p.15 #1 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Steve Spencer wrote:
I think if the Batis 135 sells well, then my guess would be a Batis 200 f/2.8 will be next. I think Sony is going to make a GM 200 f/2 at some point, so a Sony Batis 200 f/2.8 APO for $2,200 would be quite nice for Zeiss and if the Batis 135 sells well, then I would think a 200 f/2.8 would as well. I think they might also make a macro someday, but I am not sure what that would be. I would think that Zeiss might make a 60 f/2.8 or a 100 f/2.8 macro, but those have pretty stiff competition from the Sony FE 50 f/2.8 and the Sony G 90 f/2.8 respectively. If I had to guess it might be a 120 f/4, which would allow them to keep it fairly small. I think that would be an interesting lens and I would likely get it....Show more →
I think there will also be stiff competition from the Voigtländer 65/2 Apo Macro Lanthar. The old Voigtländer 125/2.5 Apo Macro Lanthar from Cosina has an excellent reputation. So three strong macro options already. By mentioning 120/4, do you have the Contax Zeiss 645 lens in mind?
p.15 #2 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Bespoked wrote:
The Batis aren't manufacturers lenses, to some (my company) it's important to have as much support as possible form the equipment manufacturer and my local Sony store doesn't sell or support Zeiss products (which is understandable), so it's only really with this release of wides that the Sony system resembles a complete system to rival what we were using form Nikon, that is 12mm to 85mm native OE options.
I can't get any support from Sony store or Sony Australia if my camera isn't functioning properly with a Batis or Loxia, hence our hesitation to buy from Zeiss.
The other issue with Zeiss is that they are the only third party lens provider to charge more than the OE option, which is strange, you don't see Sigma and Tamron using that business model, it's not working for Zeiss and the more lenses Sony release, than worse that problem will be.
A Batis 50 will sell, but not wel given the coverage Sony has in that FL, the only reason Batis 85 sold in the numbers it did was becuase there were no native AF options at the time....Show more →
Zeiss' business model works well for them, and has always been that way. It works for their DSLR lenses as well as E mount lenses. Only for Leica M is Zeiss lenses cheaper than the manufacturers lenses. Zeiss is not Sigma or Tamron or Tokina, though all are capable lens manufacturers today.
One reason (out of many) to go Sony, is to get Zeiss or Sony/Zeiss lenses.
p.15 #3 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Zeiss are in what appears to be a unique situation, as no one else offers ranges of both manual focus lenses and modern AF lenses virtually in parallel for one mount, both at the high end. They market two very different lines in Loxia and Batis. These ranges have been painstakingly differentiated in: marketing, materials, design and manufacture, to the point people talk about the Batis and Loxia 'look and feel'. [And let me give a shout out to the fine work in the Batis image thread.]
They are targeted at two very different 'photographer demographics'. They complement each other; you might buy a Loxia 21mm for landscapes and a Batis 85mm for portraits. That's the rationale for the need for Zeiss to fill out the range between 25mm and 85mm - simply put, it is incomplete. A Batis 50/1.4 and 35/2 would attract great interest among those not fully satisfied by the current offerings by Sony (fast-large/slow-tiny) or Zeiss (MF). [with RX1, it's understandable Sony has eschewed the notion of a 35/2 in FE.] It might be safe to say that 50% of all prime lenses in lens ranges are in the 35-50mm bracket, another reason to go ahead.
p.15 #4 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Randolph K wrote:
Whoa, that's a first!
Seriously though, Sony has come a long way in a relatively short period of time in regards to their FE system. Seems like just yesterday people were throwing fits about lens selection. Now with Sony's FE's, the Loxia's, Batis's, lenses such as the Samyang's, soon to be released Voigtländer's, etc, there are now MANY options to choose from without needing to venture out into lenses from other camera systems / adapters, etc.
It is kind of funny how, other than at the telephoto end, in two years we have gone from "there aren't enough lenses" to "there are too many great lenses and I can't decide which awesome lens to choose".
p.15 #5 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Bespoked wrote:
That's great for them (and their employees).
I don't think most of their profit is from camera lenses, I have a friend that works for them (and Leica) selling medical equipment and we think that's where most of the income is collected.
Don't Tamron and Cosina make lenses for Zeiss?
There's a rumour that Sigma also private label for Zeiss, which makes sense to me.
Zeiss is more of a marketing brand and less of a manufacturer every year.
Don't really care how and who builds their lenses. I'm extremely happy with my Zeiss gear and it delivers a unique image which Sigma, Tamron nor Tokina can create.
p.15 #6 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Bespoked wrote:
I don't think most of their profit is from camera lenses, I have a friend that works for them (and Leica) selling medical equipment and we think that's where most of the income is collected.
Leica Camera, Leica Microsystems, Leica Biosystems, and Leica Geosystems are separate companies. Leica Camera itself is again a profitable company by itself now.
p.15 #7 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Fred Miranda wrote:
I've pre-ordered both 12-24G and 16-35GM and will compare it against my 16-35/4 and Loxia 21 and CV 12 lenses.
I'm looking to replace my 17-35/2.8D AFS Nikkor - this lens has excellent flare/ghosting characteristics, but shows it's design age at 36MP. As part of my gradual transition over to the Sony A series from the D8XX Nikon the 16-35/2.8 GM looks very attractive, though it does appear to be quite a bit larger than the Nikkor (but a bit lighter).
p.15 #11 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Bespoked wrote:
That's great for them (and their employees).
