An American Soldier in Canada
/forum/topic/835179/2

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bridow
Registered: Jun 08, 2003
Total Posts: 739
Country: United States

I love how an internet fight was created without even knowing the guys story. I guess everyone's balls are bigger online.

Maybe he is wearing his fathers jacket that died in the war. I had a good friend in junior high who's dad died in the first Gulf War and he wore his dad's coat for a long time. It is remembrance day after all.



liamh
Registered: Jul 24, 2005
Total Posts: 3702
Country: United Kingdom

I want to know who the three cowboys are in the background. They look like they're wearing leather motorbike jackets, not your typical uniform.

As for the man disrespecting the uniform, I think we need to see more images from the event. On the face of it, it does look disrespectful, but without knowing the context we cannot begin to form any kind of coherent judgement and even then we're sure to be wide of the mark.

When all said and done who are we to judge?

From Westminster Abbey on Sunday. The unknown soldier, some poppies and some of the fallen:













Lest we forget.


Steady Hand
Registered: Dec 03, 2007
Total Posts: 15596
Country: United States

Liam,

The last pic of yours, the sea of crosses, is a nice poignant image. I like the POV and the motion of the "wave" in the mass.



Beanrat
Registered: Jun 06, 2008
Total Posts: 72
Country: United States

while you all debate about the proper wearing of the uniform... I do see an editorial side to this photo - the post name and the photo made me think about the draft dodgers that went to Canada - not a pleasant or proud part of remembering the veterans that gave so much - but a poignant rememberance of days gone by that did shape todays attitudes... albeit for the worse IMHO. I like whoever called it the Obamanation.

I did not serve due to medical - but have many uncles that were in VietNam and Korea and my grandfather who was in WWII. The draft dodgers were and are considered a disgrace - maybe this soldier was paying tribute in such a way to inflame you and remind you all just exactly how you feel... to make sure the fire of patriotism stays kindled!



cheese
Registered: Nov 01, 2009
Total Posts: 29
Country: United States

Until any of us go to IRAQ we have no right to criticize the way he wears his uniform.

He wears the poppy in honor of fallen Canadian soldiers, In recent times fighting American wars.

Just my 2 Cents



lt231
Registered: Jan 21, 2008
Total Posts: 63
Country: United States

You can not compare this guys wearing of the uniform to a ww2, Korea or Viet Nam vets wearing of bits and pieces of their generations uniform. The difference is that the uniform in the photo is the dress uniform of the US Army as issued today and is subject to the rules and regs in effect today. The other uniforms are no longer in use and have, for want of a better term, been decommissioned and can be worn as the owner sees fit. Just because the guy in the photo may have served honorably, perhaps even heroically, does not relieve him of his responsibility to observe the respect that the uniform demands. As a past warier of the same uniform, I am appalled by his disrespect and if I encountered him in this condition, would bring it to his attention. Sorry for the rant.



jforkner
Registered: Dec 02, 2008
Total Posts: 494
Country: United States

As a retired Air Force officer and Vietnam vet, I take offense seeing "soldiers" dressed like that. Enough said.


Jack



Ian Bower
Registered: Sep 13, 2007
Total Posts: 1117
Country: United States

Nice Image!



cgardner
Registered: Nov 18, 2002
Total Posts: 9376
Country: United States

As for the photo?

Lighting: A person wearing shades is one of the few situations where direct sun on a face works, but here what is especially noteworthy is the way the light is feathered on the face of the woman next to him.

Facial Angles: Also very nice and flattering.

Composition: The figures in the background on horseback add context that the guy isn't active duty and there is some sort of parade going on there an the fact they are rendered OOF creates very effective separation. But what isn't working is the crop on the bodies in the foreground, especially the shorter woman who is chopped off arbitrarily. A wider horizontal or square crop or vertical crop in camera would have be more balanced and flattering.

The uniform? I think by serving in Iraq he earned the right to wear it any way he wants to on Veteran's Day now that he's no longer in the service. After all, he was serving to defend the Constitution and the Bill of Rights, which last time I checked still included the right of free speech and peaceable assembly in the first amendment.


Chuck




charlesk
Registered: Oct 21, 2003
Total Posts: 6452
Country: United States

Skyhawk42 wrote:
I very much doubt he served. If he had served proudly he wouldn't wear the uniform like this. He's a fraud and another example of this Obamanation we are crumbling to. very sad.

12 year veteran of the USN

John Binford


Yeah, nobody ever wore their uniforms incorrectly before Obama took office! It's amazing how much power that guy has. .

Based on this thread, "being judgmental and obnoxious" must be one of the first things covered in basic training.



Go4Long
Registered: Sep 04, 2005
Total Posts: 1588
Country: Canada

I'm assuming he meant abomination - a vile, shameful, or detestable action, condition, habit, etc.: Spitting in public is an abomination.

Websters to the rescue. Lol. And the issue here is not one of wether or not he has earned the right to wear the uniform how he sees fit...it's the fact that the Uniform is more than just a uniform to some. Wearing the dress uniform is a sign of respect to all the people that have worn it before you, and a symbol to all those that will wear it after you. You can't earn the right to show them any less respect, and if the guy had lost his legs in the war it would still be the same.



cre55107
Registered: Sep 08, 2008
Total Posts: 902
Country: United States

I agree a previous poster. For those of us who were in the military I don't think the majority of us would see it as very tasteful to wear our uniform in a half assed attempt. We know the uniform is more than just that, but it is something of a symbol as to what each individual soldier has accomplished or been rewarded with. Something that we wear with a lot more pride than just throwing it on for the hell of it.



