p.67 #1 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
kdrk888 wrote:
The Pop Photo magazine just announced the Sony A7R as their camera of the year. Praises aside, they also said this:
" While we’re nitpicking, we’ll point out that the 7R’s resolution comes at the expense of more noise at higher ISOs. Canon’s EOS 5D Mark III, our 2012 Camera of the Year and still the reigning low-light champ, is way ahead of the 7R in this regard, with acceptable noise through ISO 25,600; the 7R hits this boundary at ISO 1600. We wish the Alpha 7R had some way of triggering accessory flashes without using another flash as a master. (Hint to Sony: how about a trigger unit for the hot-shoe?) And a camera at this level should have a second card slot rather than a single SD."...Show more →
Not surprised to see that the A7 series performs less well at very high ISO numbers compared to the 5D MkIII. This is one of the strengths of the MkIII and 6D series. If I would be interested in using this kind of high ISO numbers, I wouldn't be looking at the A7(R) in the first place. The Sony A7(R) is not an all-round camera, it is made specifically to be used at low or "normal" ISO numbers. If someone needs to have "everything", I believe a combination of the MkIII and the A7R would be perfect. Both fit the gaps where the other one is lacking.
p.67 #2 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Disagree strongly. Equalise the resolutions (downrez the sony) and the noise is equal up to iso 6400 (highest I tested) that means that the Canon can't do high iso any better than the Sony at the end of the day but the sony kills it for DR and IMO tonality and colour also. Putting my money where my mouth is, just put my order in. Anyone want a 5D3? Already sold the 5Dc and the flashguns. Been with Canon since the AE-1P. Keeping my lenses for the meanwhile, future, we'll see.
p.67 #3 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
kdrk888 wrote:
The Pop Photo magazine just announced the Sony A7R as their camera of the year. Praises aside, they also said this:
" While we’re nitpicking, we’ll point out that the 7R’s resolution comes at the expense of more noise at higher ISOs. Canon’s EOS 5D Mark III, our 2012 Camera of the Year and still the reigning low-light champ, is way ahead of the 7R in this regard, with acceptable noise through ISO 25,600; the 7R hits this boundary at ISO 1600. We wish the Alpha 7R had some way of triggering accessory flashes without using another flash as a master. (Hint to Sony: how about a trigger unit for the hot-shoe?) And a camera at this level should have a second card slot rather than a single SD."...Show more →
+1
I agree that the 5DIII have a Little bit better high ISO than the A7r camera. But the 1DX is even a little bit better than the 5DIII
p.67 #4 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Beni wrote:
Disagree strongly. Equalise the resolutions (downrez the sony) and the noise is equal up to iso 6400 (highest I tested) that means that the Canon can't do high iso any better than the Sony at the end of the day but the sony kills it for DR and IMO tonality and colour also. Putting my money where my mouth is, just put my order in. Anyone want a 5D3? Already sold the 5Dc and the flashguns. Been with Canon since the AE-1P. Keeping my lenses for the meanwhile, future, we'll see.
Well - this is even better then. Good to know that the A7 manages up to this ISO level very well. I normally never even go so high anyway in my shots. Normally ISO 1200 is the end for me .
p.67 #6 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Do you know how to find out what lenses are used for the "IMCOMP" images? Also, they're SOOC jpegs - not the best way to compare 100% crops. Just sayin'.
p.67 #7 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
jcolwell wrote:
Do you know how to find out what lenses are used for the "IMCOMP" images? Also, they're SOOC jpegs - not the best way to compare 100% crops. Just sayin'.
+1. KKFung, would you help. You are only one FMer for now who can confirm the real world performance of 1DX and A7r in the same canon platform. I am only asking one simple set of 1Dx and A7r wide DR 6400 iso images. Hope you don't mind and million thanks in advance. I, myself hardly use beyond iso400
p.67 #8 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
kdrk888 wrote:
The Pop Photo magazine just announced the Sony A7R as their camera of the year. Praises aside, they also said this:
" While we’re nitpicking, we’ll point out that the 7R’s resolution comes at the expense of more noise at higher ISOs. Canon’s EOS 5D Mark III, our 2012 Camera of the Year and still the reigning low-light champ, is way ahead of the 7R in this regard, with acceptable noise through ISO 25,600; the 7R hits this boundary at ISO 1600. We wish the Alpha 7R had some way of triggering accessory flashes without using another flash as a master. (Hint to Sony: how about a trigger unit for the hot-shoe?) And a camera at this level should have a second card slot rather than a single SD."...Show more →
p.67 #9 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Lasse Eriksson wrote:
+1
I agree that the 5DIII have a Little bit better high ISO than the A7r camera. But the 1DX is even a little bit better than the 5DIII
and best have D4 regarding to DXO
so you mean that Sony has not done the work as well as Nikon and with their d800 regarding high iso 36Mp downs sized to 5dmk3 file size ?
p.67 #10 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
chez wrote:
My understanding from tests other people did that if you down sample the 7R's image to the same size as the 5D3, the noise is basically a wash at high ISO's.
well , then you understand right, download d800 25600iso raw and for example 1dx 25600iso raw from Dpreview and compare d800 with 1dx and 1dx file size, every one can then check by them self resolution/noise
p.67 #11 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
retrofocus wrote:
Not surprised to see that the A7 series performs less well at very high ISO numbers compared to the 5D MkIII. This is one of the strengths of the MkIII and 6D series. If I would be interested in using this kind of high ISO numbers, I wouldn't be looking at the A7(R) in the first place. The Sony A7(R) is not an all-round camera, it is made specifically to be used at low or "normal" ISO numbers. If someone needs to have "everything", I believe a combination of the MkIII and the A7R would be perfect. Both fit the gaps where the other one is lacking. ...Show more →
I disagree, why should not the 36Mp sensor in Sony reproduce good results in high iso ?
p.67 #12 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Mikael Risedal wrote:
well , then you understand right, download d800 25600iso raw and for example 1dx 25600iso raw from Dpreview and compare d800 with 1dx and 1dx file size, every one can then check by them self resolution/noise
Not relevant.
