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Archive 2017 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test

  
 
Makten
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p.13 #1 · p.13 #1 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


GMPhotography wrote:
Hey there ain't no bloody snow here. I'm in the Desert. Lol

Just kidding




Those are old images. No snow yet, but probably in december or at least january. But first a couple of dark, wet months in total misery.
Anyway, I hope you get what I mean with mid distance. The wider the lens, the more likely it is to render terribly when you're focusing somewhere in the middle between infinity and closeups.



Sep 24, 2017 at 02:06 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #2 · p.13 #2 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Makten wrote:


Those are old images. No snow yet, but probably in december or at least january. But first a couple of dark, wet months in total misery.
Anyway, I hope you get what I mean with mid distance. The wider the lens, the more likely it is to render terribly when you're focusing somewhere in the middle between infinity and closeups.


Aside from the Sonnar 35/2, are there any other lenses doing very well in this area?



Sep 24, 2017 at 02:10 PM
Steve Spencer
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p.13 #3 · p.13 #3 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Fred Miranda wrote:
Aside from the Sonnar 35/2, are there any other lenses doing very well in this area?


Makten, can answer for himself, but I think the ZE/ZF.2 classic 35 f/1.4 does and probably the Milvus 35 f/1.4 will do pretty well. Smaller lenses that is tougher. I think the mid distance is the achilles heel for my ZM 35 f/1.4.



Sep 24, 2017 at 02:27 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #4 · p.13 #4 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Steve Spencer wrote:
Makten, can answer for himself, but I think the ZE/ZF.2 classic 35 f/1.4 does and probably the Milvus 35 f/1.4 will do pretty well. Smaller lenses that is tougher. I think the mid distance is the achilles heel for my ZM 35 f/1.4.


Agree Steve. The FE 35/1.4 ZA does well in this area as well. I'm curious to see how the CV 35/1.7 performs at mid-distance (Makten style) towards the edges with the front-lens.



Sep 24, 2017 at 02:42 PM
Makten
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p.13 #5 · p.13 #5 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Fred Miranda wrote:
Aside from the Sonnar 35/2, are there any other lenses doing very well in this area?


No, I'd say there are no 35 mm lenses at all doing "very well" here. Just more or less OK. The Sonnar is great at all distances, but the background blur is also high contrast, which makes it a bit "clinical".

Stopping down a little bit is often helping a lot. Which is counterintuitive since it also lessens the blur, but nice blur is better than much blur, in my opinion.
The ZF 35/1.4 is very nice in this regard. The OOF areas are lower contrast, so even if the blur discs are kind of "edgy", it looks great at distance. The Loxia works the same way; harsh bokeh but low contrast blur. I prefer that over the Sonnar rendering actually. And, I think the CV 35/1.7 looks more like the Sonnar than the Loxia.

The best example of a lens that does exactly what I want in this regard, is the ZF 50/1.4 stopped down to ~f/2.4. The bokeh is absolutely stellar even at 5-7 meters distance. But the focal length is too narrow for my taste.

Edit: I think I have very similar "bokeh taste" as @Samuli Vahonen.



Sep 24, 2017 at 02:54 PM
sebboh
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p.13 #6 · p.13 #6 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Fred Miranda wrote:
Aside from the Sonnar 35/2, are there any other lenses doing very well in this area?


the ZA 35/1.4 is actually really good here. both it and the rx1 sonnar actually get worse on stopping down though imo. another good one is the lux pre-asph, it's got terrible bokeh closeup, but smooths out nicely at a distance. of course it was designed to have a 1m mfd. the current lux is terrible at mid distance...




