TooManyShots wrote:
How many who hates films actually went beyond their lab to process their films 20 years ago+, you have no choice but to shoot films. And generally people would have labs to process and print the negative for them. How many actually develop the films themselves at home Or working with the Zone System? If their experiences are only restricted to lab processing, they really don't understand films at all.....
Never used an outside lab to process my films - did all by myself at home. Favorite B&W developers of mine are Rodinal/Xtol, for color film it is the C-41 process. I agree, you learn a lot by doing these things on your own - and printing in the darkroom applying the basic zone system (very important to make digital negatives, too). All fun and getting experience!
George Orwell wrote:
The Zone System is not suitable for anything but sheet film. The reason for this is that under the Zone system, development of each image is custom tailored. You can't do that with rolls of film. They all get developed together.
This is true since you develop the whole roll of film under the same conditions as you answered. I understood the question about the zone system as being more related to printing from negatives where it plays a big role. And of course for single large format sheet film negatives where each is developed on its own.
George Orwell wrote:
Why some people want to believe that film is dying remains unanswered.
Was out shooting in unseasonably warm weather yesterday. I had a nice walk and was able to fire off 7 rolls of film: 4 rolls of Ilford Delta 100, 1 roll of Kodak TMAX 400, and 2 rolls of Kodak Ektar.
Leaving aside some very argumentative posts here which are more caused by personal discord with some posters than they are topic-related, the believe that film is dead might derive from times when digital took off over 10 years ago. Many (including me at the time!) fully switched to digital and left film behind. Now digital photography has become the standard and is very common. Since a few years there is a growing trend back to film for various reasons which were mentioned in this thread earlier. You can clearly see it not only by the outcome in this survey, but also in a growing number of online film groups and increasing member numbers in analog film forum groups, as well as in increasing prices for film camera gear and darkroom stuff. And as you mentioned that some like Ferrania make new film (still expensive for now, but it is a new beginning).
George Orwell wrote:
The Zone System is not suitable for anything but sheet film. The reason for this is that under the Zone system, development of each image is custom tailored. You can't do that with rolls of film. They all get developed together.
Not entirely as long as you can finish the roll under the same lighting condition or weather condition. Yeah, you roll your own 35mm films. I usually roll about 16 frames.
I used both film and digital whenever and however I like it...how I used it. I don't have to choose. I have no conflicts. There is no war in between these 2 mediums.
But...but...but Dan...what about this snippet from a post of yours:
"I also enjoyed small black and white televisions, transistor radios, cars with fins, and TV dinners"
Is this also something you discuss with your friends when the topic of film is brought up?
What exact value is that statement other than to "poke people in the eyes".
Its these types of innocent statements that takes threads into the weeds. I suggest maybe taking your time to reread and rethink posts before hitting that send button.
Not entirely as long as you can finish the roll under the same lighting condition or weather condition. Yeah, you roll your own 35mm films. I usually roll about 16 frames.
The Zone System takes into account the final print. Using this system on a roll of film would mean that you have to print each of the 16 frames the same way. Not ideal in most situations.
Ok Dan if the snippets you selected show your "true feelings" what exactly was the purpose of the post I selected the snippet from? Just to stab one in the eye or to make fun of one or what?
At the same time, I get the impression that some here are more interested in attacking the person who disagrees with them than in a) making a strong case for their own position, and b) accepting that others can hold a different point of view without taking it personally.
Dan
Complete nonsense. There have been plenty of people in this thread who have expressed their preference for digital and simply left it at that. No film user has taken them to task for their use of digital. On the other hand, those like you and a few others have openly mocked film users. You should take your own advice and hold a different point of view and not made it personal.
You can pontificate all you want but any objective reader of this thread will see that it is you and a (thankfully) select few other digital users who have taken an otherwise valid topic of discussion and made it a platform to express your pompous need to be superior over people who enjoy shooting film.
gdanmitchell wrote:
"I was infatuated with film photography as a kid and as a young man, and I continued to use it for decades. I am completely convinced that beautiful photographs have been made with film and that it is possible to continue to make them that way. But I'm equally convinced that work that is as good or better can be made using digital photography techniques, and I have no personal interest in returning to the old ways."
If you would have left it at that, you'd not be part of the small contingent of people correctly accused of inciting division amongst various photographers.
However, you didnt stop there and instead had to toss in a nice dig at film photographers, mocking them for using this medium instead of moving onto the more "modern" technology.
Further, you have clearly in many cases denied that there have been several here who have launched rather nasty and unwarranted attacks on film photographers, further showing how you really feel.
A real shame that your true feelings were not what was posted above.
Well let's move past this bump in the road and get back to discussing film. I'd be interested in what formats most people shoot. I mostly shoot 6x9 using a Fuji camera and the 4x5 using a Tachihara. Very little 35mm film, in fact I believe I sold most of it off. I still have an old EOS-3 camera sitting around that I just cannot sell.
I have a dedicated mini freezer just for my film and it's 3/4 full at the moment...enough to keep me busy for many years.
Well Dan threads take on a life of their own and this thread has sparked an interesting discussion on film. If YOU don't want to discuss film, then just leave. What exactly is your purpose here now? You've played your cards, shown your colours...now it's time to just leave the thread so we can get back to film...and not about YOU!!
George Orwell wrote:
You can pontificate all you want but any objective reader of this thread will see that it is you and a (thankfully) select few other digital users who have taken an otherwise valid topic of discussion and made it a platform to express your pompous need to be superior over people who enjoy shooting film.
How long have you been shooting film? What formats do you shoot? Do you develop your film, B&W, color negative and color transparency, then print from all three in a wet lab?
Over the course of your experience with film, how many rolls have you shot? Have you ever shot film professionally?
somebody wrote:
Yes, I've had it up to here with folks, some of whom have been banned from the forum in the past for this kind of behavior, whose insistence on perfect politically correct adherence to their current point of view leads them to repeatedly and personally attack anyone with a different perspective, with the ultimate goal accomplishing what? Humiliation? Persuasion? Making anyone who disagrees shut up and go away? A thread in which only people who prefer film over digital are allowed to post? Killing yet another thread with their disagreeableness? Something else?
I cite part of my post above: "Leaving aside some very argumentative posts here which are more caused by personal discord with some posters than they are topic-related....".
Any kind of usefulness regarding the topic still remains to be seen by above poster especially on this last page here. Unfortunately this interesting topic has been originally posted in the Canon forum....which is well known for certain members there and behavior which we see here.
But I agree with above poster in one point - it is not worth to reply to some where there is nothing left to say - it is a waste of time. So best is....ignore them and let them babble and waste their time.
20 years ago+, you have no choice but to shoot films. And generally people would have labs to process and print the negative for them. How many actually develop the films themselves at home