Couldn't agree more. Canon's biggest innovative FF hit was the 5D MkII, for Nikon the D800. Only that you don't need to wait what Canon or Nikon are going to do at some point maybe. There are fortunately alternative options now.
I'll bite - The Camera Store is hilariously biased towards Sony products in ways that clearly do not reflect the camera market at all.
I typed out a long rant but decided that it would not contribute to the conversation and would distract from my optimism regarding Canon releasing a decent camera at the end of this month. I NEED TO BELIEVE.
Pixel Perfect wrote:
Losing a crop 1D series meant much higher price of entry now - $5K 1D IV, $6.8K 1D X. While Canon may well price 1DX2 at $7K and it'll probably have 24MP (max) at 12fps, this is a dangerous move IMO. The curent Sony 24MP and 36MP sensors are clearly very good even without the 1D X's awesome high ISO noise (but not far behind). I think it won't be long before we start seeing 7-8 fps in at least the 24MP models costing $2K and with very good AF. Even 36MP sensor will probably see 6-6.5fps next gen. The huge gap between cameras like 1D X/ D4s and the lesser models has narrowed considerably and it becomes harder to justify the enormous price disparity IMO. In fact there is no reason a new 1D X2 should cost more than $5K max. I know fairly well how much fat is in the price of the 1 series and even at $5K Canon would still be making a very healthy profit. Rather than further erode a shrinking user base they should be changing tack, otherwise these cameras will become less and less relevant to majority of users IMO....Show more →
I think the price difference used to be driven by the resolution use factor, in much the same way that medium format costs so much more today. Now that high resolution standards are becoming standard, there are little grounds for a huge price difference between bodies.
Sneakyracer wrote:
At least Canon has not done THIS... humm.. oh wait a sec...
The new 1Dx-w. We thought it would look better if it were the same color as the big white telephoto lenses that it is often attached to. Yours for $7,000.
Sara0613 wrote:
I don't think we'll get high fps at 60 MP in the near future
I would like to see the 1DX2 match the 1D4's pixel density so 27MP at 12FPS. That would be a better unification of the 1D4 and 1Ds3. If it could also match the 1DX's high ISO IQ that would be pretty sweet.
kezeka wrote:
I'll bite - The Camera Store is hilariously biased towards Sony products in ways that clearly do not reflect the camera market at all.
I typed out a long rant but decided that it would not contribute to the conversation and would distract from my optimism regarding Canon releasing a decent camera at the end of this month. I NEED TO BELIEVE.
All the products placements in that video shows enough to understand what they are leaning into.
But they do put some good points.
Nikon have more options to improve but they don't do it. Canon has all the sensors for good mirrorless, but do nothing with it.
These are points that everyone are talking about.
Maybe they are planning on something no one expects, but it does feel like they are sitting their ground.
kezeka wrote:
I'll bite - The Camera Store is hilariously biased towards Sony products in ways that clearly do not reflect the camera market at all.
I typed out a long rant but decided that it would not contribute to the conversation and would distract from my optimism regarding Canon releasing a decent camera at the end of this month. I NEED TO BELIEVE.
The trend among system cameras is that mirrorless is gaining market shares from DSLR. You may say that they haven't eaten that much yet, but it is still a trend. In Norway, the DSLR sales dropped 49 % while mirrorless dropped "only" 5 % the first 6 months of 2014. Churning out new DSLR models with incremental improvements isn't the solution to that.
alundeb wrote:
The trend among system cameras is that mirrorless is gaining market shares from DSLR. You may say that they haven't eaten that much yet, but it is still a trend. In Norway, the DSLR sales dropped 49 % while mirrorless dropped "only" 5 % the first 6 months of 2014. Churning out new DSLR models with incremental improvements isn't the solution to that.
Exactly. Canon and Nikon need to understand that in order to sell DSLRs in the future they need to really provide significant image quality and feature / spec improvements over mirrorless cameras to make it worth the greater expense, weight and size (of the DSLRs).
I think Nikon has somewhat understood this and their newest full frame models, the D750 and the D810 reflect this. They offer stunning Image Quality and really nice AF performance plus other good features and specs.
Canon, not so much. Only in the AF department,but since Mirrorless cameras have yet to provide amazing AF performance, upping them in AF is basically quite easy. For now.
If Fuji, to use an example, introduces an X-T2 with a 24mp high DR sensor and amazing AF performance (at a similar price point) then a Canon DSLR will become a VERY hard sell.
If someone introduces a full frame mirrorless with better performance then forget it.
Sneakyracer wrote:
If Fuji, to use an example, introduces an X-T2 with a 24mp high DR sensor and amazing AF performance (at a similar price point) then a Canon DSLR will become a VERY hard sell.
They also have to find a way to get better battery performance or more efficient EVF's.
Sneakyracer wrote:
Exactly. Canon and Nikon need to understand that in order to sell DSLRs in the future they need to really provide significant image quality and feature / spec improvements over mirrorless cameras to make it worth the greater expense, weight and size (of the DSLRs).
I think Nikon has somewhat understood this and their newest full frame models, the D750 and the D810 reflect this. They offer stunning Image Quality and really nice AF performance plus other good features and specs.
Canon, not so much. Only in the AF department,but since Mirrorless cameras have yet to provide amazing AF performance, upping them in AF is basically quite easy. For now.
If Fuji, to use an example, introduces an X-T2 with a 24mp high DR sensor and amazing AF performance (at a similar price point) then a Canon DSLR will become a VERY hard sell.
If someone introduces a full frame mirrorless with better performance then forget it.
Different strokes for different folks. I wouldn't talk in absolutes and assume everyone wants the same thing. I personally don't want a smaller body, too hard to handle for me. Just my preference.
VinnieJ wrote:
Different strokes for different folks. I wouldn't talk in absolutes and assume everyone wants the same thing. I personally don't want a smaller body, too hard to handle for me. Just my preference.
Few things keep me away from current mirrorless offerings: (i) lenses (ii) EVF (iii) AF. Until all these shortcomings are overcome, I remain a happy DSLR camper.
So, what's everyone's thoughts about when the 5div will come out?
I think the idx replacement will be first and priced up around 8K and it will be announced around the first quarter. I would think canon would want to put some distance between the "new" idx and 5div to get as many sales as possible for the higher priced camera. Maybe they will release the 5div around this time next year.
Mirrorless is gaining much more traction in Europe and Asia, in North America cultural preferences toward things being larger* have kept DSLR sales alive.
*Just look at the size of cars people drive compared to the rest of the world. When Microsoft launched the original X-Box they had to manufacture smaller controllers to gain any traction in the Japanese market.
There's nothing stopping anyone making a DSLR sized mirrorless (Sony are most of the way there already with the SLT line), in fact going large would silence many of the ciriticisms as it would facilitate much bigger batteries and in turn larger brighter EVF screens (which would in turn lead to greater sales and cheaper parts to make small mirrorless offerings, so everybody wins).
AF performance remains largely a data processing problem and gains will be made here. Mirrorless offers the possibility of much higher accuracy due to the closed loop nature and lack of calibration required.
I see the DSLR design becoming a niche product, but not the form factor.
thw2 wrote:
Few things keep me away from current mirrorless offerings: (i) lenses (ii) EVF (iii) AF. Until all these shortcomings are overcome, I remain a happy DSLR camper.
Among a couple other things needing attention.
I do agree, eventually almost all imaging will be made mirrorlessly (and heavily reliant on "video" compositing of stills). But that's still a long way off. Everyone will be outfitted with tricorders first (right, Bones? )
Archive 2014 · OMG - 1DsX in NYC...
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