Harry T
Registered: Jan 29, 2007
Total Posts: 1004
Country: United States

You know a lot of you talk a big game about this uniform thing but let's put another spin on this. What about the DoD Civilian contractors that are issued and must wear the uniform of the contract they are serving? Many of us that go back and forth to the Mid-East see too many bearded, ragged, obese, lazy slobs who wear the same uniforms the guys getting killed are wearing yet it seems to be quite okay with the DoD in doing such. And it's not just a debate i bring up it's been talked about numerous times in letters to the editor and the like in such publications as "Stars and Stripes" the unofficial US military newspaper. A military uniform is a uniform no matter which set it is they all are 'required' to be worn with the same respect.

Ok rant off...again



Go4Long
Registered: Sep 04, 2005
Total Posts: 1588
Country: Canada

sorry harry, I'm not really sure if you're trying to come off as for or against this particular gentleman's wearing of the uniform.



Geo31
Registered: Jul 29, 2006
Total Posts: 570
Country: United States

CaptainAmerica wrote:
That is not a soldier. That is a Vietnam era uniforrn and patches.

Captain America


The campaign ribbons are current, although it looks like there is a Kosovo Campaign ribbon that is being worn upside down. (?)

I agree that the look is disgraceful. It's commendable to honour our Canadian friends who have given the last full measure of devotion, but I don't see how wearing the uniform in that fashion is honouring those who have fallen. If you want to honour them, IMHO you should wear the uniform with more dignity.



Geo31
Registered: Jul 29, 2006
Total Posts: 570
Country: United States

Rick Joyce wrote:
After all is said and done here, let me say that I posted this photo as something I found interesting and not to be a commentary on the correct wearing of an army uniform. Of course the uniform is not being worn correctly, but this is a "people" forum where we post images of people regardless of their dress.


Red herring.

We comment all the time on people's clothing in the people forum. Anyone who has read enough C&C will have to admit that. The fact is, it's part of the image and therefore is open to discussion IMHO.



ksmahgrts
Registered: Nov 23, 2005
Total Posts: 5684
Country: United States

while we can't presume to know this young man's motives, his disheveled display shows a callous lack of awareness on a number of levels - which in and of itself is disgraceful.

how can this young man be so unaware that his shoddy appearance matters?

on a very personal level, the opinion of active-duty soldiers matters. the opinion of deceased soldiers' families, friends, and comrades matters. the opinion of veterans matters.

on a much larger scale, the world-wide perception of the US and its armed forces matters, particularly in a time of war. any self-respecting soldier would be acutely aware that he is representing not only himself, but his entire country.

frankly, i'm disappointed in just how cavalier some of the respondents to this thread have been in dismissing the concerns of those whose opinions truly DO matter. thank you, veterans.



Pfiltz
Registered: Feb 15, 2002
Total Posts: 5420
Country: United States

I'll not debate the "protect" the U.S. from the bad guys thing, and "proper" miltary garb.



The image?

It is what it is...

Oh for what it's worth my dad served in the Korean War.

Which he so reminded me of as, "The forgotten war...."




Geo31
Registered: Jul 29, 2006
Total Posts: 570
Country: United States

Rick Joyce wrote:
After all is said and done here, let me say that I posted this photo as something I found interesting and not to be a commentary on the correct wearing of an army uniform. Of course the uniform is not being worn correctly, but this is a "people" forum where we post images of people regardless of their dress.


I want to follow up on my previous comments on this....

We all talk photos to elicit some reaction or stir some emotion. Anybody who says differently is lying, even if the reaction of emotion they wish to stir is their own.

Therefore, I submit that it is right and proper for people to comment on their reactions to this photo. Sometime the reactions and emotions our photos stir are not the ones intended. I don't think it is right for any photographer or artist to tell any viewer what they should or should not consider in an image. An image, as submitted, is the image and each viewer will have his or her own reaction. Regardless of your intent, to post a photo here and suggest to anyone what they can or should consider is, well, silly IMHO.

If you want comment on the technical aspects of this photo, I can give my opinion. It's no more than a snapshot, so from a technical perspective it's boring. Next. That said, I don't think this image was submitted for technical consideration. It was indeed intended to elicit a reaction. It has elicited many reactions, some of them strong. If some people have a problem with the reactions, I say too bad. The discussion is not a purely political discussion, but rather a reaction to the image. With one small exception, all of the discussion here has been purely about reaction to this image and IMHO very valid indeed. Art by its very nature is often controversial. If this image is controversial, so be it. Discussions about it should not be suppressed, otherwise, what does that say about this forum as an open forum for discussions of the images presented here?



jwilson66
Registered: Aug 24, 2005
Total Posts: 37
Country: United States

Rick Joyce wrote:
CaptainAmerica wrote:
That is not a soldier. That is a Vietnam era uniforrn and patches.

Captain America


This is the uniform he wore recently in Iraq.



Ummm...no! He did NOT wear that uniform in Iraq. The only authorized uniforms in the Iraqi Joint Operating Area (IJOA) are the tactical uniforms, ie. camouflage for the Army, Marines, Air Force. Navy wears either Army camouflage or the desert utilities, pilots can wear their flight suits. The dress uniforms, of which this green jacket is a part, are not allowed. Just FYI...



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