Anyway after comparing the D850 to the D500, for wildlife and BIF that I needed to crop, there was no advantage in IQ unless I mostly filled the frame and ISO performance over the D500 so I sold the D850 as it was a luxury to have a $3k camera for very little street and Macro photography....Show more →
After reading your post it got me curious so I went back in my files to see what the actual file sizes are that the camera produces.
D850 FX: 8256x5504=45.4MP
D850 DX: 5408x3600=19.5MP
D500: 5568x3712=20.7MP
D850 proper DX crop in post from an FX file: 5504x3669=20.2MP
So basically for whatever reason the in camera DX mode of the D850 does a little more than a DX crop and gives you that 19.5MP files instead of a in post true DX crop that would be 20.2MP and equalize the FOV from the D500.
So we are now 0.5MP difference between a cropped D500 vs in-post cropped D850.
To me 0.5MP is so meaningless...we are talking about 64 extra linear pixels. But as I noted in my previous replies, at the pixel level the D500 file does have slightly better noise and slightly better DR vs the D850 DX cropped file. Plus those extra 0.5MP. But I still think that should be the last thing anyone takes into consideration when choosing between the two bodies. I sold my D850 for basically the same reasons you did...not enough images that could really take advantage of the FX frame to make the $3K camera worthwhile. I also had the additional reason of having a few too many other cameras from other systems so had to downsize something.
arbitrage wrote:
After reading your post it got me curious so I went back in my files to see what the actual file sizes are that the camera produces.
D850 FX: 8256x5504=45.4MP
D850 DX: 5408x3600=19.5MP
D500: 5568x3712=20.7MP
D850 proper DX crop in post from an FX file: 5504x3669=20.2MP
So basically for whatever reason the in camera DX mode of the D850 does a little more than a DX crop and gives you that 19.5MP files instead of a in post true DX crop that would be 20.2MP and equalize the FOV from the D500.
So we are now 0.5MP difference between a cropped D500 vs in-post cropped D850.
To me 0.5MP is so meaningless...we are talking about 64 extra linear pixels. But as I noted in my previous replies, at the pixel level the D500 file does have slightly better noise and slightly better DR vs the D850 DX cropped file. Plus those extra 0.5MP. But I still think that should be the last thing anyone takes into consideration when choosing between the two bodies. I sold my D850 for basically the same reasons you did...not enough images that could really take advantage of the FX frame to make the $3K camera worthwhile. I also had the additional reason of having a few too many other cameras from other systems so had to downsize something....Show more →
Yeah my memory had it reversed it was the Iin camera DX crop then that was the 19.x mp crop size. Either way, I never said it was huge or very meaningful on it's own, just stating it and long with a lower pixel density on the D850 45.7mp sensor, I was able to see a difference. I also have 3 4k calibrated LG monitors so what I see is significantly more detail in my images compared to my 1080p monitors I had previously (bought the 4k monitors in July) and maybe what others see if they are using a 1080p monitor.
The D850 is my go-to because when the animal is close enough, I want the 45mpx file, not 20 something. Also, the D850 White Balance is easier on me (with my Daltonism) than the D500's WB.
Don't get me wrong, the D500 is the ultimate DX. I love the camera and believe I'll always keep it. Do wish the D850 was as quiet as the D500
I deeply crop many D850 images and get great detail. Of course, everything must be right at release, and over 90% are deleted in the first step of post anyway (so they don't get that far) I feel that atmospherics are of no concern because I shoot *only* from first direct sunlight until mid-morning.
Can't wait to see Nikon's D850 upgrade. NR better be right with his predictions.
The D850 is my go-to because when the animal is close enough, I want the 45mpx file, not 20 something. Also, the D850 White Balance is easier on me (with my Daltonism) than the D500's WB.
Don't get me wrong, the D500 is the ultimate DX. I love the camera and believe I'll always keep it. Do wish the D850 was as quiet as the D500
I deeply crop many D850 images and get great detail. Of course, everything must be right at release, and over 90% are deleted in the first step of post anyway (so they don't get that far) I feel that atmospherics are of no concern because I shoot *only* from first direct sunlight until mid-morning.
Can't wait to see Nikon's D850 upgrade. NR better be right with his predictions. ...Show more →
I agree totally. If filling the frame or at least 3/4 then the D850 detail will certainly be better than the D500 as you're not cropping down that far. I find I still crop the D500 images at 500mm often enough that the D850 wasn't worth the cost for it to sit in my bag the majority of the time.
Ya know, when it comes right down to it, all of these cameras are insanely capable and we're really just splitting hairs. I think we're all also saying the same thing in the end that the D850 is the choice if you can fill the frame but if you're cropping down to the D500 FOV/image size, then there isn't much benefit over the D500.
