We are getting off topic. Given the situation at hand I would do the following- learn from your mistakes first and foremost.
Next, Email, call, text and FB the second photographer letting them know that if you don't hear back from them within 24 hours, you will start contacting all of her references to let them know of the situation at hand, jeopardizing their reputation and future way of making money. If you go straight to the references without telling the second photographer first, you are wasting a valuable asset.
If after 24 hours you dont hear from her, contact her references and find out all the info you can about her. Address included and go to her home, leave a note on the door stating that she needs to get in contact with you within 24 hours, or you will take the next natural course of action, which would be a lawsuit. Clearly explain you dont want to escalate the situation and you simply want your images back and that you will not make an effort to damage her reputation if she simply complies.
If after 24 hours from then she doesnt comply, go ahead and file a small claims suit against her. She HAS to reply to that or it automatically is ruled in your favor.
DOCUMENT EVERYTHING YOU DO - if this falls through and your clients dont get what they paid for, you ultimately will be the one to answer for it and you better have documentation that you did everything in your realm possible to try and recover the files for them.
These days when I second, I demand that I be provided with memory cards. It's easier for everyone. I can hand over the cards at the end of the night and go home instead of waiting around for the photographer to transfer them to a laptop. Also, I would never agree to Inku's setup of waiting for my cards in the mail, things get damaged/lost in the mail, he can cancel the check and send a new one but I doubt he'd replace my cards. It also removes the liability of bad cards from my end. If you have trouble transferring files, that's totally your responsibility.
I've yet to meet a photographer that didn't like this setup. One of them was even cheap and just gave me 2 4GB cards. I was fine with that, but understand it limits my amount of coverage. It would have been easier to just buy a cheap 32GB card than limit how much I can shoot.
I hate to say it, but I'm not at all surprised. I've run into too many unprofessional photographers in my short career (2 years) thus far. People who ask for advice, I give it, and they never reply. People who suck at closing the loop of communication - by email, phone, facebook, twitter, fax, or in person. They're horrible at responding to inquiries. I had a client earlier this year tell me she emailed me and 11 other photographers. I was the ONLY one that responded over 7 days (I got back to her less than 3 hours). They ask for help at the last minute. They rant about personal matters on their professional/business blog/facebook page. I just don't get it. Professionalism goes such a long way in an industry where it is so lacking.
I didn't read the rest of this thread, so I hope you worked it out with this second shooter and got the images she was paid to provide to you.
Anyway, at the end of the night, I download all of my second shooter's cards (and my own, for safe keeping) to my Nexto DI back-up. Helps me sleep at night.
swoop wrote:
These days when I second, I demand that I be provided with memory cards. It's easier for everyone. I can hand over the cards at the end of the night and go home instead of waiting around for the photographer to transfer them to a laptop. Also, I would never agree to Inku's setup of waiting for my cards in the mail, things get damaged/lost in the mail, he can cancel the check and send a new one but I doubt he'd replace my cards. It also removes the liability of bad cards from my end. If you have trouble transferring files, that's totally your responsibility.
I've yet to meet a photographer that didn't like this setup. One of them was even cheap and just gave me 2 4GB cards. I was fine with that, but understand it limits my amount of coverage. It would have been easier to just buy a cheap 32GB card than limit how much I can shoot....Show more →
Hey Ken, here a scenario for you:
- Primary lives upstate in the Hudson Valley and is meeting bride in Rockland County.
- You're the second shooter. You live on Long island and have to meet the groom in New Jersey.
- The ceremony is in Westchester.
At what point do you grab the cards from the primary? Would you drive from Long Island to Rockland County to grab cards before heading back to Jersey? I'm curious as to how you would handle that...
swoop wrote:
Also, I would never agree to Inku's setup of waiting for my cards in the mail, things get damaged/lost in the mail, he can cancel the check and send a new one but I doubt he'd replace my cards.
What the hell makes you think that I wouldn't replace anyone's cards. Until they're back in safely in your hands, they're my responsibility. If they get lost or damaged, that's on me.
Inku Yo wrote:
What the hell makes you think that I wouldn't replace anyone's cards. Until they're back in safely in your hands, they're my responsibility. If they get lost or damaged, that's on me.
Yeah, Inku seems like that wouldn't be an issue for him at all. He seems like a very straight up guy Now some other photos I have met in my time...
I once had a second that used one of my cards to shoot because they ran out of cards. I took theirs and mine, downloaded the images at home, and sent them their cards and mine and a check. They lost my 32GB Sandisk Extreme Pro card. At the time, it cost me probably around $300. It came out of their pay for their next gig.
Here's the point - I don't leave without those images. I'm not waiting around to download images from someone's slow ass 133x UDMA1 card to my laptop. I'm not going to wait around while they transfer from my cards to their laptop.
I take your cards, I go home grab a beer and download all the cards at once (up to 8 cards simultaneously). I take a shower and they're almost all downloaded. I sift through, pick one image for a sneak peek, edit, post to FB, good night. I send the cards back along with a check the following Monday or Tuesday via UPS (guess what? They have insurance! AND I can track the package!)
If you have an issue with that, don't volunteer to second shoot with me. Plain and simple. I have more people that want to shoot with me than I have jobs available.
I do the same as Inku... Take your cards and send them on Monday. I have second shot for Inku before.... There isn't a better primary to work for, except maybe me, hahahaha
It kills me when people post problems like this, start a three or four page thread, and then don't reply to anyone's comments (which just encourages people going off on wild tangents). Don, are you still with us?
Maybe the second shooter isn't a girl at all, and handed out her business cards behind the main shooters back after talking with them. Do you have her business card? Does it have a stock D3s photo on it?
maxwell1295 wrote:
Hey Ken, here a scenario for you:
- Primary lives upstate in the Hudson Valley and is meeting bride in Rockland County.
- You're the second shooter. You live on Long island and have to meet the groom in New Jersey.
- The ceremony is in Westchester.
At what point do you grab the cards from the primary? Would you drive from Long Island to Rockland County to grab cards before heading back to Jersey? I'm curious as to how you would handle that...
I've yet to do a wedding where the primary and I didn't meet at the same starting location even to split right after. But if faced with that scenario I guess they can mail the card the week before. Or I can buy/bring a card and get reimbursed. Or if they have a laptop I can wait while they transfer the one card. But that's another benefit of being provided cards. It saves the primary from having to tote around a laptop as well. I'm not against using my own cards but at the end of it all, it's a bigger hassle for everyone.
swoop wrote:
I've yet to do a wedding where the primary and I didn't meet at the same starting location even to split right after. But if faced with that scenario I guess they can mail the card the week before. Or I can buy/bring a card and get reimbursed. Or if they have a laptop I can wait while they transfer the one card. But that's another benefit of being provided cards. It saves the primary from having to tote around a laptop as well. I'm not against using my own cards but at the end of it all, it's a bigger hassle for everyone....Show more →
You know, I just have to say that your proposed scenarios are so much of a bigger hassle, I just wouldn't work with you.
