Hi,
First post. I'm really enjoying this forum and learning so much. Thanks to all for sharing your knowledge and experiences.

After using a Canon ELPH for the last several years, I recently ordered my first DSLR-- a Canon Xsi/450D with the 18-55 IS kit lens plus a 55-250 IS lens, along with an 8GB SDHC memory card. In addition to that, what would you recommend I get right off the bat?

Should I go ahead and get UV and circular polorizer filters as protection and image enhancement? If so, what size? Will HOYA multi-coated be OK or overkill for a beginner?

I'm sure I'll eventually want some kind of bag to carry my gear in, but that's so personalized I figured it'd be clear what my needs are after owning the camera for a while. My heart is already set on eventually picking up the nifty-fifty prime lens and one of the Speedlites, but I want to spend some time becoming proficient with what I've already ordered first; not to mention that I cannot afford everything I want yet.

Is there anything else you'd recommend I consider getting early on?

Right now, I expect my uses to vary, since I am new to this and haven't established my special interest. I will take pictures indoors of family, outdoors at social events/concerts, my son's sports, and landscapes/wildlife.

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Nothing You should have lots of fun with your purchase for at least a little while. Then down the road, you are right with thinking about the 50mm f/1.8 and perhaps a flash. An alternative to the 50mm f/1.8 is the 35mm /2 or sigma 30 f/1.4 for indoor family pictures.

But really, any recommendation you get right now will be a moot point for in the future you may realize your shooting needs change.

Cassidamius wrote:
Hi,
First post. I'm really enjoying this forum and learning so much. Thanks to all for sharing your knowledge and experiences.
Welcome

Cassidamius wrote:
After using a Canon ELPH for the last several years, I recently ordered my first DSLR-- a Canon Xsi/450D with the 18-55 IS kit lens plus a 55-250 IS lens, along with an 8GB SDHC memory card. In addition to that, what would you recommend I get right off the bat?

The book, Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson

Cassidamius wrote:
Should I go ahead and get UV and circular polorizer filters as protection and image enhancement? If so, what size? Will HOYA multi-coated be OK or overkill for a beginner?

Maybe a polarizer if you plan to shoot a lot of landscapes, but it's not really critical at this point. Learning to use the camera right first will do more for you than any filter.

Cassidamius wrote:
Is there anything else you'd recommend I consider getting early on?
nope
EDIT: Reread your post right after sending my reply. I guess if you are planning to shoot family indoors you might want to consider getting the cheap but very capable 50mm f1.8. You will need something faster than the kit lenses unless you want to use the popup flash for every shot (NOT recommended)

Good choice on the xsi. And both those lenses will probably see you well into you imaging. Now I wouldn't say you need anything for a while although the circle polar would always be a good addition. As for a uv well that's a big debate on here but I'm in the not needed camp as other than protection they don't do much. The only other kit based thing I could suggest would be hoods for both those lenses ( cheap eBay knock offs will be ok).
But the main item I would get would be really boring and say make sure your pc/mac is upto scratch and get some good software. Dpp is good but something like PS elements won't brake the bank and has most of what the full version of photoshop has.

I'm with Norwin. You first have to feel that your gear is – in any way – inadequate. A basic photography course is very recommended.

Welcome to FM.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.

Welcome ! You could start off by nvesting in a 50 1.8 lens AND by reading
the Canon Learning Center:

http://www.usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetProductAct&productID=190

A 50mm 1.8 is a must. It's the sharpest lens for the money.
a CPL will be necessary for it if you do any outdoor shooting with plenty of sky and/or water.

Hi,

I am sure you will be very happy with your setup. I essentially echo what others have already said, that your gear is going to provide excellent photography capabilities for starting out, and beyond. The only things I would add are:

1) A good quality case, backpack, beltpack, whatever style you prefer that will allow you to carry your gear with you safely and easily. I have had excellent personal experiences with both LoewPro and Tamrac, but there are of course other good brands. Try to make sure all of your essential stuff will fit, and can be accessed without too much hassle or danger of it getting dropped in the process. Bottom line, if you don't have your gear with you, you won't be taking any pictures with it.

2) I personally think if you do any outdoor shooting, you will want a circular polarizer. You might just get one for the normal range zoom first. Lots of debate over what brands and how much to spend (very controversial topic...) I like to get a good quality one, and then I never worry about image degradation. But you will have MANY opinions on this...

