p.3 #1 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Thanks Phillipe, Magiclight, and Bob!
Interesting, sounds like they improved the accuracy over my 7D, which I didn't think was any better than my 1ds3 at focus confirmation for MF as far as having a tight enough window/range .
Anybody know the specs for the AF sensitivity in low light, how much better is this than 5d2 and 1ds3?
p.3 #2 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Does the beast know to activate AF confirmation on a shutter half-press for manual-focus lenses even if back-button autofocus has been set? IMO for those who also use AF lenses, it would still be a nuisance to have to hold AF-On down and remember to hold it down. (Those who *only* use manual focus lenses of course have no need for back-button AF.)
p.3 #4 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Bob, thanks for the samples! Awesome!! I am pretty damned impressed, to borrow a word.
Yes, I have tried to use the AF confirm on my leitaxed 50 1.2 and it just doesn't work well at all on 5D2, even with center focus point. It has too big of a range, and just forget about using AF confirm with any of the outer points. I have the EG-S and can use it, or can go into liveview, but there are times that great AF confirm would be a blessing! MF makes my eyes fatigued after a while, I think just a consequence of my astigmatism.
As well, I don't feel like the either the EGS screen or the matt grid screen is very helpful with my two f/3.4 Zeiss lenses. If AF confirm worked well for those, it would be great - I'd use my 35-70 more for casual walkaround.
So for me, it's potentially a game changer to have the AF confirm improvements. YMMV of course!
p.3 #5 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Siddhu wrote:
@rji2goleez - So what you are demonstrating with your test is that even with the least "accurate" focus point, you were able to nail focus - correct?
What I hope it means is that the outer most focus points work well, even in low light high ISO conditions. I'm still playing and learning what this camera can do and was only trying to relay what I have found to date. It is quite encouraging to me. I tend to be less scientific and rigorous in my experimentation and focus on the type of shooting that I like to do. That being said, I've never had much issue with any of the focus points on the 5DII but then again, I've never been alerted to some of these findings before now. I had the EG-S screen in my 5D II but I never perceived a dramatic difference. In fact, I was somewhat disappointed.
The game changer in all of this for me is how quickly I can achieve focus with AF confirm with my ZEs in the 5DIII vs the 5DII. I spend less time focusing, more time composing and bet I will miss fewer shots.
p.3 #6 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
mco_970 wrote:
As well, I don't feel like the either the EGS screen or the matt grid screen is very helpful with my two f/3.4 Zeiss lenses. If AF confirm worked well for those, it would be great - I'd use my 35-70 more for casual walkaround.
Somewhat glad to hear that other people have difficulty focusing the C/Y 35-70 with Eg-S screen as well - so it is not just my incompentence. I like the pictures from this lens but I can only nail focus with live view on the 5D II, particularly towards the wider end. Reliable AF-confirm would be great - but I won't be able to jump onto the 5DIII bandwagon for a while (not until they go for less than $1500 second-hand which will be a few years)
p.3 #7 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
I'd be interested to know if Canon has fixed the noise banding. For instance, what happens if you underexpose a shot at 100 ISO and have to lift the exposure to get the shadows back?
The issues that the mk2 had with this made it sound quite unattractive to me.
Mar 29, 2012 at 08:46 AM
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p.3 #8 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Samuli Vahonen wrote:
Philippe, I'm not sure I understood you correctly, but the game changer is that you can get focus confirm instead of not getting it at all?
I don't understand because getting focus confirm has never been issue, but the issue is that the focus confirm is useless is the issue. For example if my subject is 5m distance there are two issues:
a) camera confirms target to be in focus +-25cm from target (when one would need to focus ~5cm to not notice that photo is not front- or backfocused)
b) the focus confirm can show the +-25cm confirmation 20-30 cm different place each time (or depending are you focusing from close to far or far to close)
[with Canon lenses you are most probably OK with this huge "tolerance" but Zeiss lenses tend to have quite large differences in contrast inside the "mathematically acceptable DOF" and require the user to place the focus to correct place and not just inside DOF for best results]
So has Canon increased the focus accuracy of the focus confirmation light? That combined with Nikon like arrow indication "which way to focus" might be considered as game changer. However if focus accuracy (the "area" during which the green light is lit) is kept same focus confirm is still useless for anything else than 6" by 4" prints or less than 1000px webthumbnails....Show more →
Lloyd chambers wrote that the focus confirmation where better and more precise than before. (if you used chipped lenses)
Mar 29, 2012 at 08:56 AM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #9 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
philber wrote:
Wayne, Samuli, AF confirm is now much more accurate and consistent than it was, and operates accurately even in much lower light. I can now get accurate focus confirm even with my ZE 85 wide open at MFD, where DOF is least, in a room so dark that the Auto ISO selects 12.800. Obviously, what applies to very dark environments also holds for others not so dark....
p.3 #11 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
rji2goleez wrote:
What I hope it means is that the outer most focus points work well, even in low light high ISO conditions. I'm still playing and learning what this camera can do and was only trying to relay what I have found to date. It is quite encouraging to me. I tend to be less scientific and rigorous in my experimentation and focus on the type of shooting that I like to do. That being said, I've never had much issue with any of the focus points on the 5DII but then again, I've never been alerted to some of these findings before now. I had the EG-S screen in my 5D II but I never perceived a dramatic difference. In fact, I was somewhat disappointed.