Sep 24, 2017 at 03:45 PM
jlehet
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p.13 #7 · p.13 #7 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


This was exposed exactly one year ago tomorrow with my CV 35 1.7. I really like the bokeh of this lens. And without the front filter, the corners are good if that's where you focus. It's just the curvature that can be a problem without the front lens. (edited to add that it was at f2.8)

http://www.lehet.com/photo/800/morning_glories_gold_light2016a7r2-9155.jpg



Sep 24, 2017 at 05:03 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #8 · p.13 #8 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Another one at f/4 (CV 35/1.7 + Hawks)







Sep 24, 2017 at 08:48 PM
Charlie N
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p.13 #9 · p.13 #9 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


jhinkey wrote:
Though Oct. 5 is the rumored US announcement date, it may be a while to get one in hand.
I'm planning on getting the Ultron+5mPCX soon. My only question is used or new on the 35/1.7 Ultron.


too hard finding Used deals, and I'm actually on my second copy, my first was decentered bad enough to bother me, had no issues getting a replacement after showing the test shots to prove it.

779 through photovilliage or cameraquest, the only two distributors for voigtlander, I think if you needed a repair, you'de have to go through those guys. Needed a repair from one of the bigger photo dealers, and they simply could not help me.



Sep 24, 2017 at 09:02 PM
twomblywhite
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p.13 #10 · p.13 #10 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test




Fred Miranda wrote:
Another one at f/4 (CV 35/1.7 + Hawks)


Nice image! composition and color... Love that subtle green in the upper left.



Sep 24, 2017 at 09:11 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #11 · p.13 #11 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Charlie N wrote:
too hard finding Used deals, and I'm actually on my second copy, my first was decentered bad enough to bother me, had no issues getting a replacement after showing the test shots to prove it.

779 through photovilliage or cameraquest, the only two distributors for voigtlander, I think if you needed a repair, you'de have to go through those guys. Needed a repair from one of the bigger photo dealers, and they simply could not help me.


I'm sorry to hear that! I bought this one from the Buy and Sell board ($580). Didn't know there was variance with this lens so I think I just got lucky with this copy as it is well centered.



Sep 24, 2017 at 09:43 PM
sebboh
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p.13 #12 · p.13 #12 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Charlie N wrote:
too hard finding Used deals, and I'm actually on my second copy, my first was decentered bad enough to bother me, had no issues getting a replacement after showing the test shots to prove it.

779 through photovilliage or cameraquest, the only two distributors for voigtlander, I think if you needed a repair, you'de have to go through those guys. Needed a repair from one of the bigger photo dealers, and they simply could not help me.


it's just a mechanical lens, most issues can usually be fixed by any local shop for a low price. if you might want to return it though that makes sense.




Sep 24, 2017 at 10:33 PM
Charlie N
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p.13 #13 · p.13 #13 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


sebboh wrote:
it's just a mechanical lens, most issues can usually be fixed by any local shop for a low price. if you might want to return it though that makes sense.



That's what I thought too, but I tried a few repair shops for my CV 10, and no one would touch it. Actually, no one wants to touch my cy 100-300 either. I have the smallest bit of Haze on an element edge, no one will touch it. Not a big deal as it doesn't affect IQ, but future longevity is questionable.



Sep 25, 2017 at 12:00 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #14 · p.13 #14 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Charlie N wrote:
That's what I thought too, but I tried a few repair shops for my CV 10, and no one would touch it. Actually, no one wants to touch my cy 100-300 either. I have the smallest bit of Haze on an element edge, no one will touch it. Not a big deal as it doesn't affect IQ, but future longevity is questionable.


You gotta get these lenses right. I was told by a reliable source that CV lenses are boutique lenses because they lack adjustments. If tilted or decentered, elements won't be able to be adjusted at the shop. Not saying it's true or false, just happen to trust the source.



Sep 25, 2017 at 12:25 AM
sebboh
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p.13 #15 · p.13 #15 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


sebboh wrote:
it's just a mechanical lens, most issues can usually be fixed by any local shop for a low price. if you might want to return it though that makes sense.


Charlie N wrote:
That's what I thought too, but I tried a few repair shops for my CV 10, and no one would touch it. Actually, no one wants to touch my cy 100-300 either. I have the smallest bit of Haze on an element edge, no one will touch it. Not a big deal as it doesn't affect IQ, but future longevity is questionable.


