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Archive 2014 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?

  
 
Ralph Conway
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p.8 #1 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


popinvasion wrote:
I love Canon but I'm not a brand loyalist. I like to have every tool at my disposal and that currently includes Canon, Sony, Nikon and Panasonic. I wish I could do it all with Canon but right now that's not a reality. But if I complain in a photography forum, well that's kind of the point. IMO a forum exists to discuss everything camera related likes and dislikes. There's no reason for it to get heated or nasty or leave people with the need or desire to block people or block the discussion.


I am totally with your last sentence.
THIS thread is about "6D discontinued".
Put something interesting to the thread or let it be. Canons sensors lack of state of the art DR has nothing to do with this thread and is just an (imo foolish) act to block the discussion.

If you feel, you have to go on, go here:

https://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1326810



Oct 29, 2014 at 06:25 PM
johnctharp
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p.8 #2 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Shutterbug2006 wrote:
I have heard from more than one person that dual card slots are important.... but I have yet to be presented with any anecdotal evidence that a card failure was saved because of a dual card set up.


It's probably far less important these days, as flash technology itself has improved significantly- but the basic argument that gets the idea across to me is that a fouled-up card is inexcusable, and that a dual-card setup remains an effective form of insurance for the shooter.




Oct 29, 2014 at 07:12 PM
jcunwired
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p.8 #3 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


I wonder, are there some professional gigs that require minimum equipment like dual cards?


Oct 29, 2014 at 07:15 PM
jcolwell
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p.8 #4 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


I prefer using dual cameras, although I do use dual cards when they're available.


Oct 29, 2014 at 07:18 PM
StillFingerz
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p.8 #5 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Two bodies, wow what a concept


Oct 29, 2014 at 09:52 PM
Shutterbug2006
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p.8 #6 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


johnctharp wrote:
It's probably far less important these days, as flash technology itself has improved significantly- but the basic argument that gets the idea across to me is that a fouled-up card is inexcusable, and that a dual-card setup remains an effective form of insurance for the shooter.



I'm not sure I would be worried about a card messing up as much as I would be worried the electronics in the camera would be messed up. Not just one card could be screwed, you could have two.

I'd rather have a spare camera for my peace of mind. Dual card slots isn't enough. I'm a klutz. I run into things, drop things. I have backup batteries, cards, flashes... all just in case something goes wrong.



Oct 30, 2014 at 02:42 AM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.8 #7 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Sneakyracer wrote:
The 6D is a really good camera it just can't compete with the Nikon D610 and much less the D750 in head to head comparisons. That makes it a tough sell to new DSLR customers. Only people that are already invested in Canon lenses would really take a good look at it.

Actually the same thing applies to the 5D3 now that the D750 is out, more so given that the 5D3 still costs more.


Nah. I'd still take the 5d3 over the 750. Plenty of important areas for me that the 5d3 still wins.

Edited on Oct 30, 2014 at 03:00 AM · View previous versions



Oct 30, 2014 at 02:47 AM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.8 #8 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Shutterbug2006 wrote:
I have heard from more than one person that dual card slots are important.... but I have yet to be presented with any anecdotal evidence that a card failure was saved because of a dual card set up. I haven't found even one believable example where a photo-shoot was saved because a camera had a dual card system that was set up to record the same images on both cards and something bad happened during a shoot. I can totally understand how one might feel a lot more comfortable having two if they are being paid for a professional shoot
...Show more

Well firstly, no one actually needs to convince you of anything lol! But I have heard of a few cases..

But are you seriously suggesting that backup doesn't reduce the risk of critical failure? The IT industry has been backing up for years. I mirror drives.

I actually don't get your point - you're suggesting it's not necessary just because you haven't heard of a case? That's like saying cigarettes don't cause cancer because you smoke 20 a day for 40 years; it's a average risk problem. And the risk is very low, which is why you've probably not heard of one. But I feel a hell of a lot better knowing I'm backing up.



Oct 30, 2014 at 02:56 AM
Ralph Conway
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p.8 #9 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Sneakyracer wrote:
The 6D is a really good camera it just can't compete with the Nikon D610 and much less the D750 in head to head comparisons. That makes it a tough sell to new DSLR customers. Only people that are already invested in Canon lenses would really take a good look at it.

Actually the same thing applies to the 5D3 now that the D750 is out, more so given that the 5D3 still costs more.


A question of ones opinion. I was able to choose between 6D an D600. 6D was the better solution for me, even then (2 years ago and when I purchased it in January) it was the more expensive one. That was BEFORE the dust issue occured. Situation is still the same (for me) with D610 two years later.

