p.1 #1 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Hey guys,
So i've been a long time browser of the forum, but it's finally time for me to step up and ask for some advice. Before I ask, here's a quick introduction to my level of ability. I've been shooting professionally for about 2 years now and as a hobbyist for probably 4-5 years prior to that. I've assisted a photographer who had shot high fashion for 30 years and is now retired. Since then i've been published in Elle, Bazaar, Astonish and a few other fashion publications. I've also shot for Nissan, Toyota, Red Bull, Trojan and several other clients while working at an Ad Agency. I've been shooting with Alien Bees for about 3 years now and have loved them, but now that i'm stepping up the level of clientele I cater to, i'm starting to see the limitations of the equipment I use. On bigger campaigns I have the ability to rent gear to use, but that's not always the case, and those big campaigns are still far and few in between. I'm still an aspiring photographer.
So my question is, with a $3500 budget, what's my best bet for lighting? I do a lot of studio and location work, but i've started to do fashion work requiring more and more motion capture. I'd love to pick up a set of Profoto 7B's with super fast recyle rates and short flash durations, but that's just not possible at this point. I do need two heads, but I also need portable power as well as a pack that works in studio. I don't think I need more than a total of 1200-2000W of power between the two heads. It's been so long since i've looked at gear that it's just all a blur to me now. I absolutely love Elinchrom modifiers and will without a doubt be picking up Octabanks. I also love Mola beauty dishes so those are a must. My core kit however is the issue. Hopefully I didn't leave any information out. Thanks ahead of time for any help or advice you guys can give me!
p.1 #2 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
You can find a 7B pack with 2 heads on Ebay for your budget - and if you need extra heads, you can simply rent them. The benefits of Profoto is that it's in nearly every rental house worldwide and the gear just works. It's incredibly durable and user friendly. I would keep an eye out on Ebay and other sites. Monolights can work for fashion, but they're not ideal. I have a set of Hensel monolights I've used for years on smaller projects, but I'm giving them to my assistant, electing to work with my Profoto gear on all future projects.
p.1 #4 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Is there a reason why you aren't looking at Einsteins? They have the ultra fast duration for motion work and you can use all of your current modifiers.
p.1 #5 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
hondageek wrote:
Is there a reason why you aren't looking at Einsteins? They have the ultra fast duration for motion work and you can use all of your current modifiers.
p.1 #6 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Consider very strongly who your client base is...shooting cars, particularly, gets into the need for some rather specialized (huge) large light sources, and you'll want to choose a lighting system which can fit these devices. And that may well also mean you need very high power supplies (>2000w-s)
p.1 #7 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
I've done large cars with 2 large scrims and 4 Einsteins. So I wouldn't rule anything out.
Looking at budget here, and adding USE+WANT.. Your either looking at someone's used problems or, (I don't know if it's a power issue your having) go with The Einsteins with the mini vagabond system. That and the CyberCommander will get you into the show with money left for popcorn...
I hope it's not the 'LOOK' of your equipment that's got you misty in front of clients..
p.1 #8 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
While I love Profoto, Einsteins are hard to beat.
I don't agree. If travel is necessary for a gig, you don't necessarily want to be dragging your light gear to every location. And if you're not intimately familiar with gear at the local rental houses, then you're taking a needless risk. The Profoto packs allow for more power, built like tanks and extremely easy to use.
Not a knock on Einstein monolights - I used to own some lighting years ago and it was fine, but in my opinion, they're not an ideal choice for commercial photography. Will they work? Certainly - and probably very well, but Profoto is just better gear from a build standpoint, more powerful - which is important in fashion and every pro assistant is familiar with them. You spend a little more, but you get what you pay for.
p.1 #11 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
I guess it's just how much you think you really need as a pro and how much money you have. I agree Profoto is wonderful gear too. But guys like Scott Kelby, Joe McNally, Frank Doorhoff, and many other great pros who are making a lot of money trusting Elinchrom full time, find the value and quality more than enough. And you really can't argue about the performance of their light modifers.
p.1 #12 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Buy what you can get repaired locally, add to your kit by renting easily (local or out of town), have a wide choice to buy new or used stuff.
When I worked at PIX in LA the big rental brand was Profoto, some dynalights for smaller jobs, some Speedotrons for renters coming from the midwest. Most rental studios on LA have Profoto.
