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Archive 2016 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ

  
 
Jonathan F
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p.46 #1 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Hey I just want to note that the TAP and Pronto Pro adapter internals are pretty much interchangeable. I'm running the Pronto Pro internals in one of my TAP adapter casings. Also the biggest point of failure in the TAP is the micro motor. Doing some searching on Amazon Prime, you can purchase a micro motor for under $20 as a Prime purchase. I still enjoy using mine TAP, though I much preferred it's performance on my A7II, it's too jumpy on my current A7III.

It's fun getting AF for lenses like my Nikon 50mm f1.2 AIS, plus you get the added benefit of additional close-up distance when you go down to minimum focus!


191011_DESIDERIO_PARK_PHOTOS_FRIOLO by Jonathan Friolo, on Flickr




Oct 19, 2019 at 01:22 PM
sfogg
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p.46 #2 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


genji wrote:
Umm, yes, I did cover that in considerable detail in the FAQ. You’ve missed the point of Aerocolor’s suggestion and my response which is that designing for a longer flange distance would enable the use of a helicoid in the adapter, thus addressing and fixing the wobble that is the fatal flaw in the Techart Pro’s design. Such a solution is impossible with the Leica M’s short flange distance.


Why couldn't it have a helicoid and still be M mount? Voigtlander put a helicoid in their M to FE adapter. A helicoid would add more moving mass though (unless you want the lens to spin while focusing).

Designed for a longer flange focal length could increase the ability to focus longer focal length lenses but would probably slow down focusing and could potentially draw more current to run it. It would reduce the compatibility with other mounts unless you kept the width of the adapter considerably shorter than the actual flange focal length in the base mount. A locking mount from one mount to another is going to be 10 or 12mm as it is (if you want it to be easy to swap lenses) so if you started at aiming to be compatible with Konica AR mount lenses (40.5mm) and left 10 or 12mm of additional space (to allow for custom mounts for other lens systems) you are back to around 28 or 30mm. M mount is 27.8mm.

Shawn



Oct 19, 2019 at 02:40 PM
Aerocolor
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p.46 #3 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


sfogg wrote:
Why couldn't it have a helicoid and still be M mount? Voigtlander put a helicoid in their M to FE adapter.


Good question. The answer is that it wouldn't be practical, because there isn't enough space for the helicoid if electrical contacts are also present.

If you look at the existing M->FE helicoid adapters closely, you will see that they utilize the full length of the inner bore of the FE lens mount for helicoid threads. This can't be done with an AF adapter, as that space needs to be occupied by the contact block for the electrical interface with the camera body.

You can see the moving parts of the Voigtlander adapter in this video here, at about the 12:45 mark and beyond (or specifically 13:30-13:40 for outward travel):

?t=771

Note how the inner half of the helicoid mechanism (black) moves in and out of the chrome/brass colored mount. That's right where the fixed contacts would need to be for an AF lens adapter.




sfogg wrote:
Designed for a longer flange focal length could increase the ability to focus longer focal length lenses but would probably slow down focusing and could potentially draw more current to run it. It would reduce the compatibility with other mounts unless you kept the width of the adapter considerably shorter than the actual flange focal length in the base mount.


As I mentioned, losing compatibility with some mounts would be an acknowledged and accepted concession. But in exchange, you get the mechanical strength required for larger, heavier lenses of other mounts, which aren't currently usable with the TAP or PRONTO. Having additional travel would go hand-in-hand with making longer lenses more practical, as the extra range would work better for lenses of longer focal lengths. AF speed is only a function of the selected motor and gearing - it's not necessarily a given that it would be slower, or that it couldn't be made to be as fast or faster.


It definitely wouldn't be a replacement for the existing M->FE AF adapter - it would be a second complementary product. And for people like me, who only have a small number of Leica lenses, it could be a much better fit overall for autofocusing lenses of other mounts.



Oct 19, 2019 at 11:41 PM
fsiagian
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p.46 #4 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Jonathan F wrote:
Hey I just want to note that the TAP and Pronto Pro adapter internals are pretty much interchangeable. I'm running the Pronto Pro internals in one of my TAP adapter casings. Also the biggest point of failure in the TAP is the micro motor. Doing some searching on Amazon Prime, you can purchase a micro motor for under $20 as a Prime purchase. I still enjoy using mine TAP, though I much preferred it's performance on my A7II, it's too jumpy on my current A7III.


