p.3 #1 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
carstenw wrote:
Agreed, the 5DIII seems like a well sorted camera. The only minor niggle (apart from the top LCD light leak metering problem) is the lack of interchangeable focusing screens, but this is work-around-able.
What I'd like in 5d4 : better DR, pop-up flash, integrated radio flash control, wi-fi connection to pda and/or geotagging, swivel screen. Any other IQ or handling improvements would be welcome, but aren't really necessary (not that those are necessary).
p.3 #2 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
thedigitalbean wrote:
If you think the 5D3's AF system is the same as what was in the 7D, I want some of whatever you're smoking
Ok, then, what are the detailed technical differences in the two AF systems then?
p.3 #3 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
mco_970 wrote:
Yeah, there are some options here to use nice primes with AF when it's wanted and I could potentially convert my favorite CY's to Nikon mount. For my particular wants in a travel camera, it's tempting (moreso than the NEX 7).
The camera body size is also probably better for my CY35-70. It's OK on NEX, but not going to win any awards for ergonomics.
ETA: if I do decide to go this direction, it would potentially replace 5D2 and NEX 5N in my kit. Kind of an interesting direction for a light landscape/travel setup.
I'm not fond of push-pull zooms anyway, but it seems like it would be an especially bad fit for the NEX. I'll be interested to hear what you decide. It would have to be quite a camera to replace both the 5DII and 5N.
p.3 #5 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
freaklikeme wrote:
I'm not fond of push-pull zooms anyway, but it seems like it would be an especially bad fit for the NEX. I'll be interested to hear what you decide. It would have to be quite a camera to replace both the 5DII and 5N.
I think NEX 7 type sensor could replace 5DII for my use, esp. since I just picked up another 1D3. 5D2 is pretty much relegated to landscape, some people shots, and a bit of nature type stuff. It's really the odd guy out in my kit at the moment. 5N does most of those functions, and it gets carried with me a lot more...
You tell me, you are a Nex 7 guy. Does the sensor really compete with Canons FF offering for landscape prints? Maybe not for a pro user, but for the enthusiast type of shooter printing up to 16x20 & shooting with good glass?
p.3 #6 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
From what I have seen, Canon got the rest of the 5D Mark III right as far as AF and the rest of the camera's system (except for the LCD light leak issue which will be fixed). It does seem though this is the camera the Mark II should have been years ago, not the camera that is ready to go up against the less expensive D800.
p.3 #8 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
mco_970 wrote:
'Tranny mirror'-less won't AF, which is the upside to the D3200 for a wimp like me. I wonder how usable the AF confirm points will be on D3200 w/ the f/2 ZF's.
" 'Tranny mirror' "
Why do I find this product somewhat disturbing? Do transvestites really need a special mirror?
p.3 #9 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
mco_970 wrote:
I think NEX 7 type sensor could replace 5DII for my use, esp. since I just picked up another 1D3. 5D2 is pretty much relegated to landscape, some people shots, and a bit of nature type stuff. It's really the odd guy out in my kit at the moment. 5N does most of those functions, and it gets carried with me a lot more...
You tell me, you are a Nex 7 guy. Does the sensor really compete with Canons FF offering for landscape prints? Maybe not for a pro user, but for the enthusiast type of shooter printing up to 16x20 & shooting with good glass? ...Show more →
All conditions being equal, the 7 would have no problem keeping up with (and in some specific lighting scenarios, beating) the 5DII. But 16x20 prints from either wouldn't really be a challenge, so I think it comes down to what you like and what you can live without. Either is capable of giving you what you want out of it.
p.3 #10 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
thedigitalbean wrote:
5D Mark 3:
61-point AF with 41 cross type AF points, of which 5 are "dual diagonal" AF points
AF sensitive to -2 EV
7D:
19-point AF all of which are cross type, the center AF point is dual cross sensitive.
AF sensitive to -0.5 EV
Those are technical specifications. Those that have used both bodies can attest to their performance on real world subjects.
Sure number of AF points is greater, I was more referring to the overall AF system and how the AF chip is sending information to the exposure metering chip etc. , I forget their name for that. Ok the AF points are more sensitive, they probably had that from the 1d series right? How close is this to the 1d4 AF system? So they finally migrated down some of their 1d AF technology, big whoop.They increased the price from 5d2 to do it too.
Anyway, how much exclusive new AF technology is in the 5d3 vs. other previous Canon cameras is something hard to debate about unless you work for Canon.
Low ISO IQ has not improved much from my 1ds3 and that is the main problem for me.
In five years they have not provided an upgrade camera for landscape and studio photographers.
p.3 #11 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
I am 100% sure that Canon is working on some D800 remedy and it will be here for Photokina this fall and the announcement will make a big splash. Camera companies can not come to the largest photo show without mindblowing new products. I wouldnīt buy a camera a 1/2 year before Photokina. Can i live and work with my 5D2 another 5 months?
p.3 #12 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
'Low ISO IQ has not improved much from my 1ds3 and that is the main problem for me.'
It might be that the makers have a take on sensor design, a design preference if you will, and what flows in future years extends that design philosophy. Canon were very keen on high ISO as a key point of differentiation and few users noticed the low ISO set of issues. Sony and Nikon have taken a different pathway obviously, for both FF and APS-C - high Mp counts and highly acceptable noise/DR/colour.
'D800 remedy'. I like that, like it's a disease to Canon that they need to get some antibiotics for, lol. A prophylactic might have worked better. It does seem Canon are rusted onto the ~20Mp area with the 5DII, 7D and now 5DIII - who could possibly needs more?