Fred Miranda wrote:
You gotta get these lenses right. I was told by a reliable source that CV lenses are boutique lenses because they lack adjustments. If tilted or decentered, elements won't be able to be adjusted at the shop. Not saying it's true or false, just happen to trust the source.


mechanical problems with lens movements and stuff on the glass are easy to fix. i've know shops that do for voigtlanders in Chicago, SF, and Portland (all the places i've lived), all for under $100.

fixing decentering/misalignment is another issue entirely. it depends on the lens design whether it's easy to do or not, but usually requires precision equipment to test (some shops will still be willing to fiddle and see if they can fix it).



Sep 25, 2017 at 12:52 AM
DavidBM
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p.13 #16 · p.13 #16 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Fred Miranda wrote:
You gotta get these lenses right. I was told by a reliable source that CV lenses are boutique lenses because they lack adjustments. If tilted or decentered, elements won't be able to be adjusted at the shop. Not saying it's true or false, just happen to trust the source.


Your trusted source may be different; but Roger Circala has said this on a public forum (either this one or comments on his own blog)!



Sep 25, 2017 at 01:52 AM
GMPhotography
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p.13 #17 · p.13 #17 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Charlie N wrote:
That's what I thought too, but I tried a few repair shops for my CV 10, and no one would touch it. Actually, no one wants to touch my cy 100-300 either. I have the smallest bit of Haze on an element edge, no one will touch it. Not a big deal as it doesn't affect IQ, but future longevity is questionable.


Charlie google Tempe Camera here in Tempe Arizona

They been around well over 30 years fixing all my Hassy gear over the years. Very nice folks and they maybe able to repair CV glass.



Sep 25, 2017 at 08:48 AM
GMPhotography
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p.13 #18 · p.13 #18 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


I've run out of time for more testing this week as I'm traveling for some real shooting. Hope I get a lot of uses for this lens on the road to post some images

Fred should have all his parts for the CV so hopefully will see some more images from him as well



Sep 25, 2017 at 09:05 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.13 #19 · p.13 #19 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Update: Got my PCX 5m front-lens today!

I received two adapters from K&F Concept (Both from Amazon). One reached infinity and the other didn't. So, there is variability here and one may have to buy a few to get one that works.

My Hawks didn't reached infinity with the fron-lens either. Surprisingly TAP (TechArt Pro) gave me infinity but it was precisely at the lens hard stop. (So, it may not work for other's CV 35 and TAP copies)

At infinity, there is a big improvement towards the edges. I'd say that f/5.6 is the optimum aperture and it matched my Loxia 35/2 (I do have an amazing copy of the Loxia). The PCX fixed the induced field curvature and now I'm getting the same results focusing at center, mid or extreme edges at infinity. This is a big plus for landscapes.

Here is how I built the PCX combo: (Weight: 28g)
46-55mm ring, blank 55 (Tiffen brand), 5m PCX and El-pro3 retaining ring. I used a rubber O-ring to keep the front-lens perfectly centered.

The ZM 35/1.4 + PCX definitely has sharper extreme corners at f/5.6 but the CV 35/1.7 Ultron is very strong center and mid-field. Pick your poison.

The Ultron is also sharper than the Loxia 35/2 at f/2 and f/2.8 and therefore I will sell my Loxia. (If anyone is interested let me know by PM before I put it for sale). For landscapes it's a draw. The Loxia has more contrast towards the edges. Both have similar sunstar rendering.

To me, the CV 35/1.7 is more versatile because it can be used for landscapes and environment portraits/street from wide open. The drawback is no EXIF info and a bit longer length. (when compared to the Loxia)



Sep 28, 2017 at 08:38 PM
GMPhotography
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p.13 #20 · p.13 #20 · Sony FE 35mm 1.4 VS. Voigtlander 35mm 1.7 Big Bronco Test


Fred and my copies of the Ultron matched the same focusing spots both with filter on and off so I ordered a TAP for myself after he told me if his settings and confirmed infinity. I should have a bunch of shots to post when I get back to Phoenix. Having a lot of fun with it

When I update my A9 and get the TAP I’ll update the AF abilities



Sep 28, 2017 at 09:53 PM
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