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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
Hartblei 35mm Super Rotator f2.8 ![]() Here is the shot taken by this set up on a very rainy day, at reduced but larger size, f/11 (See Album: http://www.fototime.com/inv/D5D0CC4D6CD5592 image # 2) and the same shot with a Canon 24-70L f2.8 lens at 35mm to demonstrate the added dof of the tilt feature on the Hartblei (See album: http://www.fototime.com/inv/D5D0CC4D6CD5592 image #3) with the Canon lens at f/11 the flowers of the middle orchid are sharp, but the pine needles on the near deck are not. The Movements of the Hartblei Super Rotator design Here are some close ups of the lens tilted 8 degrees downwards and shifted a maximum 10mm so you can easily see the movements. ![]() ![]() The 4 adjustment rings on the lens all are different size and different textures so it is easy to tell them apart by feel when you are looking through the viewfinder. The focus ring is the big one with circular scallops on it near the outside of the lens. In these images the blue numbers are the feet scale, while on the other side of the lens are yellow numbers for the meters scale. The action of focus ring is really nice a smooth and very easy to fine adjust. The focus travel is quite far, but most of it covers a very small range near the closest focusing distance and the useful range from 2 meters to infinity is a very small travel. Overall I very much liked the action of the focus ring. On the second lens photo above you can see the DOF ring printed in yellow and the aperture ring on the inside of it in white. There are slight one stop indents from f2.8 to 22; it is very easy to move this ring by accident while you are messing with the tilt and shift adjustments. Next come two rings with white lettering that say SHIFT is numbered 1-10 mm, and the ring closest to the camera that says TILT numbered in degrees 1-8 with small indents. These two rings obviously control the amount of Shift and Tilt. On mine the shift is quite stiff the last 2 mm of travel from 8 to 10mm, but the scalloped ring gives something to hold on to and twist. You can put screw on handles on to the Tilt and Shift rings to make it easer to turn them. I have put one on the tilt ring as it has no textured surface to grab hold of. You can see this knurled, thin handle near the bottom of the lens on the first shot with the tripod and at the bottom of the middle image. They stick out so much it makes the lens bulky to store so I only use one. Here is the confusing part. See the silver tab on the top of the lens (at the 7 degree mark on the tilt ring) and the black tab between the shift and tilt rings? To change the tilt angle one pushes in the silver tab and freely rotates the entire lens. This disengages a spring loaded tab and allows the entire lens assembly to freely rotate in either direction 360 degrees. There are 18 stop tabs, in other words 20 degrees each. Thus one can move the tilt angle 0, 20, 40, 60, 80, 100, 120, 160, 180, etc. but not 90 degrees. Kind of odd, but usually the tilt axis is not very sensitive, I doubt if one could tell 80 from 100 degrees with the modest 8 degrees tilt max. When you rotate the tilt axis, the shift axis (the front of the lens) will rotate with it. The red dot in front of the silver tab in the last image is the index mark for the tilt, 8 degrees in this image. It is not normally seen as it is covered up by the lens at 0 tilt (the lens is tilted downwards here). Now in the pics you can see the black tab just behind the shift ring, press that and hold it in and you can freely rotate the shift axis either direction 360 degrees (and beyond). There are 16 tabbed stops or every 22.5 degrees. Thus relative to the tilt one can rotate the shift axis 22.5, 45, 67.5, 90, 112.5, 135, 157.5, 180, etc degrees. Now turn the shift knob to dial in the amount of shift you want, 1-10 mm. It only shifts one direction; outwards, or wherever you have aligned outwards to be. If you want to shift the same amount (say 10mm) in both directions, you have to rotate the shift assembly 180 degrees for the next shot. The shift mechanism only shifts one way, so a 180 degree rotation of the shift axis is needed to shift both left and right (or up and down). The shift angle rotation is relative to the tilt axis, while the tilt angle axis is relative to the camera axis in landscape mode. There are red dots to