p.60 #1 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
arbitrage wrote:
Shooting them at the correct ISO in camera is critical to obtaining the best possible image.
I guess my slide-film-shooting, dinosaur roots are showing. I was never really taught to do anything other than this ^ when aiming for the best possible IQ.
On this graph if the line is horizontal like D7200 the camera is invariant.
See above.
We can see that 6D2 and D5 are better from ISO 2500 onwards and up there you can underexpose with little penalty.
This is the equitability (nearly) to which I was inferring.
The 5D4 is much better especially after ISO 320.
Meaning the 5D4 is much better at being ISO invariant ... which isn't necessarily the same thing as saying it has better IQ (see dinosaurus approacharamus above) when properly exposed. Is that correct?
And, what does this chart say about ISO 50 for the 6D2? It looks to be lower than the others at ISO 50 on the chart.
p.60 #2 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
I just had a look at the sample 6D Mark II CR2s at Imaging Resource. Can someone tell me what we've been arguing about for the past 6 weeks?
Frankly, these images look excellent to me. On a number of levels.
Judging from these, I could happily shoot this camera and have zero qualms from an image quality perspective. But then, I don't make it habit to underexpose by 5 f-stops, and have zero interest in ISO-invariance trickery.
For those that do, however, I think Rusty may be on to something with his take on the ISO 50 image. Push the exposure in LR multiple stops and noise remains relatively well controlled. Perhaps this camera could still be an option for landscapers looking for a budget full frame body in EF mount.
Despite all the doom/gloom hur-dur, at the end of the day I suspect most purchasers will find this camera to be crackerjack.
p.60 #3 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
RustyBug wrote:
I guess my slide-film-shooting, dinosaur roots are showing. I was never really taught to do anything other than this ^ when aiming for the best possible IQ.
See above.
This is the equitability (nearly) to which I was inferring.
Meaning the 5D4 is much better at being ISO invariant ... which isn't necessarily the same thing as saying it has better IQ (see dinosaurus approacharamus above) when properly exposed. Is that correct?
And, what does this chart say about ISO 50 for the 6D2? It looks to be lower than the others at ISO 50 on the chart.
Yes, 5D4 just more invariant from a lower ISO onwards although still has a slight upwards trend so you don't want to be pushing 5 stops. Not sure about that slight dip in the 6D2 at ISO 50 (just margin of error?). If not then it means there could be the slightest benefit from not raising shadows from ISO 50 and better to shoot at ISO 100 if 100 is the best ISO to be at...but really it is so close I can't see it meaning anything.
p.60 #4 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
garyvot wrote:
I just had a look at the sample 6D Mark II CR2s at Imaging Resource. Can someone tell me what we've been arguing about for the past 6 weeks?
Frankly, these images look excellent to me. On a number of levels.
Judging from these, I could happily shoot this camera and have zero qualms from an image quality perspective. But then, I don't make it habit to underexpose by 5 f-stops, and have zero interest in ISO-invariance trickery.
For those that do, however, I think Rusty may be on to something with his take on the ISO 50 image. Push the exposure in LR multiple stops and noise remains relatively well controlled. Perhaps this camera could still be an option for landscapers looking for a budget full frame body in EF mount.
Despite all the doom/gloom hur-dur, at the end of the day I suspect most purchasers will find this camera to be crackerjack. ...Show more →
p.60 #6 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
arbitrage wrote:
Yes, 5D4 just more invariant from a lower ISO onwards although still has a slight upwards trend so you don't want to be pushing 5 stops....
I don't even know how to push 5 stops in Lightroom without totally blowing the whites. The exposure slider sure goes there with nuclear results at the other end but the shadow/highlight sliders can't get me anywhere near that much latitude. So can someone explain why 5 stops is even relevant?
p.60 #9 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
Jeff Nolten wrote:
I don't even know how to push 5 stops in Lightroom without totally blowing the whites. The exposure slider sure goes there with nuclear results at the other end but the shadow/highlight sliders can't get me anywhere near that much latitude. So can someone explain why 5 stops is even relevant?