Hi Jonathan, do you have the Amazon link? Thank you.




Oct 20, 2019 at 12:01 AM
Jonathan F
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p.46 #5 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


fsiagian wrote:
Hi Jonathan, do you have the Amazon link? Thank you.



I'd have to take my TAP apart again to check, but I believe there's a part number you can match if you search on Amazon. They have dozens of mini DC motors for sale. It will require some minor soldering if you're up for it, but if you have a broken TAP it's worth the hassle to fix it as opposed to buying a new one.



Oct 20, 2019 at 01:04 AM
fsiagian
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p.46 #6 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Jonathan F wrote:
I'd have to take my TAP apart again to check, but I believe there's a part number you can match if you search on Amazon. They have dozens of mini DC motors for sale. It will require some minor soldering if you're up for it, but if you have a broken TAP it's worth the hassle to fix it as opposed to buying a new one.

Thanks Jonathan. I hope I won't need it.




Oct 20, 2019 at 03:42 AM
sfogg
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p.46 #7 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Aerocolor wrote:
If you look at the existing M->FE helicoid adapters closely, you will see that they utilize the full length of the inner bore of the FE lens mount for helicoid threads. This can't be done with an AF adapter, as that space needs to be occupied by the contact block for the electrical interface with the camera body.

You can see the moving parts of the Voigtlander adapter in this video here, at about the 12:45 mark and beyond (or specifically 13:30-13:40 for outward travel):

?t=771

Note how the inner half of the helicoid mechanism (black) moves in and out of the chrome/brass
...Show more

I have the Voigtlander adatpter, it doesn't actually use the full length of the inner mount. In some places there is about a 1.25mm from the edge of the insider of the mount (where the electrical contacts would be) to the edge of the helicoid. Certainly not a lot of room but might be doable.

If you want this to be usable with multiple lens mounts you aren't going to gain much helicoid length. I have a Nikon to PK adapter (macro use only) and it is 12.81mm thick. An MD to Nikon is 10mm thick. To account for different adapters you have to remove that much length from whatever your base mount is going to be. If you start with canon EF (44mm) you are going to gain about 3mm (44-13mm = 31) of additional helicoid length compared to M mount. And really less than that if you space it out more to give more room for the electrical contacts.. you might gain 2mm of helicoid length. If you move the helicoid to be inside the body of the adapter itself you loose about 4mm more compared to what Voigtlander has now. Really, you probably can't have a base SLR mount if going this route as you are going to want to zero the flange length with the adapter, not the helicoid or you would be wasting travel if you do it with the helicoid.

If you made it mount specific (without being able to use adapters) then you could certainly gain more throw at the expense of flexibility.

As far as AF, we do not know what the current capacities of the mount are. It was built for IF lenses. It might not be able to supply enough current to move this greater mass (a helicoid system is going to have more mass) in the same amount of time, it might not. You can't just gear it up if you can't supply enough current for the motor. Putting more massive lenses on the mount is just going to make that worse.

And certainly making this SLR specific would limit its appeal for some. When I use the Techart it is almost entirely with LTM or M mount lenses.

Shawn



Oct 20, 2019 at 09:54 AM
Aerocolor
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p.46 #8 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


sfogg wrote:
I have the Voigtlander adatpter, it doesn't actually use the full length of the inner mount. In some places there is about a 1.25mm from the edge of the insider of the mount (where the electrical contacts would be) to the edge of the helicoid. Certainly not a lot of room but might be doable.


Yep, it would be sporty for sure. And with the FE-LM helicoids only having ~5mm of travel anyway, giving up a couple mm could quickly reduce the throw to below the TAP's sliding mount, which obviously wouldn't be favorable... It could probably be done, but I'm not sure it would be worthwhile for the M mount.


sfogg wrote:
If you want this to be usable with multiple lens mounts you aren't going to gain much helicoid length.


I think you're perhaps trying to cover all of the cases, when I was proposing something with more explicit limitations in exchange for other strengths. Having a longer throw is only a secondary benefit - the primary point is to eliminate the wobble.