The game changer in all of this for me is how quickly I can achieve focus with AF confirm with my ZEs in the 5DIII vs the 5DII. I spend less time focusing, more time composing and bet I will miss fewer shots. ...Show more →
Ok thanks!
The reason for my questioning is that I'm able to nail a good 90% of my shots with the 5d2 using my ZEs in a variety of conditions by "eye" - i.e. I never use the focus confirmation dot, or any sort of AF assist. I know that this is old school but I started shooting waaaay before AF existed! It's just natural to me.
I'm trying to get a handle on how I'm going to have to shoot with the 5D3. Will I be able to just focus manually using the 5d3 stock screen (as I do currently with the 5D2 with the Eg-S), or will I have to use AF points/the focus confirmation as the stock screen will NOT give me enough precision for manual focus.
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p.3 #12 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Thanks for these reports. They help us know what the 5D MKIII is a capable of. Put me in the camp that doesn't like AF confirmation, however. I like to use liveview when I have the camera on a tripod and I like to shoot seeing focus in the viewfinder when shooting handheld. If you look at the other thread on the 5D MKIII and alts (and Lloyd Chambers reports) it seems that the MKII is better both for liveview and for focussing seeing focus in the viewfinder. In fact, that thread suggests that focussing using the screen in the 5D MKIII only has accurate depth of field to f/4. So for me, I can't see how this would be a game changer, but I understand how it could be for others.
Mar 29, 2012 at 09:51 AM
Lars Johnsson Offline • • • • • • • Upload & Sell: Off
p.3 #13 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Siddhu wrote:
Ok thanks!
The reason for my questioning is that I'm able to nail a good 90% of my shots with the 5d2 using my ZEs in a variety of conditions by "eye" - i.e. I never use the focus confirmation dot, or any sort of AF assist. I know that this is old school but I started shooting waaaay before AF existed! It's just natural to me.
I'm trying to get a handle on how I'm going to have to shoot with the 5D3. Will I be able to just focus manually using the 5d3 stock screen (as I do currently with the 5D2 with the Eg-S), or will I have to use AF points/the focus confirmation as the stock screen will NOT give me enough precision for manual focus.
Just test it. If you get the same amount of keepers without using AF confirmation. You should of course just keep on doing this. But if the AF confirmation gives you a lot more in focus shots, you will probably change your style of shooting
p.3 #14 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Siddhu wrote:
Ok thanks!
The reason for my questioning is that I'm able to nail a good 90% of my shots with the 5d2 using my ZEs in a variety of conditions by "eye" - i.e. I never use the focus confirmation dot, or any sort of AF assist. I know that this is old school but I started shooting waaaay before AF existed! It's just natural to me.
I'm trying to get a handle on how I'm going to have to shoot with the 5D3. Will I be able to just focus manually using the 5d3 stock screen (as I do currently with the 5D2 with the Eg-S), or will I have to use AF points/the focus confirmation as the stock screen will NOT give me enough precision for manual focus.
I really don't see a visible difference in trying to focus with the stock screen versus AF confirmation. In my limited use, when it looks like I have achieved focus, the AF confirmation also chirps so for me, it's one and the same. I haven't tried with AF confirmation turned off, however.
p.3 #15 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Steve Spencer wrote:
Thanks for these reports. They help us know what the 5D MKIII is a capable of. Put me in the camp that doesn't like AF confirmation, however. I like to use liveview when I have the camera on a tripod and I like to shoot seeing focus in the viewfinder when shooting handheld. If you look at the other thread on the 5D MKIII and alts (and Lloyd Chambers reports) it seems that the MKII is better both for liveview and for focussing seeing focus in the viewfinder. In fact, that thread suggests that focussing using the screen in the 5D MKIII only has accurate depth of field to f/4. So for me, I can't see how this would be a game changer, but I understand how it could be for others. ...Show more →
I haven't tried this yet but I have taken some quick pics in live view and reaching AF Confirmation with the green square. Seemed to work fine. That's not the same as what you (Lloyd Chambers) are saying but I will be shooting with live view and seeing for myself.
p.3 #16 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Does one use micro adjust in the cam on 5DIII or on the chip? I wonder how the cam knows which lens is being used with the chipped adapters. Perhaps emf chips are better for this application though they are a pain to program. Reikan software may be just the ticket to fine tune microadjust with less pain.
