Okay this is a bit of a rant but i'll try and keep it brief.... About 6 months ago I did a promo shoot for a band for free however they were a member short at the time. On the day I said that i'd be fine to come back and shoot the remainder of the shots with their new member and i'd do it at no cost as I'm building my portfolio.

I've just found out that they wound up getting someone else to finish off the shoot (fair enough), however what I don't think is fair is that they have redone all the shots in the exact same location that I used and done a VERY poor job of them.... Ordinarily I wouldn't give a toss except they've lumped these rubbish shots in with all my previous work on their site and so for all I know business could be either going to the wrong person OR i'm winding up with a reputation for poor work based on the crappy shots the girl took...

How would you approach this? Both the band and the other "photographer" (and I use the term VERY loosely) are actually friends of mine which is why it annoys me the most... I was actually speaking with her about my idea's for when I go back and shoot the full band and she even ripped off one of my idea's to the LETTER.... Sorry if this is a bit disjointed but i'm pretty annoyed right now and had to vent...

What would you do?

Make sure you are in no way affiliated with the bands website or any of the work on it to avoid confusion between the two sets of work, and chalk it upto experience.

Find another band to shoot more and better pictures with, your current scenario doesn't sound like it has a very good solution considering they are all your friends.
Put your good shots on your website, and have them put a photocredit for you on the pics that are on their website.

Micky Bill wrote:
Put your good shots on your website, and have them put a photocredit for you on the pics that are on their website.

Yup. There's not much else you can do. Unless you have contracts with some sort of applicable terms in it, there's not a lot you can do to control how your work is used or what it's associated with when it's being used with permission. And as for someone ripping off your ideas...so it goes. There's a reason why photographers hold their yet-to-be-shot concepts and favorite locations close to the vest. Next time keep mum on your ideas until you've shot them and watch your mouth around other photographers.

laidlow wrote:
What would you do?

What I did over 10 years ago and still do every day .. use a contract and don't work for free.

FWIW this is supposed to be a pro forum ..

Find some new friends.

Mike Mahoney wrote:
laidlow wrote:
What would you do?

What I did over 10 years ago and still do every day .. use a contract and don't work for free.

FWIW this is supposed to be a pro forum ..


This isn't really a pricing or a contractual issue. The OP is wondering how he can distance himself from being associated with a photographer who steals his concepts and uses them as her own.

to the OP: If you are that concerned about it, then just ask for your photos to be taken down from their website. If they are your friends as you say they are, and since you did the shoot for free, then they might be willing to take them down at your request. I would try to explain the issue as candidly as possible.

Greg Hawkins wrote:
watermark

How exactly would this solve the OP's problem? Especially since he has already given the photos away un-watermarked.

It is a price and contract issue. He didn't charge and he has no contract. That's one of the reasons it's a problem. The "users" don't have the same understanding of what was intended as the OP does. The OP owns the copyright and he can control the way the images are used and displayed. It's easy with a contract, harder without. He would have to invoke things like the DMCA takedowns, etc., if the "friends" don't respond to a request to credit, to take down, etc.

Even if he intended to not charge for the pictures, he could have entered into a written agreement that covered the permissive uses and license details.

Likewise, he needs to be clear with his friends how he feels about what they did.

Mike Mahoney wrote:
laidlow wrote:
What would you do?

What I did over 10 years ago and still do every day .. use a contract and don't work for free.

FWIW this is supposed to be a pro forum ..


And he asked a question looking for some 'pro' advice. Maybe he doesn't have ten years of experience. Bands are funny clients, they often work for free and don;t see why everybody else doesn't either. And they are friends...lighten up.

Micky Bill wrote:
And he asked a question looking for some 'pro' advice. Maybe he doesn't have ten years of experience. Bands are funny clients, they often work for free and don;t see why everybody else doesn't either. And they are friends...lighten up.

The chance of getting "pro" advice on this forum has been dropping steadily for the past two years. And the number of actual pros participating in this forum has dwindled to the point where teh most active discussions are mostly about what watch we all wear.

Non paid, non-contracted work is the antithesis of "professional". And any questions that evolve from that kind of activity do not belong here.

He was given the best possible advice .. get a contract and stop being Santa.

Mike Mahoney wrote:
..snip..
Non paid, non-contracted work is the antithesis of "professional". And any questions that evolve from that kind of activity do not belong here.
..snip..

If not here where do they belong? The guy is trying to do the right thing and the advice he gets it to go back in time and get a contract. Maybe it's good that some of the pros are leaving, they were getting a little bitter.

Cheers for the advice guys - I understand now that working for free is stupid which is why I no longer do it however unfortunately this was when I was just starting out so I was eager to get the opportunity. Have decided to tell the band to take down the images and tell them they can pay for their usage if they wish to continue using them.

And no i'm not a Pro however I was under the impression that you could post questions TO the pro's and they may be able to assist. Apologies if I ruined anyones day

No days have been ruined

And you have a good attitude which goes a long way .. valuing your work and having clear contractual understandings about usage of photos from that work prevents many problems.

Cheers Mike

Mike Mahoney wrote:

Non paid, non-contracted work is the antithesis of "professional". And any questions that evolve from that kind of activity do not belong here.

.

Well, there are "pros" who post in this forum who barely even know the stipulations of their own contracts.

It rarely pays to give photos away, but at least you seem to have learned that. When I was first starting out as a pro, a mentor/colleague passed along a quote to me that went something like, "If you don't value your own photography and charge accordingly, then you're basically telling the world your photography isn't worth anything." (And he went on to say that that would mean there'd be no hope of making a career at this if that was the case). I've always charged high and fair stock prices that reflect the value of my photography, so I hope you'll do the same with future assignments and gigs. Good luck!

There are still pros using this forum. Perhaps, being the Pros they are, they just choose not to get involved in the rantings of rude people...