I've just had 10 minutes in a mall (not the best place, I know) with the Sony Nex 7, and although there are a number of things that Iiked about the camera, the EVF was not one of them.
After reading all the glowing reports I expected something close to the viewfinder on my Canon 5DII or the clear view of my Leica Ms. No luck.
What I saw was small and dark, with a strong warm tone, verging on an orange tint, and very seriously blocked up shadows, such that I could almost not read the image. I tried a second camera - just the same. If this is the state of current (or almost current) EVF technology, then I'm going to have to seriously consider the Fuji hybrid viewfinders again.
How do others that come from full frame work with these things?
It's all about optimizing the Creative Style jpeg settings, because the EVF reflects whichever jpeg setting you're using. Switch to "Neutral" with -3 contrast, and -1 saturation, use proper WB or AWB, turn brightness to manual and all the way up, and make sure "Live view effect" setting is on. Also, consider removing the eye cup, as some have a hard time centering their eye correctly with this EVF.
FWIW, it shouldn't seem all that small to you. It is about the same viewing size as the 1DsIII OVF.
For what its worth I found the NEX7 EVF to be inferior to the EVFs that I have used in Panasonic G and GH series cameras, even though it has higher resolution. Though my experience with it has been very limited and apparently it can be improved by changing the settings. High contrast situations are a problem for all EVFs, but I have been fairly happy with EVFs both indoors and outdoors in most situations.
It's all about optimizing the Creative Style jpeg settings, because the EVF reflects whichever jpeg setting you're using. Switch to "Neutral" with -3 contrast, and -1 saturation, use proper WB or AWB, turn brightness to manual and all the way up, and make sure "Live view effect" setting is on. Also, consider removing the eye cup, as some have a hard time centering their eye correctly with this EVF.
Unfortunately, that's a lot to figure out in a shop with an unhelpful sales assistant.
FWIW, it shouldn't seem all that small to you. It is about the same viewing size as the 1DsIII OVF.
I had my 5DII with me, with the Maxwell screen and a 40/2 on it. I kept swapping back and forth. I couldn't believe the massive difference between the two, both in size and in brightness. Looking out into the mall foyer, shadows in the NEX EVF were unreadable and it seemed like looking through a tunnel. I do wear glasses, but I'm not afraid of pressing the glass against the eyepiece.
Actually, having used the NEX-5N for about a year with its EVF, I was surprised how much I disliked the NEX-7 version of it. I suppose it must be the glasses, because I couldn't even keep it working normally. It switched on and off. I was kind of shocked, because I'm quite used to the NEX-5N's one and I don't have any problem with it (besides excessive contrast, but I've learned to live with it, and lack of stability, because the thing goes up and down with no way of fixing the angle).
Another way to look at this would be to apply Douglas' settings and then take 20 shots with each cameras (mix up close up, medium distance and infinity). With the NEX, fine tune your focus with magnified view or focus peaking. Then examine the photos on your computer and see how many photos with each camera are "critically" focused.
Another way to look at this would be to apply Douglas' settings and then take 20 shots with each cameras (mix up close up, medium distance and infinity). With the NEX, fine tune your focus with magnified view or focus peaking. Then examine the photos on your computer and see how many photos with each camera are "critically" focused.
Where's the incentive? I get critical focusing with the Canon 40/2 combination every time. I have never had a mis-focused image - the Maxwell screen just snaps it immediately into focus.
I had trouble seeing what was in the NEX image, let alone trying any manual focus.
It seems the evf was set up sub optimally, you acknowledge that and then continue to bash it with no desire to evaluate it using the right settings.. hmm wonder why you started this thread.
curious80 wrote:
For what its worth I found the NEX7 EVF to be inferior to the EVFs that I have used in Panasonic G and GH series cameras, even though it has higher resolution. Though my experience with it has been very limited and apparently it can be improved by changing the settings. High contrast situations are a problem for all EVFs, but I have been fairly happy with EVFs both indoors and outdoors in most situations.
i've heard a number of people say that the NEX-7 evf is unusable with eyeglasses. not surprising given the eyecup and sensor issues. you have to adjust the diopter and take off your glasses to have any hope of using it.
sony really needs to fix the eyecup so it actually accomplishes something and change the default evf settings as well. now that i've gotten used to mine and configured it to my liking i'm much more accurate at focusing than i am with a real manual focus slr (let alone a half silverd AF dslr), even without peaking and magnification. it definitely looks different than a optical finder though and is a bit laggy for very fast action.
It seems the evf was set up sub optimally, you acknowledge that and then continue to bash it with no desire to evaluate it using the right settings.. hmm wonder why you started this thread.
It was set up as it was in the shop - I would have assumed it would be set up optimally if they want to sell the things. Obviously, according to Douglas, not, but how is someone going to buy the thing supposed to know that?
