GeneO wrote: had two sides of the lens box against the shipping box hed in place by a bubble.. Is that Canon QA or shipping?

And if it IS shipping, was it from the factory to the distributor or there to the retailer or from the retailer to you?

Henry Posner
B&H Photo-Video

globalkiwi wrote:
... But I personally prefer the more minimalist airbag approach to endless mounds of polystyrene.

I don't like either, those "airbags" are easy to pop and I don't like messy foam peanuts that stick anywhere there's a slightest hint of static electricity.

A couple of layers of bubble wraps is fine for most items IMO.

Mind you sometimes the sender is charged by the cubic weight, ie. the size, instead of the actual weight so I can understand why some opted to keep the package small.

I have noticed there's a new variety of bubble wrap - slightly adhesive with really big bubbles. I think that's probably the best option for smaller items.

n0b0 wrote:
globalkiwi wrote:
... But I personally prefer the more minimalist airbag approach to endless mounds of polystyrene.

I don't like either, those "airbags" are easy to pop and I don't like messy foam peanuts that stick anywhere there's a slightest hint of static electricity.

A couple of layers of bubble wraps is fine for most items IMO.

I like the bubble wrap or a few layers of packing paper. I always reuse both so there is very little wast for me.

I actually prefer the smaller bubbles. With big bubbles, much like those "airbags", if one pops, you lose a lot of padding.

I prefer the large bubble wrap, because my wife likes to pop them. They make her happy, and when she's happy, she lets me buy more stuff

Rob Whiting wrote:
I prefer the large bubble wrap, because my wife likes to pop them. They make her happy, and when she's happy, she lets me buy more stuff

as extra you also get some New York canned air

Rob Whiting wrote:
I prefer the large bubble wrap, because my wife likes to pop them. They make her happy, and when she's happy, she lets me buy more stuff

That pretty much ends the argument. You win. Hey, Henry, change your shipping pack methods accordingly, and pronto.

ward1066 wrote:
was the camera damaged? if it was just the box i wouldnt sweat it.

Ditto.

Similar problems here... Just got a 35L from B&H two days ago that had the bubble packaging on one side and the other flush against the shipping box. The lens seems fine, but I was worried after opening and I've never had this experience with B&H over the last four or five years of buying from them occassionally. Hopefully they get the message and make some changes in their shiproom practices.

Recently I have ordered from Allen's and they have good packing. Also, their prices seem to be a little less than B&H,

I find that lately B&H packaging has been worse than what I have experienced with them earlier - and definitely nowhere in the same league as it was in the 90s, when even UPS didn't manage to do anything to the package. Right now it's about to the same level as Amazon, which sometimes feels like no packaging

Despite all this, I had only one experience where the actual goods got banged up - and there only the actual box, not the contents of the box. I am not that concerned about the looks of the box so since the goodies checked out I wasn't really concerned.

The only curious thing for me: if I were to send a package like this, even insured, and if it got banged up, FedEx or UPS would tell me to get lost because it wasn't adequately packaged. So it has to work the other way around too - if UPS beats up a B&H shipment to a point where the actual ware suffers, does B&H get to eat the cost or is their insurance somehow "better"?

Another vote for Allens. Saved $300 over B&H on my 800.

reko wrote:
Another vote for Allens. Saved $300 over B&H on my 800.

Hmm. When I go to the web site they have 17 Canon lenses listed, none of them is the 800...

henryp wrote:
GeneO wrote: had two sides of the lens box against the shipping box hed in place by a bubble.. Is that Canon QA or shipping?

And if it IS shipping, was it from the factory to the distributor or there to the retailer or from the retailer to you?

Henry Posner
B&H Photo-Video

Considering the fact that the item came poorly packed from B&H one would need to assume that it was B&H's fault. Pack the item well enough where there can't be any blame put on B&H and no one will blame them--pack it poorly expect to hear something. It's like saying "oh, well they do it too...why can't we?". It makes no sense.

Based on personal experience, I hardly ever order imaging equipment from B&H but I do order from other retailers (abes of maine, beach/buydig) and have had poorly packed boxes arrive at my doorstep...sometimes with only one air packet inside, and once it was popped so there was absolutely no padding what so ever besides the lens box and styrofoam encasement. Next time I order they will hear from me.

to the OP of this topic...........how is the new 5DMKII working so far?

I buy a lot of stuff from B&H and while I have not had any shipment damage due to packing, the packing always seems to be poorly done. I hate to have to say this but it is if fact true. To be entirely honest however, all of the major on-line companies have shipped similarly ill packed camera gear. I wish B&H would look at this issue from the customers point of view. A bit more care and material put into the packing would go far in enhancing their image as the premier on-line supplier of imaging hardware. Heck, even an option for white glove packing, at a small upcharge, would be a step in the right direction. Honestly though, I have had similar shiping and packing experience with J&R, Adorama, OneCall, 17th Street, Abes, and Calumet. Curiously when I order directly from a manufacturer like Really Right Stuff, Wimberely or any of the other well known companies, the items come very well packed. Henry P should also know that when I have asked the telephone reps to ask for extra packing, those requests have gone entirely ignored. fortunately no damage but it does subtract from overall satisfaction with the transaction. Come on guys, throw some peanuts in the box.