3) If you aspire to do any sort of landscape type shooting, you will want a tripod. Additionally, even for other shooting a tripod has advantages. One of the big advantages is that it forces you to take more time thinking about your shot. That is almost always a good thing, no matter what your subject might be. A cheap tripod though is kinda like a cheap guitar - it will drive you away from using it. So be ready to spend more on this than you think you should have to. It will be money well spent in the long run.

Welcome to the forum, and have fun!

ML

bpark42 wrote:
Cassidamius wrote:
Hi,
First post. I'm really enjoying this forum and learning so much. Thanks to all for sharing your knowledge and experiences.
Welcome

Cassidamius wrote:
After using a Canon ELPH for the last several years, I recently ordered my first DSLR-- a Canon Xsi/450D with the 18-55 IS kit lens plus a 55-250 IS lens, along with an 8GB SDHC memory card. In addition to that, what would you recommend I get right off the bat?

The book, Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson

Cassidamius wrote:
Should I go ahead and get UV and circular polorizer filters as protection and image enhancement? If so, what size? Will HOYA multi-coated be OK or overkill for a beginner?

Maybe a polarizer if you plan to shoot a lot of landscapes, but it's not really critical at this point. Learning to use the camera right first will do more for you than any filter.


Exactly what I was thinking.

Cassidamius wrote:
Is there anything else you'd recommend I consider getting early on?

Yes. Experience. Get a lot of it.

Get out there and shoot. Don't becoming one of those people who take three shots with a lens/camera then start complaining about it.

Enjoy your gear. Use it as much as you can in as many situations as you can. If you hit a technical wall, read your manual. Then re-read the manual. Then try again.

Once you start finding certain aspects of your gear limiting you, then I would recommend looking for more "things" to acquire.

The XSi is a fine little camera, and the 18-55 lens is very capable. I cannot comment on the 55-250 as I have never used it, but I have heard many good things.

Welcome to FM.

The amazing 50/1.8. You'll LOVE to play with low-light capabilities.
A cheap flash, tiltable if possible. 270EX comes to mind.
A good case, like the Lowepro ones. I have 2 Nova 3, I recommend it. Maybe a Nova 4 to accomodate it all.
A spare battery. You don't want to lose a moment because of it.
A spare card. Cards sometimes break. Buy a 2- or 4-gig.

You may want to hit the library for your book requirements... the understanding exposure book is a great base (my library has it, look in the 770s). Peterson also has a composition book that's good.

Give yourself a photo project to encourage yourself to get out and shoot. Something daily. Ideas include taking the same picture every day at different times, a different angle on the same building or person daily, or focus on a theme (color one week, shapes one week, lines one week). Check out the weekly assignment forum here for assignments as well as ideas from all the submissions and maybe try to replicate a few shots a week.

The nice thing about digital is you don't have to take notes to remember what you had your camera set at - it's in the EXIF. You DO have to LOOK at the exif and then figure out what worked or didn't work. Building experience is a long process...

And, you'll need to figure out how you're going to store, edit & print your photos. Photoshop elements is fine for under $100, Lightroom is excellent (and easy to use) for around 250-300 and of course, photoshop CS4 will break you like a twig, but it's the ultimate solution. You can download demos from Adobe. If you have a MAC, somebody else can advise you.

Also, figure it out and then shoot RAW, it's a good habit for digital.
And when you're starting off, use manual exposure. it sounds counter intuitive, but if you just leave your camera in green box mode, you won't be able to see how different shutter speed and aperture combinations affect your image.

Oh, and buy used. The B+S forum here has good stuff, no reason to pay full price if you don't have to.

bpark42 wrote:


The book, Understanding Exposure by Bryan Peterson




Waaay over rated and over hyped, IMO. A much better choice would be Perfect Exposure by Michael Freeman...

Welcome to FM, Cassidamius! We're glad you're here. Lots of good advice in the previous posts, especially the suggested books. I would also suggest a book on art or photographic composition.

I would only add the following suggestion:

Don't sign in to FM again until you've taken 2000 photos. Then come back in and share your work and what you've learned. It is all too tempting to waste time on the forums, growing dissatisfied with your equipment, rather than spending that time productively by shooting pictures and learning firsthand.

Again, welcome, and good luck!

--Mike

mgipe wrote:
Don't sign in to FM again until you've taken 2000 photos.

If you work it right, that'll be Monday.

TrojanHorse wrote:
mgipe wrote:
Don't sign in to FM again until you've taken 2000 photos. :)

If you work it right, that'll be Monday. :D

Fell of my chair, hahaha. So TRUE!!!!