I did not had the chance, to hold a D750 in my hands yet. I am pretty sure its a great camera. Although it imo does not compete against 6D or 5D III. It is what D700 could have looked like to compete against 5D II 6 years ago.





Oct 30, 2014 at 04:21 AM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.8 #10 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Ralph Conway wrote:
I did not had the chance, to hold a D750 in my hands yet. I am pretty sure its a great camera. Although it imo does not compete against 6D or 5D III. It is what D700 could have looked like to compete against 5D II 6 years ago.


Nah - the d750 is a very solid camera in todays market. 1/4000th and lack of AF ON button are the only real limitations IMO. Other than that it's a very very good camera and I'd take one over a 6d any day (usability issues aside - I'm much more used to Canon). However, I'd take a 5d3 over a d750. It sits right in the middle IMO.

Edited on Oct 30, 2014 at 08:24 AM · View previous versions



Oct 30, 2014 at 06:38 AM
ggreene
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p.8 #11 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


jcunwired wrote:
I wonder, are there some professional gigs that require minimum equipment like dual cards?


The key to having dual cards is the ability to mirror the data so you don't have a single point of failure. A lot of pro's like that kind of security. Since I went to 64GB CF cards I mirror all the time as that is a lot of shots on one piece of media.




Oct 30, 2014 at 06:42 AM
PhilDrinkwater
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p.8 #12 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


ggreene wrote:
The key to having dual cards is the ability to mirror the data so you don't have a single point of failure. A lot of pro's like that kind of security. Since I went to 64GB CF cards I mirror all the time as that is a lot of shots on one piece of media.



Indeed. I think it partly depends on the type of shoot though. If I was doing an editorial fashion shoot and a card messed up (although I might be tethering...) then my insurance could handle the price of a reshoot. If I was shooting wildlife and I caught my "image of the year", I'd be angry, but so be it.

Where there's a real problem is one offs, such a weddings and maybe something like paparazzi.



Oct 30, 2014 at 08:27 AM
Shutterbug2006
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p.8 #13 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


PhilDrinkwater wrote:
Well firstly, no one actually needs to convince you of anything lol! But I have heard of a few cases..

But are you seriously suggesting that backup doesn't reduce the risk of critical failure? The IT industry has been backing up for years. I mirror drives.

I actually don't get your point - you're suggesting it's not necessary just because you haven't heard of a case? That's like saying cigarettes don't cause cancer because you smoke 20 a day for 40 years; it's a average risk problem. And the risk is very low, which is why you've probably not heard of
...Show more

There are serious differences between mirrored hard drives, and a camera programmed to copy the same image to two (are they really independent?) card slots. I worked in the computer industry for 30 years, and I am no stranger to mirrored hard drives and RAID systems.

You can feel reassured all you like. I certainly wouldn't be reassured unless I actually tested the camera's dual card slot system with (differently) defective and working cards simultaneously. I'll bet not one camera owner relying on the dual card setup has tested the ability of their camera to save their ass.

Again, for me, the only serious 'backup insurance' I'd rely on is having spare bodies for the unlikely event that a catastrophic failure pops up in the middle of a shoot. A dual card option is like having a spare flat tire instead of a gassed up ready to go replacement vehicle. While it may be a bad analogy, it works for me.




Oct 30, 2014 at 11:04 AM
snapsy
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p.8 #14 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Shutterbug2006 wrote:
There are serious differences between mirrored hard drives, and a camera programmed to copy the same image to two (are they really independent?) card slots. I worked in the computer industry for 30 years, and I am no stranger to mirrored hard drives and RAID systems.

You can feel reassured all you like. I certainly wouldn't be reassured unless I actually tested the camera's dual card slot system with (differently) defective and working cards simultaneously. I'll bet not one camera owner relying on the dual card setup has tested the ability of their camera to save their ass.

Again, for me,
...Show more

There are differences between a RAID 1 HD setup and dual card slots but the level of redundancy is about the same. Both mechanisms have single points of failure - for RAID 1 those include the controller, PCIe bus, host system, etc. For the camera the single points of failure are the frame buffer, DRAM, sensor, etc. For the actual mirroring algorithm, RAID 1 mirrors on a physical block basis and is thus additionally vulnerable to filesystem metadata corruption (ie, a corruption event will be mirrored on both drives). In contrast, the filesystems on a dual-card setup are independent. In any event, both mechanisms are designed to recover from the most probable type of failure, which is failure of the storage device itself (HD for RAID 1 and CF/SD cell failures in cameras).



Oct 30, 2014 at 11:17 AM
jim bennett
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p.8 #15 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


ggreene wrote:
There are people right now in 2014 getting awesome shots with the 1Ds2+85L combo. They don't seem to be held back by not having the latest and greatest gear.