Having the EF mount means that, without any corrective optics, you can easily use Canon EF, Nikon F, Pentax K, M42, Contax/Yashica CY, Olympus OM, Exacta, and Leica R lenses, among others, plus anything third-party available in T-mount or Adaptall variants. That's not everything, but it certainly covers a large chunk of what the average person has, or is likely to find in their local camera shop, garage sale, or antique store.

And as I mentioned, other non-compatible mounts become possible via some small (not anywhere near 10mm) fudging of the adapters collapsed EF-mount distance. For example, consider the 0.75mm-thick EdMika EF-FD adapter. If the helicoid focused just 2.75mm short of the EF's normal 44mm, then FD lenses using this adapter become directly compatible without any corrective optics.



sfogg wrote:
As far as AF, we do not know what the current capacities of the mount are. It was built for IF lenses. It might not be able to supply enough current to move this greater mass (a helicoid system is going to have more mass) in the same amount of time, it might not. You can't just gear it up if you can't supply enough current for the motor. Putting more massive lenses on the mount is just going to make that worse.


... Or we give it its own separate battery, and make it focus even faster than anything camera-powered could ever dream about. .
This is just a "what-if" academic side discussion anyway, no reason to impose any unnecessary limitations. Just say "Camera battery drain issue resolved.", and call it a feature!



Oct 20, 2019 at 07:08 PM
sfogg
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p.46 #9 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Aerocolor wrote:
I think you're perhaps trying to cover all of the cases, when I was proposing something with more explicit limitations in exchange for other strengths. Having a longer throw is only a secondary benefit - the primary point is to eliminate the wobble.

Having the EF mount means that, without any corrective optics, you can easily use Canon EF, Nikon F, Pentax K, M42, Contax/Yashica CY, Olympus OM, Exacta, and Leica R lenses, among others, plus anything third-party available in T-mount or Adaptall variants. That's not everything, but it certainly covers a large chunk of what the average person has,
...Show more

With a base length of 44mm you aren't going to be able to fit an adapter between that and most of those lenses. The adapters I have (that are easy to swap lenses on) are 10mm or longer. There are a few out there that are shallower but they are harder to swap lenses on (you have to remove the adapter from the camera and get inside of the adapter to unlock the lens) and the Nikon ones can't control aperture on G lenses. Make the base length of the mechanics around 38 or 40mm and then have custom adapters for every lens mount (no built in lens mount, just an adapter mount) would likely give more flexibility and allow one to maximize the focus range.

The Sony body/mount probably isn't big enough but if they got really tricky you might even be able to handle some M mount lenses. Just have the lens mount adapter recess into the body of the AF adapter to get the right flange distance. Would only work for lenses that would fit inside of course. Might work better on a Z mount as it is about 9mm wider.

Shawn




Oct 20, 2019 at 08:21 PM
Aerocolor
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p.46 #10 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


sfogg wrote:
With a base length of 44mm you aren't going to be able to fit an adapter between that and most of those lenses.


I wanted to be sure, so I verified before posting - Fotodiox sells infinity-capable mechanical adapters (no optics) for converting each of those mounts (plus others) to Canon EF.

They might very well be clumsy to use, as you mentioned - I have no experience with them to know. But the adaptations all look to be mechanically possible.


Having lenses be inset into the adapter makes a lot of sense, if the lens body permits. C-mount adapters are built like this. Having a larger diameter helicoid also makes sense and could improve compatibility. However, the advantage of sticking to a "standard" mount (like EF) is that adapters are significantly cheaper and more readily available for end users...



Oct 21, 2019 at 09:13 AM
chr0m4n
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p.46 #11 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Hi guys,
I'm looking for some 85~ portrait lens and im curious if using samyang manual 85 1.4 lenses for canon/nikon dslr mounts would yield good results with TAP? Have anyone tried it? Right now I'm using it with voigtlander 40 1.4 and canon fd 135 2.8 and both of these work fine, however I'm not sure if samyang has FLE or not.
Cheers!



Nov 27, 2019 at 04:02 AM
fferreres
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p.46 #12 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


I would avoid using on long length lenses, at 85 depending you may find MFD to be too far without pre focus. If it weights more than 400 grams I would use sparingly. In general, nobody knows why many many develop wobbling other than design weaknesses. My guess is that it will be in part random, but something not mentioned is HOW you manual focus when using it and I think how much torque the lens puts. With a TAP, I’d always focus grabbing the lens from BELLOW, not pushing from the TOP.

chr0m4n wrote:
Hi guys,
I'm looking for some 85~ portrait lens and im curious if using samyang manual 85 1.4 lenses for canon/nikon dslr mounts would yield good results with TAP? Have anyone tried it? Right now I'm using it with voigtlander 40 1.4 and canon fd 135 2.8 and both of these work fine, however I'm not sure if samyang has FLE or not.
Cheers!