My $0,02 in roughly this order......
Quality tripod
Software - Lightroom (need this ASAP)
A good quality bag.
Book - Light Science and Magic
Reflector - 5 in one
Flash(es) - 580EXII
Lenses - The best you can afford. 24 - 70 2.8L, then long or short

Filters - ND (Cokin kit with a few would be better) + B+W uv, HOYA if you must get cheapies.

All depends on how/where you gravitate with your photography...

Cheers Gaz

I would buy a cheapish tripod. Having a means of securing the camera opens up a lot of opportunities and (if you want) can make you work more deliberately.

Also I'd consider the 50 1.8 lens, it is so much faster than the kit lens and works wonderfully as a portrait lens and is so cheap.

Other than that, read as much as you can and just go shooting, the Xsi/450D is a spectacularly good camera

David

I would get the hoods for the lenses and I would get a battery grip to give a bigger feel longer battery life and both landscape/portrait shutter release.
Mike

Shooting is more important than anything else right now. Read the manual, go shoot, be sure to re-read the manual in a few months.

Stuff to buy:

1) Copy-cat lens hoods from e-bay. This is to protect your lenses, since good UV filters that resist adding reflections are somewhat expensive. These protect your lens, and never add reflections.

2) A tripod. You will make the same mistake everyone does and buy too cheap of a tripod to begin with. Don't sweat it. Embrace the foolhardy experience, and forge a bond with your fellow photographers. We all survived the error. A crap tripod is far more stable than no tripod, plus you get to be in the picture sometimes as well.

3) Once you have pictures, it is nice to be able to modify them as a part of the creative process. The camera comes with some software that can be used for tweaking pictures, but there are other, more useful choices in the market. Even Photoshop Elements has a lot of power for general use.

4) A flash that supports both swivel and bounce. There are now other brands that work with the ETTL-II system of your camera, for a lot less than Canon's 430ex-II, which is the minimum Canon flash that meets the above requirements. The swivel and bounce are used for indoor shots for diffuse lighting bounced off a wall and/or ceiling. For outdoor fill flash, no swivel is necessary (and, in fact, the built in flash works pretty well for this.)

5) Finally... now you can purchase the 50 f/1.8, which is considered to be the main gateway drug for prime lens shooting. It's a great focal length for portrait use on the 1.6 crop cameras, and can obtain the shallow depth of field that makes them attractive. It also gives you a taste of low-light flash-free photography, which is fun in itself.

After thinking this through during my Saturday morning run, here's where I currently am in the decision process:

1. Camera bag (Kata 3N1-20)-- It'll allow me to safely bring my camera along to give me more opportunities to use it. It gives me a little more than I currently need, plus is capable of carrying small tripods.

2. Polarizer (multi-coated) / Lens hoods-- I like the effects they have on outdoor shots. I plan to do most of my shooting outdoors, since my son is away half the week and I expect my girlfriend to get tired of her papparazzi boyfriend in a matter of days (I don't do anything half-way). Of course, you guys have talked me into the benefits of lens hoods vs. UV filters for protection.

3. Possibly sell the 18-55 IS kit lens brand-new, pick up the nifty-fifty (50mm f/1.8) and save for a nicer wide-angle like a Tamaron 17-50mm f/2.8. I expect to receive a lot of feedback on this decision and welcome it.

4. Tripod-- This has been suggested by many as the first thing to get. I already have a small tripod I use for my P&S that will get me by for a while. It is a POS, Dark Slider, so I guess my next one has to be a good one. No idea what that may be at this point and whether a monopod is more appropriate for my needs or not yet.

I'm still wide-open to your suggestions and appreciate all I've received so far. Please excuse me for analyzing this to death. I'm naturally a gearhead and enjoy figuring out my gear as much as using it. It's like that for all my hobbies, whether it is biking, running, guitar, whatever. Gear research/analysis is a hobby in itself for me. I love it!

1. For carrying a lot of gear in a bag, I'd choose a proper backpack instead. Single shoulder support like that has got to be hard on your shoulder mate.

2. polarizer is a good thing to have. Maybe graduated ND filter as well.

3. You won't regret getting the Tamron. It's very sharp wide open.

4. While I won't suggest getting a super expensive tripod, do spend a decent amount of money on it.

5. How about flash bracket and off camera cord for the complete paparazzi experience?

6. Battery grip if you find the camera a bit too small for your hand. I know it is and I don't even have a particularly big hand. Oh and the E-1 hand strap.