The 18 MP sensor on the 1DX is part of a balanced system that can sustain 12 fps shooting in challenging AF situations. The 36 MP sensor on the D800 is part of a balanced system that provides superior DR at 4 fps. They're built for different purposes. Both are "superior" cameras, but not with respect to each other.
p.67 #13 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Lasse Eriksson wrote:
+1
I see it every week at the Swedish photo forums also
well, as long you are spreading myths and direct errors that go against measurements I will react
I do the same with my other brands as Nikon, Leica, Hasselblad etc
p.67 #14 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
jcolwell wrote:
Not relevant.
The 18 MP sensor on the 1DX is part of a balanced system that can sustain 12 fps shooting in challenging AF situations. The 36 MP sensor on the D800 is part of a balanced system that provides superior DR at 4 fps. They're built for different purposes. Both are "superior" cameras, but not with respect to each other.
Im know that, but here we was discussing if Sonys sensor work "over 1600iso" read above or if the sensor are inferior to high iso compared to Canon 5dmk3 as a another example
Because of raw wise ADC the Sony can still produce superior DR at much higher speed than 4fps due the low read out noise
quote from above : Canon’s EOS 5D Mark III, our 2012 Camera of the Year and still the reigning low-light champ, is way ahead of the 7R in this regard, with acceptable noise through ISO 25,600; the 7R hits this boundary at ISO 1600. end quote
p.67 #15 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
jcolwell wrote:
Not relevant.
The 18 MP sensor on the 1DX is part of a balanced system that can sustain 12 fps shooting in challenging AF situations. The 36 MP sensor on the D800 is part of a balanced system that provides superior DR at 4 fps. They're built for different purposes. Both are "superior" cameras, but not with respect to each other.
It is relevant in the context of what was being discussed, that is noise from the Canon sensors versus the Sony sensors at high ISO. Other features and target uses of the respective cameras was not being discussed.
I'd like to see an example of a "noisy" Ar7 high ISO image downsized and compared to a 5D3 image shot at the same ISO.
p.67 #16 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
chez wrote:
It is relevant in the context of what was being discussed, that is noise from the Canon sensors versus the Sony sensors at high ISO. Other features and target uses of the respective cameras was not being discussed.
I'd like to see an example of a "noisy" Ar7 high ISO image downsized and compared to a 5D3 image shot at the same ISO.
Then we are two
and as I wrote earlier -download Sony, d800 25600iso raw and for example 1dx , 5dmk3 25600iso raw from Dpreview and compare d800 with 1dx and 1dx file size, every one can then check by them self resolution/noise at 25600iso
p.67 #17 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Mikael Risedal wrote:
well , then you understand right, download d800 25600iso raw and for example 1dx 25600iso raw from Dpreview and compare d800 with 1dx and 1dx file size, every one can then check by them self resolution/noise
jcolwell wrote:
Not relevant.
The 18 MP sensor on the 1DX is part of a balanced system that can sustain 12 fps shooting in challenging AF situations. The 36 MP sensor on the D800 is part of a balanced system that provides superior DR at 4 fps. They're built for different purposes. Both are "superior" cameras, but not with respect to each other.
chez wrote:
It is relevant in the context of what was being discussed, that is noise from the Canon sensors versus the Sony sensors at high ISO. Other features and target uses of the respective cameras was not being discussed.
I'd like to see an example of a "noisy" Ar7 high ISO image downsized and compared to a 5D3 image shot at the same ISO.
The main reason, actually the only reason, that I'm interested in the A7R is for making large prints. Larger that I would make with my lower MP Canon cameras. I'm not particularly interested in the A7R noise characteristics when down-rezzed to an equivalent smaller-MP sensor. I'm interested in the per-pixel performance, because I plan to use all of them.
My point about comparing like-systems might not have been directly relevant to the particular sub-theme into which I posted it, but it is still very relevant to the thread.
p.67 #18 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
jcolwell wrote:
The main reason, actually the only reason, that I'm interested in the A7R is for making large prints. Larger that I would make with my lower MP Canon cameras. I'm not particularly interested in the A7R noise characteristics when down-rezzed to an equivalent smaller-MP sensor. I'm interested in the per-pixel performance, because I plan to use all of them.
My point about comparing like-systems might not have been directly relevant to the particular sub-theme into which I posted it, but it is still very relevant to the thread.
well, stay then around base iso, but even at higher iso you get more resolution out from 36Mp down sized to 18Mp than 18Mp
p.67 #20 · Sony A7 and A7r Full Frame with Canon Lenses
Good luck , and remember , you can underexpose this sensor to get shorter time than with your canon, no need for ETTR and return with better results due the shorter exposure time in a given "iso", also reproduce high lights which had been clipped with your Canon and a contrast rich motive due the lower DR, how to allocate 14 stop compared with 11-12, but you will certainly discover that on your Sony journey
.