I don't think most of their profit is from camera lenses, I have a friend that works for them (and Leica) selling medical equipment and we think that's where most of the income is collected.
Don't Tamron and Cosina make lenses for Zeiss?
There's a rumour that Sigma also private label for Zeiss, which makes sense to me.
Zeiss is more of a marketing brand and less of a manufacturer every year.
There isn't any inherent competitive advantages in this day and age with maintaining a vertically integrated design, marketing and manufacturing organization. What Zeiss has done with batis and loxia lenses is no different than what apple has done with the iPhone. Cosina, Tamron and likely Sigma are all well established contract manufacturers in the same way Foxconn is in the consumer electronics side. As long as you can maintain proper quality control and incorporate your company's design language, it really doesn't who manufactures it or where its manufactured. The real value is in product design, marketing and quality control today.
You're also probably right that Zeiss probably makes more money from its other divisions than camera lenses but I'm glad they still offer consumer products nonetheless.
p.15 #12 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
I noticed this this past weekend shooting some group photos for a friend's wedding. I carried a Batis 25 and a GM 24-70. I shot the zoom at the wide end. When I pulled up the files in post I had to spend an additional 30 seconds or so adjusting a few sliders to match the Zeiss characteristic. I couldn't replicate the microcontrast, but no one I know who isn't a photographer with experience with these lenses would notice it, let alone friends grateful for a few well-composed pictures.
I preordered the 16-35 and am expecting a total package for the price of entry. It should replace several lenses if I'm willing to part with them
GMPhotography wrote:
Zeiss glass tends to have more micro contrast and saturation. But you can come very close to it .
p.15 #13 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Justin Stone wrote:
I noticed this this past weekend shooting some group photos for a friend's wedding. I carried a Batis 25 and a GM 24-70. I shot the zoom at the wide end. When I pulled up the files in post I had to spend an additional 30 seconds or so adjusting a few sliders to match the Zeiss characteristic. I couldn't replicate the microcontrast, but no one I know who isn't a photographer with experience with these lenses would notice it, let alone friends grateful for a few well-composed pictures.
I preordered the 16-35 and am expecting a total package for the price of entry. It should replace several lenses if I'm willing to part with them
The Batis 25/2 is an awesome lens. It definitely has that 3D pop which is a Zeiss trademark. Its rendering is smooth for a wide angle which contributes to its special look. Love the colors as well. The only downsize is LoCA which is a little high for my taste.
p.15 #14 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Haha. Hence the photographer with experience using both lenses noticing the difference!
The B25 was my first lens for Sony E mount. It arrived about 3 weeks before my Sony a7R2. Memories...
Fred Miranda wrote:
The Batis 25/2 is an awesome lens. It definitely has that 3D pop which is a Zeiss trademark. Its rendering is smooth for a wide angle which contributes to its special look. Love the colors as well. The only downsize is LoCA which is a little high for my taste.
p.15 #16 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Justin Stone wrote:
I noticed this this past weekend shooting some group photos for a friend's wedding. I carried a Batis 25 and a GM 24-70. I shot the zoom at the wide end. When I pulled up the files in post I had to spend an additional 30 seconds or so adjusting a few sliders to match the Zeiss characteristic. I couldn't replicate the microcontrast, but no one I know who isn't a photographer with experience with these lenses would notice it, let alone friends grateful for a few well-composed pictures.
I preordered the 16-35 and am expecting a total package for the price of entry. It should replace several lenses if I'm willing to part with them
I first noticed this effect in Leica R lenses I had adapted for use on my Canon's. I had tested a few Leica lenses to solve serious softness issues on the edges with older Canon wide angles, back in the days before Canon updated their designs. The micro contrast or 3D effect was a pleasant surprise and hard to miss back then. I then adapted my Leica's to Nikon mount and they were killer on the D800E and now the Sony. It's certainly not something a client would miss but we as the artist see it for sure. In a finely detailed fine art print, it may be significant and more important.
p.15 #17 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
Got the 16-35mm GM on preorder and it will be quite sure sticking on the body like glue. I wonder how it would work out together with the Sony Zeiss 35mm f2.8, Sony Zeiss 55mm f1.8 and 85mm f1.4 GM. Used the 16-35mm f4 Sony Zeiss already approx. 50% of the time before I sold it, the GM will be used probably even more in future, depending on the IQ @35mm wide open for nice portraits. Anybody using a similar setup? I know focal-length discussions are a very personal story but I am quite done with the 24-70mm standard-range and wonder what lenses could match best with the new UWA-GM-Zoom up to 85mm (Got also the A-Mount 80-400mm II which I use very seldom)
p.15 #19 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
cams884 wrote:
Any indications on how the 16-35 will perform for astro yet?
Yes, a bit. I don't recall if it was this thread or someplace else but there was a link to a couple starry night raws, at least one shot wide open at 16mm. It looked very good to me. I'm encouraged and hopeful...
p.15 #20 · Pre-order Now! Sony FE 16-35/2.8 GM and FE 12-24/4 G
akclimber wrote:
Yes, a bit. I don't recall if it was this thread or someplace else but there was a link to a couple starry night raws, at least one shot wide open at 16mm. It looked very good to me. I'm encouraged and hopeful...
Good to hear! That would probably tip it over the line for me.