There are people getting awesome shots even with point and shoot FILM cameras in 2014.



Oct 30, 2014 at 12:14 PM
Access
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p.8 #16 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


I think dual cards are useful, the main thing is that a card can fail and you won't even know it before it is too late (ie. failing at power-off or power-on). Modern flash is reasonably reliable under normal conditions, and the better cards generally don't use bottom-of-the-barrel flash like USB thumb drives have a tendency to. But modern flash is not invincible, it is typically MLC unless you shop around for the very expensive SLC cards and subject to environmental factors like altitude, temperature, and radiation. Often an issue for travelers, ie. the radiation from repeated airport security scans or the like (a CTX machine is high enough energy to zap some EEPROMs and flash memories.)

Having two cards rather than one allows you protect against other incidentals like misplacement, theft, loss, etc. What I mean is that after filling a set (of 2) cards, keeping one on your person while handing the other to your assistant for safekeeping. There are other schemes that offer somewhat similar protection to this, but most of them require more work than just filling cards in parallel.

For the record I try to use dual cards when people are depending on me and it would be difficult to recover from a data loss. I also back up the card(s) to a laptop hard drive as soon as is feasible (in almost all cases). I've only lost data twice in my 10+ years of using digital SLRs, and in both cases it wasn't critical and I was able to recover almost all of it (not catastrophic). But with murphy's law it's one less thing that can go wrong.



Oct 30, 2014 at 01:18 PM
kaycephoto
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p.8 #17 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Shutterbug2006 wrote:
I have heard from more than one person that dual card slots are important.... but I have yet to be presented with any anecdotal evidence that a card failure was saved because of a dual card set up. I haven't found even one believable example where a photo-shoot was saved because a camera had a dual card system that was set up to record the same images on both cards and something bad happened during a shoot. I can totally understand how one might feel a lot more comfortable having two if they are being paid for a professional shoot
...Show more

Having a back-up camera is more important than a camera with 2 cards for a critical shoot, but having 2 reliable cards is important to me for a few reasons. Knock on wood - but so far, I've only had a few card-write errors and 0 full on card failures to date. They happened very sporadically with my 1D Mark III & 1Ds Mark III bodies during runway shows (constant shooting for 20 mins at a time), where when the buffer filled up, certain files would be corrupted on one card. In those cases, I'd then pull the same file from the other card - no harm, no foul.

The second main reason I want two cards is so that JPGs can be taken quickly from the 2nd card (for whatever reason - press release, social media needs, wedding slideslow, etc etc) while I continue working on the other card without interruption. Maybe I'm too careful, but I try to NEVER take out my primary CF card unless I'm done recording images to that card. (In other words, I don't like taking it out, and putting it in to write more files, taking it out, then putting it in to write more files - this is poor practice that encourages write-errors IMO).

Lastly, now that I have the 1DX with its fast processors - I use the dual card system as an archival method fairly frequently at long events like motor races or weddings. For instance, I might shoot with all fast/new 32gb cards in slot 1, with a slower larger card in slot 2. Knowing I have a back-up CF card with all of the files & no in-camera re-writing (ie. deleting files from culling, basically 0 chance of write-errors), I feel pretty comfortable about culling from my CF cards in slot 1 as needed throughout the day. If I happen to lose any of my many CF cards on a busy day of shooting, (again knock on wood - I've never lost a CF card yet), I'm covered.

In select circumstances, I also like having the option of quickly copying all files from one card to another during downtime - off the top of my head, I can't remember why I did this, but I recall having done it a few times & it being an incredibly useful feature to me at the time..

All in all, in comes down to what you, the photographer, are comfortable with when you select your tools. My mindset has always been "0 room for error as a professional" when I deal with my clients. I will say that CF technology has matured quite a bit since the days of the 1D Mark III & that most of my mentors/peers are not at all as careful as I am.

(Sorry for the late response btw, just noticed that you responded to me)



Oct 30, 2014 at 01:37 PM
Ralph Conway
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p.8 #18 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


So that means, you would like to get a second card slot in a 6D MK II?

I still think, the uk amazon "discontinued" info was just a mistake.
I just checked the link. It disappeared.



Oct 31, 2014 at 08:51 AM
johnvanr
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p.8 #19 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Spoke with Canon at PPE. The 6D is alive and kicking and not discontinued. Amazon made a mistake.


Oct 31, 2014 at 09:12 AM
Ralph Conway
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p.8 #20 · EOS 6D to be discontinued...so soon?


Like Amazon germany still introduces the D750 as follow up model of D610 and D800 (yes, both )


Oct 31, 2014 at 09:19 AM
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