I know he was thinking about adding direct support for chipped adapters from monitoring his blog but he didn't answer a direct inquiry. I think it would work fine manually.
p.3 #17 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Interesting thread - and many sub-questions. Good to hear your positive experiences with the 5D3 Philippe and Bob!
I have a question. When I changed the matte in the 5D2 from the stock to the EG-S the change was dramatic. With fast lenses used wide open optimal focus suddenly screamed in the VF - which is essentially why I started to play with manual focus lenses. For me the stock screen (in 5D2) is nowhere close, almost useless. To be clear, this is at wide-open (or close to wide open) usage - not landscaping F/8-11 or so.
You that report such a big change in usability with the 5D3's stock screen, do you also share the same experience with the EG-S vs stock in the 5D2? If you just tested the EG-S a few times and then went LV it does not count here
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A second input/thought is about AF-confirm. With slow lenses I use it with the 5D2, I find it work well - but you're more or less limited to the center cross, albeit the other sometimes help. The reason for it working could of course be the fact that the DOF is wider, but still it's useful. Particularly as the EG-S makes the VF dark with slower lenses (VERY dark in low-light situations).
The last point is really the backside of the EG-S.
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FWIW, regarding the 5D2 AF system (and AF-confirm system) there's a big difference in the tolerance depending on what AF-point you use and what lens you mount. The centerpoint in the 5D2 have a tighter tolerance than the others when using a lens F/2.8 or faster. With a lens slower than F/2.8 all points are the same, the only difference is that some are crosses (2 lines) and some are single lines.
The difference in tolerance was/is transmitted to the (AF) lens, and when a fast lens was mounted the "normal" tolerance distance was split into three, increasing the precision by the same factor, 3. This was marketed as "point with increased precision". I have always assumed that this circuitry/code was paralleled for the AF-confirm light/beep.
Does anyone have an update about this regarding the 5D3?
For the 5D2 Canon probably had its reasons, but to be honest I never understood why the scheme was not employed to every point. In 2008 the processors already had a wealth of capacity to harvest. Even today the 5D2 is so much swifter and responsive when pressing buttons/enlarging images on the screen etc than the NEX 5N that I also use.
p.3 #18 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
wfrank wrote:
Interesting thread - and many sub-questions. Good to hear your positive experiences with the 5D3 Philippe and Bob!
I have a question. When I changed the matte in the 5D2 from the stock to the EG-S the change was dramatic. With fast lenses used wide open optimal focus suddenly screamed in the VF - which is essentially why I started to play with manual focus lenses. For me the stock screen (in 5D2) is nowhere close, almost useless. To be clear, this is at wide-open (or close to wide open) usage - not landscaping F/8-11 or so.
You that report such a big change in usability with the 5D3's stock screen, do you also share the same experience with the EG-S vs stock in the 5D2? If you just tested the EG-S a few times and then went LV it does not count here ...Show more →
It's hard to give metrics here. I had the EG-S in my (now sold) 5D2. I didn't feel like the change was dramatic but I kept the EG-S in the camera for the time I used it. So, last week, I shot the 5D2 (with EG-S). This week, I changed to the 5D3 with stock screen. To me, there was a dramatic jumb as you describe when you changed screens in your 5D2. And to be clear, I'm talking handheld, manual focusing through the VF. Except for increased low light performance, this was the most dramatic finding with my use of the 5D3 vs 5D2 to date. I spend less time ensuring proper focus and therefore I can concentrate on composition during street shooting.
A second input/thought is about AF-confirm. With slow lenses I use it with the 5D2, I find it work well - but you're more or less limited to the center cross, albeit the other sometimes help. The reason for it working could of course be the fact that the DOF is wider, but still it's useful. Particularly as the EG-S makes the VF dark with slower lenses (VERY dark in low-light situations).
The last point is really the backside of the EG-S.
Note my unscientific test a page back. I used the outer most focus point without surrounding assist at ISO 12800, shooting wide open!
p.3 #20 · 5D III for alt and MF lenses: a game changer!
Given your photographs, Bob, and Philber's hands-on experience, one wonders what Lloyd Chambers was thinking to make the statement that he did. I have often thought he was more of Nikon man. I guess tribal loyalties got the better of him on this occasion.
It just goes to show you can never believe what is written on the Internet.
Awesome!! I am pretty damned impressed, to borrow a word. 