I've heard a lot of people sing the praises of this EVF and was shocked at how awful I found it. I now see that you are singing the praises of the A99 EVF on another thread. My own experience, which is all we can sensibly trust, tells me to be very cautious now. What you consider good for you may not be all that relevant to others. Can you live with that?
curious80 wrote:
For what its worth I found the NEX7 EVF to be inferior to the EVFs that I have used in Panasonic G and GH series cameras, even though it has higher resolution. Though my experience with it has been very limited and apparently it can be improved by changing the settings. High contrast situations are a problem for all EVFs, but I have been fairly happy with EVFs both indoors and outdoors in most situations.
Boy, I disagree. I haven't used the OM-D yet, and I hear it has a great EVF, but my friend came over with his GH2 a few months ago, and I was surprised just how much better the NEX EVF was, for me. Using the GH2 practically felt like going back to an old digicam, as far as the EVF was concerned.
wolfloid wrote:
It was set up as it was in the shop - I would have assumed it would be set up optimally if they want to sell the things. Obviously, according to Douglas, not, but how is someone going to buy the thing supposed to know that?
I've heard a lot of people sing the praises of this EVF and was shocked at how awful I found it. I now see that you are singing the praises of the A99 EVF on another thread. My own experience, which is all we can sensibly trust, tells me to be very cautious now. What you consider good for you may not be all that relevant to others. Can you live with that?...Show more →
All of the praises being sung around here (and in other forums,) usually take my above settings recommendations into account, and they're almost always from non-glasses wearers. At least with its current eye cup situation, I wouldn't bother with the NEX-7 EVF if I wore glasses, to be honest. I take the eyecup off altogether and press my eye right up agains the NEX-7 finder. The 5N's add-on EVF is better in this regard, because it is easier to get a good eye position.
Another thing to consider is, which lens was on the camera in the shop? If it was a kit zoom with a small maximum aperture, and you were indoors, then you're also making things worse than you would with a faster prime.
wolfloid wrote:
I've heard a lot of people sing the praises of this EVF and was shocked at how awful I found it. I now see that you are singing the praises of the A99 EVF on another thread. My own experience, which is all we can sensibly trust, tells me to be very cautious now. What you consider good for you may not be all that relevant to others. Can you live with that?
Wolf, a lot of people like the EVF. A number of people here, including myself, have found that focusing accuracy using the EVF is better than with any other camera we've ever used. Like any piece of equipment, you have to set it up and learn to use it. Otherwise, why don't you just leave your cameras in P mode or Intelligent Auto or whatever and fire away.
If you don't like the EVF, I can live with that. But, I've used it for over a year and you're not going to change my mind about how effective it is.
No, you certainly cannot count on the NEX-7 being setup optimally in the shop. That would be a very poor assumption.
I've owned the NEX-7, and yes, the settings can greatly improve the experience, particularly the shadow blockiness.
However, as I've posted elsewhere, I found the OM-D EVF superior, partly due to the eye cup and eye relief. I do wear glasses, but could not when shooting with the NEX-7.
douglasf13 wrote:
Boy, I disagree. I haven't used the OM-D yet, and I hear it has a great EVF, but my friend came over with his GH2 a few months ago, and I was surprised just how much better the NEX EVF was, for me. Using the GH2 practically felt like going back to an old digicam, as far as the EVF was concerned.
Maybe my bad experience with NEX7 EVF is related to the fact that I wear eye glasses. Nevertheless I mainly used EVFs with G1 and GH1 and those seemed very natural in indoor/outdoor conditions. Not sure about GH2 as I haven't used it. Most of the time G1/GH1 didn't feel different from OVFs at all. I think the crucial part was that the brightness and color balance seemed to match the ambient conditions very well. With NEX7 the EVF view seems very different from the ambient conditions which immediately makes me feel it is a digital view. But I suppose that optimizing the settings on NEX7 might change that. The only condition when I had issues with G1/GH1 EVFs was when I was taking shots close to sunset and the color balance went way off.
A company's desire to sell product unfortunately does not equate to having knowledgeable sales people operating the equipment. Anyone here who has stepped foot into a Best Buy can attest to that.
Sony dropped the ball by not having the EVF settings separate, forcing users to figure a round-about way of getting a decent preview on the screen. But from your comments, it sounds like you were looking at the out-of-the-box configuration.
no, it's clear in a lot of ways that sony doesn't put any effort into educating retailers or their own store staff about their higher end cameras and how to present/work them.
A bit like expecting a car to have the steering wheel and seat adjusted for you the first time you climb into it. Maybe you answered your own question.
Sony are doing very nicely from this and similar cameras, perhaps you are an atypical would-be buyer?