When you say 'motion capture' do you mean video? That's another story. And $3500 isn;t enough.
Only a few people I know in LA have studios these days so they have a small kit with a couple heads and then they rent the rest of everything they need (stages, big trucks full of lights, etc.) Rentals are billable without a hitch. It is sometimes tricky to rent your own equipment to yourself and bill the client.
Although they do wonderful work,I would take what brand famous people use with a grain of salt, they may be sponsored or beta testing. Spending your own money is different.
p.1 #13 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Guys, i end up repeating this quite often but... Einsteins aren't the great end all flash freezing product...
You really need to consider that the power output of the Einstein is set to drop for faster flashes, and thats fine, but not for a full scale fashion shoot where you have 1000ws lights punching things out and you're gonna want a decently fast duration with enough Power to use it through the modifier of choice at the right distance.
Theres a reason that those 2kw power packs exist. Alot of the more powerful strobes have slower flash durations but considering that the fastest flash duration is at their top power, its not even remotely comparable. And i'm not even talking about the specialty bron/prof packs with high flash durations which also tend to go up as power goes down but start off with alot more power.
p.1 #14 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
With your budget, there is no way you can get all you want. And 2 heads won't cut it in the studio most likely. If you are going to be busy you need back up too. I see you with 3 Einstein and high quality accessories like stands boxes, etc from the manufacturer of your choice. You sound like you are busy enough to make it and you want high end gear which I prefer to refer as super flexible gear. You need to have a plan. If you want to own Profoto, get light (get the minimum) with the Einstein system and save your money for the long term investment you may want to make in a couple years. Now you can mount your quality boxes on your Profoto that you set on those solid stands and the Einsteins are your back up and probably your portable set for some more time. You can start your investment with those 2 heads and a flexible pack. From there you can expand your inventory just as needed.
p.1 #16 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
"Although they do wonderful work,I would take what brand famous people use with a grain of salt, they may be sponsored or beta testing. Spending your own money is different."
If this was the case every pro would be getting their stuff for free and the equipment makers wouldn't be making any money. If you look at the pro's sites that I have listed you will see that they buy their own equipment just like you and I. This is one of the reasons I listed these specific people as I understand this.
As far as repairs go I can say that I have used Elinchrom for about 5 years now with thousands of clicks and dropped two RX-600's twice without a single missed shot. No matter what you buy though, if this is a big worry for you, you should have a back-up anyway. Yes there may be a rental shop nearby but will it be open or even have the gear when you need it if something goes wrong.
You just can't go wrong with either Elinchrom or Profoto.
p.1 #18 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Thank you for the compliment nolaguy! Most of my beauty shots were actually shot with the Paul Buff 22" beauty dish. I recently just ordered the Mola 22" Demi after using it through a photographer I assisted. The mola's just tend to give a much deeper light with smoother light to shadow transitions IMO. They're a big finicky to use and you really have to paint the light perfectly to get the best results. I've been saving up for new lights and gear and after a 2-3 year run with my alien bees, it finally feels really good to step up to more consistent lighting. You just can't beat a pack with monos.
p.1 #19 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
PS I ended up going Hensel. Found a Hensel Vela AS 1500W pack and some EHT heads. Ordered another Pack and i'm planning on getting a few Porty's and EH heads as well. Also picked up a 48" and 60" octabox's from Rime Light, 52" umbrellas from Wescott, a Mola Demi and Setti and i'm ready to shoot in any conditions now! Just temporary until I can afford Broncolor Thanks for all the help guys.
p.1 #20 · Looking to upgrade from AB's and need advice
Micky Bill wrote:
Buy what you can get repaired locally, add to your kit by renting easily (local or out of town), have a wide choice to buy new or used stuff.
When I worked at PIX in LA the big rental brand was Profoto, some dynalights for smaller jobs, some Speedotrons for renters coming from the midwest. Most rental studios on LA have Profoto.
When you say 'motion capture' do you mean video? That's another story. And $3500 isn;t enough.
Only a few people I know in LA have studios these days so they have a small kit with a couple heads and then they rent the rest of everything they need (stages, big trucks full of lights, etc.) Rentals are billable without a hitch. It is sometimes tricky to rent your own equipment to yourself and bill the client.
Although they do wonderful work,I would take what brand famous people use with a grain of salt, they may be sponsored or beta testing. Spending your own money is different. ...Show more →
Thanks for all the help guys.