Nov 29, 2019 at 06:19 PM
Fred Miranda
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p.46 #13 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Download the Android APP for data settings (LM-EA7-Config.apk) from the Techart Downloads page to your Android phone.

It looks like the link above is no longer working. Does anyone has the LM-EA7-Config.apk for Android for me to download? I would like to alter the FL settings on my TechArt pro adapter. Thank you in advance!
Fred



Sep 09, 2020 at 12:34 AM
WanderingCloud
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p.46 #14 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Fred Miranda wrote:
It looks like the link above is no longer working. Does anyone has the LM-EA7-Config.apk for Android for me to download? I would like to alter the FL settings on my TechArt pro adapter. Thank you in advance!
Fred


Here?
https://techartpro.com/?page_id=1980



Sep 09, 2020 at 01:48 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.46 #15 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


WanderingCloud wrote:
Here?
https://techartpro.com/?page_id=1980


Thank you! Downloaded and changed settings.



Sep 09, 2020 at 09:28 AM
Fred Miranda
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p.46 #16 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


After a couple years, I decided to give the Techart PRO adapter another chance and was surprised by how well it works on the Sony A7R IV. (firmware v6.00)

So far I only tried it with my Voigtlander 75mm f/1.5 Nokton and had great accuracy when using AF-C and Flexible Spot (medium) focus area. The trick is to focus at center.

At 75mm, the lens should not be set to infinity for fast focus (unless the subject is at infinity), so I just roughly judge distance (1m, 5m, etc.) and focus using the adapter's AF.
Nearly all my images were tack sharp using the adapter's AF and the lens wide open. In low light, the adapter takes more time to acquire focus but it's also accurate. I will only use light lenses on it (~300g) and hopefully it won't develop "the wobble".



Sep 09, 2020 at 11:09 PM
_maxwolf
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p.46 #17 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


retracted

Edited on Oct 19, 2020 at 09:28 PM · View previous versions



Sep 11, 2020 at 11:20 AM
teh_rebel
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p.46 #18 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Fred Miranda wrote:
After a couple years, I decided to give the Techart PRO adapter another chance and was surprised by how well it works on the Sony A7R IV. (firmware v6.00)

So far I only tried it with my Voigtlander 75mm f/1.5 Nokton and had great accuracy when using AF-C and Flexible Spot (medium) focus area. The trick is to focus at center.

At 75mm, the lens should not be set to infinity for fast focus (unless the subject is at infinity), so I just roughly judge distance (1m, 5m, etc.) and focus using the adapter's AF.
Nearly all my images were
...Show more

Fred,
Curious if you tried Eye-AF with TAP and whether it works? Was doing some quick google searches earlier and saw some mentioned it work on a7r3/a9, although probably not as good/quickly as native lens. Still would be cool if that worked though.



Sep 26, 2020 at 11:01 AM
LBJ2
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p.46 #19 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


Fred Miranda wrote:
After a couple years, I decided to give the Techart PRO adapter another chance and was surprised by how well it works on the Sony A7R IV. (firmware v6.00)

So far I only tried it with my Voigtlander 75mm f/1.5 Nokton and had great accuracy when using AF-C and Flexible Spot (medium) focus area. The trick is to focus at center.

At 75mm, the lens should not be set to infinity for fast focus (unless the subject is at infinity), so I just roughly judge distance (1m, 5m, etc.) and focus using the adapter's AF.
Nearly all my images were
...Show more

Welcome back to Techart Pro Fred! I'm happy with this adapter on A7rIV too. Maybe that's why we haven't seen an adapter firmware update in a while--because it stills works even up to the latest A7rIV ! Even Eye-AF with good light.



Sep 26, 2020 at 11:14 AM
chez
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p.46 #20 · Techart PRO LM-EA7 FAQ


How well does the latest firmware work on the A7R3?


Sep 26, 2020 at 11:27 AM
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