Mustang Air to Air: The Sequel
/forum/topic/600984/3583

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Lotuselite
Registered: Feb 14, 2003
Total Posts: 198
Country: Canada

I feel that in the last image the model's head is lost in the window.
Agree with Mark about the miniatures, that is how you get your drinks in coach class.
First Class drinks come in the glass and wine is poured from the bottle so you can see the label.
Or at least it used to be that way.



JWilsonphoto
Registered: Jan 16, 2002
Total Posts: 15463
Country: United States

Mark's suggestions are worth considering for sure, good eye. When you begin adding people to the compositions, lots of additional factors are introduced. I find that it is very easy to become rushed and distracted by the fact that people are waiting/staring at you waiting for direction, etc. I have to remind myself that I'm in charge of the outcome, the subjects are there for me (the end client actually), and that it takes whatever time it takes to notice all the details and deal with them. Some of this is determined by budget and the desires of the end client.

This is where the photographer has to determine what the client expects, what his personal talent and vision lead him to see as the finished product, and what the budget will stand. Each of Glenn's compositions could, in ideal circumstances take several hours to compose, style, coordinate fashion, light and capture. If that gels with the client's desires, you're golden, but many times they want the best you can come up with in a couple of hours, for five hundred bucks +-, and you have to tell them it won't be a Robb Report ad, because you can't get an Aston for the price of a Camry. And sometimes a nice solid Camry is what they are looking for.

One thing I've learned over the years, you can't second guess the results of a photo shoot, unless you were standing there through the whole process, because you can't begin to know the constraints they boxed the photographer into. Rarely does one have all the time and all the budget required to produce impeccable images, it's always a dance filled with limitations and compromises.



stevezzzz
Registered: Aug 01, 2010
Total Posts: 2980
Country: United States

MMcGrath wrote:
Glenn,

Some ideas of how I would approach this.

I would ditch the miniature bourbon bottles. If your going to have whiskey, have it in a Scotch glass with some ice in it.

Get a proper sized champagne bottle, some long stem flute glasses and rotate the bottle so that the labels aren't visible.

Get the guy to wear different clothes - in the 1st shot he looks like a driver picking up a client, and then in the second wearing the same gear he looks like a business man. The colours of his suit blend into the interior. Might be better to get one of the company's pilots to stand in for the 1st shot with the white shirt, shades and 4 stripes on the shoulder.

Try to do some wider shots showing the whole car and aircraft.

Look for the small details - they are usually the ones that catch you out. For instance the mat at the bottom of the stairs has some creases in it.

Where is the baggage door on the Beech? Having the luggage where it is waiting for the model with the car boot lid open on the opposite side seems wrong. Surely they would put the luggage straight into the boot?

Hopefully this is constructive and not nit picking.

Mark





First, Glenn, it's a very nice concept with a lot of moving parts; you did a terrific job in an unfamiliar situation. I don't think Mark is nit-picking at all, and I hope you don't think so, either. To add to Mark's notes (I'm only going to address the first image here):

- The red carpet is too far from the bottom of the air stair for the female model to step down on easily. The viewer will unconsciously feel uncomfortable for her and won't know why.

- You don't need as much of the car in the frame in order to make your point, and it would allow you to move the luggage to the pavement between the air stair and the car. Besides, the luggage and the car are just props, and they're blocking my view of the gorgeous King Air. The set dressing shouldn't distract from the airframe and the models.

- Pose the pilot with his left hand helping the passenger step down: it looks awkward having him reach across his body and will do less of a number on the drape of his suit. If the clipboard he's holding is intended to help establish his identity as a pilot, make it easier to 'read' in the shot.

- "Henriksen Jet Center" is presumably paying for this shoot, so you'll want to feature their logo in a way that doesn't crowd it so much at the top of the frame and maybe is spaced a little more from the top of the fuselage. Reframe the shot so there's less wasted space at the bottom. Maybe back off a few steps and use a little more reach to tighten the framing and space the logo a bit away from the fuselage.

- Consider a color change for the hangar in Photoshop so it's a little darker and more easily distinguished from the airframe.

- The tailplane and the FBO porch roof are distracting. A pilot can 'read' the tailplane, but it's just a puzzle to solve for the average viewer and occupies a corner of the frame that should be less busy.

Too much? It's easy for me to sit here and critique your work: when you're in the heat of a shoot it's all too easy to overlook some of these little details. It's all a learning experience, right?



stevezzzz
Registered: Aug 01, 2010
Total Posts: 2980
Country: United States

FlyingPhotog wrote:
I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It...



Too funny, Jay. He used up all the travel on that shock strut, didn't he?



msalvetti
Registered: Dec 20, 2003
Total Posts: 2745
Country: United States

stevez wrote:

- The red carpet is too far from the bottom of the air stair for the female model to step down on easily. The viewer will unconsciously feel uncomfortable for her and won't know why.



Wow, I was uncomfortable about this, and I didn't know why. Great description.

Glenn, I wouldn't know where to begin on a shoot like this, except to run from it as fast as I could. Heck, I was extremely uncomfortable trying to get a bunch of high school kids organized for that team photo, and I know all of them. Those points Jim made about feeling rushed and distracted trying to get it all organized, yikes. It would keep me awake at night, not for me.

So I think these are great, and kudos to you for taking this on and growing your skills in this direction. I'm sure in no time you'll be banging these out like your recent A2A shoots - it's obvious to me that you are that talented, and you are capable at excelling at anything you put your mind to.