It seems complains about packaging can make a difference. Newegg has had a lot of complaints posted in reviews from people who ordered OEM hard drives that arrive with minimal packging and (surprise) are DoA.

So it was with some trepidation that I ordered an OEM drive from them this week. It arrived today, wrapped four times in taped bubble wrap and then placed in a box full to overflowing with peanuts. Now that's overkill

Just as a point of interest, my business ships ships and receives about 60-90 lenses and cameras a day. We have spent more time and effort on determining the best way to pack than any other aspect - more than marketing, purchasing, you name it. Packing and packaging supplies are one of he largest expenses we have. Figuring out how to do it best is more complex than I could have dreamed: what has the least impact on the environment, what are the supply costs versus the manpower costs to pack different ways, the costs of storing the supplies (bubble wrap and peanuts take up an incredible amount of space), and the change in damage rate with different kinds of packaging.

We're lucky in that our products come back so we can use and reuse temperfoam padding (which would be way too expensive for one way shipping). Before we settled on that we changed packing methods 3 or 4 times figuring out what was the best. I'll echo what Henry said earlier: nothing beats the box and packaging the manufacturer makes specifically for each lens. As long as you put that in something stiff enough to keep the manufacturer's box from getting crushed the item inside is perfectly protected. If those held up for repeated shippings, we'd keep on using them forever, but they don't.

I received a Gitzo 3541LS from B&H yesterday. Instead of being underpackaged, it was filled with airbags surrounding the Gitzo box. It was filled so that the outer box bulged outwards. The airbags caused the Gitzo box to be pushed in on the sides of the box and the top lid opend and deformed. The Gitzo made it here fine in its cloth bag. I've noticed that Gitzo does a poor job of packaging their legs. This is the 3rd set of Gitzo legs I've purchased. In each case, the legs are only wrapped up in the cloth dust bag and then placed in the Gitzo box. I seriously doubt a Gitzo box would make it through shipping without additional help from additional external packaging help. Fortunately, I'm not a manufacturer box collector.

Jim

Lately it seems that they tape the box closed, but the majority of the tape doesn't actually contact the box. I burnish all the tape so it makes good contact.

E

I have not been a large fan of b&h over the last few years but did just order a couple of things from them and they shipped fast, well packed and damage free.

They seem to pack as good or better then most

henryp wrote:
GeneO wrote: had two sides of the lens box against the shipping box hed in place by a bubble.. Is that Canon QA or shipping?

And if it IS shipping, was it from the factory to the distributor or there to the retailer or from the retailer to you?

Henry Posner
B&H Photo-Video

It is a moot point if the last leg is packed poorly. You will get blamed.

Gene

henryp wrote:


Peter Le wrote:
I`m still dealing with crushed corners on very expensive Epson paper that was very poorly packed by B+H. Never will buy paper from them again. Every time I try to smooth a corner before printing I curse B+H. Do they realize what the crackheads in shipping are doing to their rep

Peter, I appreciate your situation but please do not refer to my colleagues, who are human beings, as "crackheads." It's denigrating and certainly not necessary. I checked every order I could find from you over the past 2 years and see several with Epson paper. What I don't see is any indication you contacted customer service to let us know about this. We'd certainly have replaced any damaged boxes you received.

Henry......It was 2 boxes of Epson Velvet Fine art paper and 1 box of Ultra Smooth paper. The Ultra Smooth was fine....only because of Epsons packaging of this paper. I needed it for a show....didn`t have time to be shipping back and forth. Some of it still sits on the shelf because it is a real pain to work with. Each sheet has to be worked on to flatten the crushed corners and still hits the print head on most sheets causing ink bloches. Luckily it was just the corner on would be under the mat.
I don`t think I was far off on the description of the packer ( I guess I could have chose better words).....if you would have seen how this was packed you would agree. You just had to pick up the box and hear everything inside sliding back and forth. It had actually cut through the outer box in one spot. I do like the speed of your service and shipping.....but I would gladly wait an extra day to get better packing. I am glad as I`m sure all FMers are that you address these problems posted on this forum. I am not a retailer or manufacturer basher....you can see this in my postes..........My reasoning here like others.....is to weed out the packers that are giving you a bad name.......Peter
Henry Posner
B&H Photo-Video

For peace of mind, whenever I order an expensive piece of equipment from B&H (or anyone for that matter) I use next day or second day delivery. I do this even when UPS ground is offered free. It makes no sense to me to have an expensive camera or lens kicked around by UPS for an extra day or two or three. I know to many the additional shipping costs seem like a waste of money but IMHO the few extra dollars spent on fast shipping are well worth it. Since B&H was mentioned specifically, I would like to say that having dealt with them for over 25 years and spending lots and lots of money with them, all for shipped merchandise, I have never ever received merchandise that was damaged in shipment. This does go to to support what Henry P has said elsewhere above on this topic. I expect that in the not to distant future, the carriers themselves will become more sophisticated and packaging will become more scientific and engineered like the OEM package. Until then I'll pay for next day air and keep my fingers crossed.
Cheers