This is good for a laugh perhaps:
'Well, the 5DIII kicks the daylights out of the D800, no doubt about it. However, this was to be expected as there is no denying the fact that the D800's small pixels simply can't overcome the laws of physics.'
Oooh, those small pixels, positively evil. I also think it's great Nikon put the 24Mp sensor in a cheap DSLR and put such a fair and affordable price on the D800, it's quite out of character for them.
p.3 #13 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
Even if Canon comes out with a high MP competitor camera to the D800 it will most likely have worse DR and color (their long time sensor tech weakness) and worse yet be more expensive than both 5d3 and D800. If they lower the price of that camera to even compete with the $3k D800 price the 5d3 owners will feel robbed just like us 1ds3 owners did when Canon came out with the 5d2 with the same MP count. It is just like Canon and Nikon swapped their long time strategies. If you told someone two years ago that Nikon would design a D700 replacement with much more MP than the 5d2 replacement and it would cost less most people would thought that you were crazy.
p.3 #14 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
Wayne, IMHO the D800 is the most conservative and uninspiring body except for the sensor and maybe the uncompressed HDMI video out (though with moire and line skipping). I donīt mind paying more than 5D3 price for the Canon high MP body as long as it is good; it is still cheaper than switching to Nikon.
p.3 #15 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
Jman13 wrote:
What's even more interesting is that the year old m4/3 camera, the GH2, still has better video quality than the 5D Mark III, in everything except perhaps at ISO 3200.
p.3 #16 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
Couldn't agree more, my metric is NOT the 5D2, it's the 1DS3. The 1DX is no successor to the 1DS3 so it falls on the shoulders of the 5D3. Unfair as that may be, for the majority of studio and landscape photographers, there is no sense in "upgrading" from 21 to 18 MP to shoot a model at 12 FPS at ISO 128000. Perhaps if the 1DX had 18 FOVEON MP, it would make sense, or some other innovative sensor technology but that obviously is not the case and those 18MP will never equal 21 1DS3 MP at base ISO. Thanks but no thanks for making us wait 5+ years for nothing.
For certain, the D800 is a game changer. Expose properly is a weak salvo, when you're in Mozambique at 5:30AM trying to capture the blazing whites and reds and blues while still retaining textures and shadows, 2 stops of DR makes a world of difference. The brand could matter less to me, I'd use Olympus, Pentax, Sony. It's not about the Nikon brand, it's about the camera, and in this regard, Canon just did a face plant. In my view, Canon is abandoning the still photo market. It is merging video and stills with a focus on video, to the detriment of stills.
wayne seltzer wrote:
Sure number of AF points is greater, I was more referring to the overall AF system and how the AF chip is sending information to the exposure metering chip etc. , I forget their name for that. Ok the AF points are more sensitive, they probably had that from the 1d series right? How close is this to the 1d4 AF system? So they finally migrated down some of their 1d AF technology, big whoop.They increased the price from 5d2 to do it too.
Anyway, how much exclusive new AF technology is in the 5d3 vs. other previous Canon cameras is something hard to debate about unless you work for Canon.
Low ISO IQ has not improved much from my 1ds3 and that is the main problem for me.
In five years they have not provided an upgrade camera for landscape and studio photographers.
p.3 #17 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
Dergiman wrote:
I am 100% sure that Canon is working on some D800 remedy and it will be here for Photokina this fall and the announcement will make a big splash. Camera companies can not come to the largest photo show without mindblowing new products. I wouldnīt buy a camera a 1/2 year before Photokina. Can i live and work with my 5D2 another 5 months?
hopefully that's when the D700/300 replacements are revealed
with the recent D3200 revelations things are looking very good!!
p.3 #18 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
Dergiman wrote:
Wayne, IMHO the D800 is the most conservative and uninspiring body except for the sensor and maybe the uncompressed HDMI video out (though with moire and line skipping). I donīt mind paying more than 5D3 price for the Canon high MP body as long as it is good; it is still cheaper than switching to Nikon.
The thing is that Nikon had already nailed the rest of the body with the D700. Barring a massive update somewhere else in their line (ie next-gen AF, next-gen metering) there really wasn't anything to add aside from a new sensor and adding video (remember the D700 had no HD Video capability). So Nikon didn't change what worked.
Canon on the other hand may have upgraded the body tech in the 5D series, but that has more to do with the simple fact that in terms of AF and metering the 5DmII was outdated when it launched. What Canon didn't do was viably improve the other weak point of the 5DmII, the sensor. They've improved things but the new sensor has the same weaknesses as the old one, just in mildly reduced amounts (and the same advantages, also improved).
The 5D remains less body than the D800, but now its a lot closer in performance (AF is arguable either way, both are superb. Nikon still has significantly better flash capability and a stronger metering system along with better build & sealing).
p.3 #20 · D800 spanked the 5DIII in every DXO category!
mawz wrote:
D800 is the D700 replacement (as well as the D3x replacement). D400 will likely be July-ish.
no.....Nikon execs. have repeatedly said that the D800 is NOT the D700 replacement............and I'm holding on to that for now, the D800 is great but I know alot of us D700 shooters want a D800ish type camera with a D3s/D4 sensor.....not 36mp.........
: better DR, pop-up flash, integrated radio flash control, wi-fi connection to pda and/or geotagging, swivel screen. Any other IQ or handling improvements would be welcome, but aren't really necessary (not that those are necessary).