Look at a local library or bookstore for what kind of photography book suits you best. Older books tend to have less fluff (look at anything by John Hedgecoe for examples of what I consider fluff).
Get a cheap tripod - a Quantaray will do. They don't pan smoothly and aren't rock solid if you tap the tripod leg, but they open up a huge vista of photo opportunities for very little money.
Pair the tripod with a cable release. The Canon RS-60E3 is cheap and lets you lock the shutter open for long exposures. Again, this presents an incremental advance in what you can do.
Get a polarizing filter (circular) for your lenses. I'd recommend against a UV filter - they degrade image quality and your lenses don't need as much protection as salespeople would have you believe.
Go browse http://www.dpreview.com/challenges/ Some of the pictures here are stunning and looking through the galleries gives you plenty of ideas for what to shoot.
As for a bag - pick that out in person if possible. One shooter's dream bag is another's nightmare. There are lots of good bag manufacturers out there but for starters I'd recommend something by Lowepro or Tamrac. Other bag manufacturers are harder to find in common stores. Please do not go look at a bag in store and then buy it online though - it's really discourteous.

vpk24_astro wrote:
Please do not go look at a bag in store and then buy it online though - it's really discourteous.

You've never accompanied a woman shop? The store where they found something they like doesn't necessarily means the store where they buy it from.

Besides, most of us live in the real world here. I'm not gonna care about their feelings when I can save almost 50% of the price. Australian shop price for a Kata bag US$127, Online price US$65. Which one would you buy from if you're faced with that choice?

About the tripod, the cheap ones aren't very precise and really aren't stable at all. I got a Velbon cheap tripod with a 3way pan tilt head, when I thought I got the camera in position and lock it down, it flexed.

Oh about the cable release, you can also use a wireless remote shutter for the XSi. With the RC1, you can choose instant shutter trigger or 2 second delay with MLU. It's great for family photos coz you won't have to be left out.

You can do BULB exposure too, just press once to expose, go inside have a cuppa, come back out and press again to close the shutter.

n0b0 wrote:
vpk24_astro wrote:
Please do not go look at a bag in store and then buy it online though - it's really discourteous.

You've never accompanied a woman shop? The store where they found something they like doesn't necessarily means the store where they buy it from.

Besides, most of us live in the real world here. I'm not gonna care about their feelings when I can save almost 50% of the price. Australian shop price for a Kata bag US$127, Online price US$65. Which one would you buy from if you're faced with that choice?

About the tripod, the cheap ones aren't very precise and really aren't stable at all. I got a Velbon cheap tripod with a 3way pan tilt head, when I thought I got the camera in position and lock it down, it flexed.

Oh about the cable release, you can also use a wireless remote shutter for the XSi. With the RC1, you can choose instant shutter trigger or 2 second delay with MLU. It's great for family photos coz you won't have to be left out.

You can do BULB exposure too, just press once to expose, go inside have a cuppa, come back out and press again to close the shutter.

I just think it's unfair to punish brick and mortar stores for having fixed costs that online retailers don't. If you're planning on buying online, just don't go into the store is my policy.
As far as tripods go, I'm just suggesting that he buys a cheap tripod first before plunking a lot of money on something expensive. A < 100 dollar tripod is never a total write off should he choose to buy something more expensive - worst comes to worst it sits in the back of his closet in case something happens to the good one. Besides he may never get into photography enough to require a really nice tripod - only time will tell.
The only drawback to the RC-1 is it doesn't work really well out of line of sight. I think both are good accessories with slightly different uses.

Cassidamius wrote:
3. Possibly sell the 18-55 IS kit lens brand-new, pick up the nifty-fifty (50mm f/1.8) and save for a nicer wide-angle like a Tamaron 17-50mm f/2.8. I expect to receive a lot of feedback on this decision and welcome it.

Both have distinctive pros and cons. I suggest reading about that.

At your current state I'm not sure how much you'll benefit from this move.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.

Yakim Peled wrote:
Cassidamius wrote:
3. Possibly sell the 18-55 IS kit lens brand-new, pick up the nifty-fifty (50mm f/1.8) and save for a nicer wide-angle like a Tamaron 17-50mm f/2.8. I expect to receive a lot of feedback on this decision and welcome it.

Both have distinctive pros and cons. I suggest reading about that.

At your current state I'm not sure how much you'll benefit from this move.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.



I agree with Yakim.
The 18-55 IS and 50/1.8 complement each other much better than a 17-50/2.8 and 50/1.8.
Remember, the 18-55 is f/3.5 at the wide end, not even a full stop slover than 2.8.