Yes you make a good point. If you underexpose by 5 stops to protect some highlights then it is difficult to work the sliders to get back everything without blowing highlights. But the highlight detail is there because you protected them. It usually requires full shadow lift available, full highlight pull down available and then up the actual exposure as much as you can....maybe have to bring the whites slider down also. All in all it isn't the best way to shoot. But a couple of stops underexposed to protect highlights on a ISO invariant sensor like a D7200 or D500 can be an excellent way to shoot.
p.60 #10 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
garyvot wrote:
I just had a look at the sample 6D Mark II CR2s at Imaging Resource. Can someone tell me what we've been arguing about for the past 6 weeks?
Frankly, these images look excellent to me. On a number of levels.
Judging from these, I could happily shoot this camera and have zero qualms from an image quality perspective. But then, I don't make it habit to underexpose by 5 f-stops, and have zero interest in ISO-invariance trickery.
For those that do, however, I think Rusty may be on to something with his take on the ISO 50 image. Push the exposure in LR multiple stops and noise remains relatively well controlled. Perhaps this camera could still be an option for landscapers looking for a budget full frame body in EF mount.
Despite all the doom/gloom hur-dur, at the end of the day I suspect most purchasers will find this camera to be crackerjack. ...Show more →
I'm sorry to inform you but the days of having skill, nailing exposure and actually processing your images are long gone. Now people just like to shoot at whatever settings, then just play with the exposure slider in post and that's it :P
I always laugh when I see people complain about the IQ of any camera when they are pushing an image by 3-6 stops. If they need to push that much, they should complain about their skills not the camera!
p.60 #11 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
Dlee13 wrote:
I'm sorry to inform you but the days of having skill, nailing exposure and actually processing your images are long gone. Now people just like to shoot at whatever settings, then just play with the exposure slider in post and that's it :P
That's absolute buffalo shit. Speak for yourself perhaps.
p.60 #12 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
Dlee13 wrote:
I'm sorry to inform you but the days of having skill, nailing exposure and actually processing your images are long gone. Now people just like to shoot at whatever settings, then just play with the exposure slider in post and that's it :P
Paul Mo wrote:
That's absolute buffalo shit. Speak for yourself perhaps.
p.60 #15 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
Dlee13 wrote:
I always laugh when I see people complain about the IQ of any camera when they are pushing an image by 3-6 stops. If they need to push that much, they should complain about their skills not the camera!
What about lens corrections? I find a number of wider lenses take a lot of correction, and I end up with nasty colour noise on the sides and corners, even without shadow pushes. The sigma 20mm art and 16-35 f4 seem to be prone to it. I believe the new 16-35 f2.8 is even worse?
That's one of the reasons I'd like to see better pushing ability
p.60 #16 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
EB-1 wrote:
Some sarcasm, perhaps.
EBH
Maybe just a tiny bit ;D
Isaacheus wrote:
What about lens corrections? I find a number of wider lenses take a lot of correction, and I end up with nasty colour noise on the sides and corners, even without shadow pushes. The sigma 20mm art and 16-35 f4 seem to be prone to it. I believe the new 16-35 f2.8 is even worse?
That's one of the reasons I'd like to see better pushing ability
If a lens underexposed the corners by more than 2 stops I would honestly wonder why anyone would bother even buying it!
I'm not saying that there would never be a case of having to push an image by more than 2 stops, but if that's someone thing relies on then it would be quite a worry.
p.60 #17 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
Doesn't that rule out a large number of fairly common lenses? At least when they are used wide open.
It's not going to affect all situations but I think quite a few drop 2 or 3 ev when used wide open, 24-70 2.8 mk2, 16-35 2.8 mk3, 17—40 etc.
Not saying the ability to push and pull is the be all end all of iq, it is helpful though
Dlee13 wrote:
Maybe just a tiny bit ;D
If a lens underexposed the corners by more than 2 stops I would honestly wonder why anyone would bother even buying it!
I'm not saying that there would never be a case of having to push an image by more than 2 stops, but if that's someone thing relies on then it would be quite a worry.
p.60 #19 · Official: Canon Announces the EOS 6D Mark II
Flowernut wrote:
I used to have a pentax spot meter and shoot in the manual mode. Now lets see. On the dial P stands for professional mode. which one is manual?
Dunno about Pentax but my "M" has an "advanced mode plus" to complement the standard M mode:
Meaning the 5D4 is much better at being ISO invariant ... which isn't necessarily the same thing as saying it has better IQ (see dinosaurus approacharamus above) when properly exposed. Is that correct? 
