p.9 #1 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
DavidBM wrote:
It might need to be. The front element is really close to the front of the lens, unlike the 65 where it is so recessed there's basically a built in hood.
Yes that front element is darn close to the edge. I would buy a metal screw in myself
p.9 #3 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Loxia is manual focus.
imagesfromobjects wrote
I'm 100‰ getting this 21- not at all interested in the Loxia due to size and price and preference for MF. I'd love faster, but the size is perfect, so I'll manage
p.9 #4 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
It's an interesting situation, Cosina have a vested interest in not surpassing comparable loxiae since they want those to sell and if they weren't better they wouldn't justify the price premium. The 35's are quite different though both 'classic' designs. The 65 surpasses the 50 loxia but the FL/size are different enough.
I prefer the CV ergonomics (front aperture ring) so it will be interesting to see what happens with the 21 skopar.
I like that CV aren't tied to a specific filter thread, allowing more freedom in design, but just having 52mm filters is also convenient.
p.9 #5 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Does anyone here actually know the arrangement that Voigtlander ana Zeiss have with Cosina?
If they are simply a manufacturer why would they care about what sells and what doesn’t?
Mar 03, 2018 at 12:22 AM
imagesfromobjects Offline • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.9 #6 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
thrice wrote:
Loxia is manual focus.
Ah, I stand corrected. Was under the impression it was AF plus focus-by-wire.
Doesn't change things for me, though. My 40/1.2 reminds me of my Takumars. And if I can get a lens with that same build quality and tactile perfection with modern coatings AND optimised for the Sony sensor?
What more could I want.
Well, maybe a 35mm Bessa E mount body, so I can see how they handle Ektar, but that's a stretch. Would be p sweet, though.
Mar 03, 2018 at 12:24 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.9 #7 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
davewolfs wrote:
Does anyone here actually know the arrangement that Voigtlander ana Zeiss have with Cosina?
If they are simply a manufacturer why would they care about what sells and what doesn’t?
Voigtlander isn't a company, it is a name that Cosina bought the rights to. Voigtlander lenses are Cosina lenses. Cosina is the manufacturer for Zeiss Loxia (and Milvus) lenses, but Zeiss designs and presumably specifies how they would like them manufactured and contracts Cosina to build them. They are simply a manufacturer for Zeiss Loxia lenses, but they are completely responsible for Voigtlander lenses.
p.9 #8 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Steve Spencer wrote:
Zeiss designs and presumably specifies how they would like them manufactured and contracts Cosina to build them.
Can we be so sure about that? I mean it is pretty obvious that Tamron more or less designed the Zeiss Batis line hence the patents are holf by Tamron, not Zeiss.
I have seen no clear cut statements or evidence that the Loxia line was developed 100% or even 50% in-house by Zeiss. We don't know the name of a lens designer or a team of designers behind them.
I have also seen no evidence that Cosina had a part in developing it but they would be an obvious partner and I don't think we can say with good certainty that they had no part in the development.
p.9 #9 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Phillip, the lineage from Contax C/Y-to-ZE/ZF-to-Milvus is fairly well established, "suggesting" Zeiss designs rather than Cosina, and the parentage between Loxia and "other" Zeiss MF lenses is palpable, including in the Zeiss organisation (same product manager).... In the case of Batis there are Tamron patents, and I don't know of similar Cosina patents covering Loxia or Milvus territory.
OTOH, until fairly recently CV lenses, with one exception (125mm macro) essentially did not overshadow -read: take business away from- Zeiss lenses. This has now changed in a big way with the 65 and the 40, and very probably with the forthcoming 110. I would not be surprised if that heralded changes to come in the relationship between the 2 companies.
p.9 #10 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
philber wrote:
"suggesting" Zeiss designs rather than Cosina
That's the point I was trying to make: We don't have good evidence that these lenses were in fact developed "directly by Zeiss". As you I think they likely are but I wouldn't treat that as a fact.
p.9 #11 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Phillip, I would like to offer another possibility. Until recently, Zeiss MF lenses outperformed CV products (a broad statement, with the one obvious exception noted above). This "suggests" that the key talent rested within the Zeiss organisation rather than within Cosina.
Recent CV lenses show that there is some form of "talent equivalent to Zeiss" behind their designs. This suggests that Zeiss may be designing CV lenses for Cosina, doesn't it? After all, we do not have clear cut statements or evidence that the newer CV lenses line are developed 100% or even 50% in-house by Cosina. We don't know the name of a lens designer or a team of designers behind them (copyright Phillip Reeve). And Zeiss have done third-party designs in the past, such as for Hasselblad.
So?
p.9 #12 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Well, one of those two companies has a very valuable brand and there are quite a few cases where it has monetized on it. At times with questionable results (ZA 4/24-70 for example).
p.9 #18 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
It never really bothered me with the CV 125 and I'd actually be more concerned if it didn't extend similarly. That would imply a drastically different design.
-Tim
Mar 03, 2018 at 07:06 AM
Steve Spencer Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.9 #19 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
Phillip Reeve wrote:
Well, one of those two companies has a very valuable brand and there are quite a few cases where it has monetized on it. At times with questionable results (ZA 4/24-70 for example).
Actually both of the companies has a valuable brand. Zeiss of course has the Zeiss brand and Cosina has the Voigtlander brand and I think they have both monetized the brand that they own, and at times with questionable results.
p.9 #20 · Pre-order: Voigtlander 110/2.5 Macro APO for $1,099
I went to CP+ today and managed to use the demo version of this lens (i.e. CV APO-Lanthar 110/2.5) for some minutes at Cosina area. I shot some random stuff at their lens test area where they had some plants and garden tools and a mailbox. No real Macro shots and I kept the aperture at f2.5 and ISO640 to keep the shutter speed at reasonable level.
I think the IQ will be very similar to that of CV 65/2 as could be expected. It looks very sharp as expected and I like the bokeh based on initial sampling. Handling felt similar to 65/2 as well. In the end I compared the 2 lenses for weight (my CV 65/2 in one hand and demo 110/2.5 in the other) and asked Cosina people about the weight as well. They did say that 110/2.5 is heavier (without mentioning specific weight) and I could feel quite much difference in weights, so I think 110/2.5 will actually be at least 800g or so.
The lens name for the demo lens seems to be misspelled in EXIF as APO-LANTHER, but this time they don't seem to have a special CP+ designation in EXIF data like last year.