Mark



Leftcoast_Mike
Registered: Feb 27, 2013
Total Posts: 36
Country: Canada

Hey Mike - great to see you posting here. This man has scary good skills

Wrei wrote:



Serious/Scary skills indeed!

(This worked out great, I finally have a great photo posted for my TOPP! Thanks Mike!)



Hey Jeff! Thank you both for the kind words, I'm in awe of the skills displayed in this thread!


FlyingPhotog wrote:
I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It...



Great capture! That is one crushed oleo!



astrobrian
Registered: Sep 27, 2012
Total Posts: 814
Country: United States

All great shots Glenn! Agreed on the logos likely needing a release to use. The 3rd image on those strikes me with "what do I do now?" look to it if that makes sense. The first one is perfection. Keep rockin it



astrobrian
Registered: Sep 27, 2012
Total Posts: 814
Country: United States

Say hello Mr. Gator.



FlyingPhotog
Registered: May 09, 2008
Total Posts: 4220
Country: United States

Last Chance
Photographers lined up at NAF El Centro as part of a multi-group photocall catch the last takeoff of the evening before climbing back on the buses.



Razor17
Registered: Oct 08, 2012
Total Posts: 259
Country: United States

JWilsonphoto wrote:
How many of Y'all are thinking about the ISAP symposium in Seattle in mid-May? We're finalizing the program and will be posting the itinerary, including field trip schedules, in the very near future. I'm not beating the drum for it, just wondered how many of us will be attending so I have a handle on what else we might be able to pull off while we're there. These events are very challenging to plan, and this year's has been especially so, but we think you'll be entertained and educated, as well as just have a good time. No pressure, just let me know if you think you'll be going. We're waiting for confirmation from a couple of very key presenters or you'd already have the roster and schedule. There will be some very interesting announcements in Seattle, that I think you'll approve of as well. We've collectively spent hundreds of hours over the last twelve months doing our best to craft an organization that our members can be proud of. Obviously, we haven't pleased everyone, but we have over a hundred new members, a website you can be proud of to showcase your work, ISnAP has developed into a full fledged magazine with an exploding readership, and we're financially sound. I'm not going to let the cat out of the bag re: all we've been working on for the past year, but I think you will be pleased.



I was in Seattle last week for NWOC and stayed at the Hilton downtown which I advise not to stay at. Its old and needs a lot of work. The Sheraton Dowtown would be my choice if you all are staying downtown. Even the Red Lion on 5th looked better...

Lynn



Jeff W.
Registered: Feb 09, 2008
Total Posts: 1735
Country: United States

POSER
Trying real hard to be a Super Hornet carrying some serious ordinance



Leftcoast_Mike
Registered: Feb 27, 2013
Total Posts: 36
Country: Canada

Jeff W. wrote:

Trying real hard to be a Super Hornet carrying some serious ordinance


anything hurts when dropped on your head from a reasonable height



I just had this one framed up for NWCAS. First time I've really put myself out there like this but was thrilled to be asked.



MustangsX2
Registered: Nov 23, 2007
Total Posts: 108
Country: United States

FlyingPhotog wrote:
I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It .. I Got It...


Give that guy some tail-dragger time. It's easy to forget how to land when there's a wheel under the nose.



JWilsonphoto
Registered: Jan 16, 2002
Total Posts: 15463
Country: United States

Beautiful Mike!



JWilsonphoto
Registered: Jan 16, 2002
Total Posts: 15463
Country: United States

An addendum to Glenn's shoot, my comments were not meant to diminish his efforts in any way. I'm so proud of him, his incredible talent and his willingness to go out on a limb. Those kinds of assignments are exactly the ones that wake you up in the middle of the night and roll your stomach over. So many variables, and ways the whole deal can go south, even seasoned pros, if they are smart, plan, replay and replay every possible scenario. I have no doubt that Glenn will be orchestrating these and much bigger set ups in the future, but he's a sharp guy, so he'll always worry them into perfection.



Glenn Watson
Registered: Nov 13, 2007
Total Posts: 2732
Country: United States

Thanks so much for the comments and critique - please never hold back on account of hurting my feelings, you wont. Those are all very great points and its funny after reading them they seem sorta obvious. but trust me they never entered my mind! I'm terrible at directing models on what to do and how to pose - i find myself standing there waiting to shoot while they're standing there looking at me waiting for to tell them how to be.

But JW's post pretty much summed it up, and add to the fact it was a high noon under a shawdow'y awning with a lighting system i've never used made it pretty tricky. I want to get better at it so I can round out my offering, and everybody's c&c has really helped. thank you.

Setup shot:


Glenn



Glenn Watson
Registered: Nov 13, 2007
Total Posts: 2732
Country: United States

Beats sitting in traffic!



Glenn



Leftcoast_Mike
Registered: Feb 27, 2013
Total Posts: 36
Country: Canada

Glenn Watson wrote:
Beats sitting in traffic!



Glenn


nice!



Leftcoast_Mike
Registered: Feb 27, 2013
Total Posts: 36
Country: Canada

JWilsonphoto wrote:
Beautiful Mike!


thank you, sir!



JWilsonphoto
Registered: Jan 16, 2002
Total Posts: 15463
Country: United States

Re: the run down Hilton, our Hilton is Seattle Airport.....whew!



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