line up the tilt and shift axis relative to the camera. Here is photo of the bottom of the lens showing the tilt rotation stops, and the lens shifted 10mm, and the knurled handle near the tilt locking tab. ![]() Notice how far over the lens is at 10mm shift! What if you really want to set the tilt angle at exactly 90 degrees relative to the camera body in landscape orientation and not 80 or 100? In the image above you can see the EF lens mount ring is attached to the lens with 4 tiny screws. You can undo the 4 screws, and underneath you'll find there's a second set of holes, so you can put the mount back on at 10 degrees rotation to the original position. Thus you can set it up either to get 20 degree tilt detents including exactly horizontal, or get 20 degree detents including exactly vertical, but not both horizontal and vertical at the same time. Why isn't the tilt axis tabbed for 16 stops of 22.5 degrees like the shift? Because the shift and tilt portions of the lens freely rotate with respect to each other and the camera body, there is no electrical connection for aperture like in the Canon TS-E lenses. In fact there is no electrical connection from the lens to the camera at all. With the Hartblei the camera doesn’t even know it has a lens on it, so everything is totally manual. Wires would tether both the tilt and shift rotations as it does in the Canon TS-E, limiting total lens rotation (both axes together) to 180 degrees. Even the EXIF is manual, as I used the voice annotation feature on the 1DmkII after each shot to document what lens, tilt setting, shift setting and f-stop were used. Please read part II of this lens test |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
Shift Performance, 3 shot stitch ![]() I used the outer portions of the left and right images along with most of the center image. This is because the left side (center) of the right shift image is very soft, and vice versa. (See below under vignetting behavior.) No parallax problems at all, and previous stitch examples posted with this lens/method have also shown this to be the case. This stitch image will give you and idea of the field of view on a 1.3X body. Obviously FF will be wider and 1.5-1.6X crop will be narrower. Here is a larger (not full size) version for pixel peepers. (See album http://www.fototime.com/inv/D5D0CC4D6CD5592 image # 7) Adjust image size as desired Image Sharpness: Comparison to Other Lenses My initial test was done at night, with soft incandescent lighting. The scene: ![]() The initial comparison of the Hartblei 35mm Super Rotator, Canon 24L TS-E, and Canon 24-70L f/2.8 @ 35mm. I did a series of shots with similar exposure from f/3.5 to f/16; I show the comparison at f/8 and f/11 because I felt it was most representative of how I would use this lens. I shot the 24L TS-E first then moved the tripod back for the Hartblei 35 and the Canon zoom at 35. I ended up a bit too close for the 35mm lenses and those images are a bit larger as a result. Both Tilt/Shift lenses were manually focused using angle finder C at 2.5x using a split image focusing screen. All the images were post processed very similarly with considerable lightening and some USM. Not great exposures, minimally edited, and I hope a fair, but not exacting comparison. Smaller versions: ![]() ![]() and 100% links of the same comparison: (see album http://www.fototime.com/inv/D5D0CC4D6CD5592 images 9,10) Well, so far the all three lens appear reasonably similar. The next test was the scene off my back deck, shown for the flat stitching example. Here I added a 17-40L f4 at 35mm to the test. Focus was on the bare tree in the center, all of the lenses at f/4 and the two T/S lenses are centered. The 24L TS-E of course has a wider FOV and the trees are smaller. A 100% crop of the center of each of these images: ![]() ; There are some differences in exposure, contrast and cropping, but I tried to keep the processing consistent so the exposures were not exactly comparable. At f/4 the Hartblei is a bit softer than the other 3 Canons, which look more similar to each other. Here is the same scene with the Hartblei when changing the f stop from 4 to 11, again at 100% crops: ![]() ; The Hartblei sharpens up a bit from f/4 to f/8 and is constant after that. Overall it seems to be close to the Canon lenses at f/8 and above in the center of the image. See part 3 |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
Vignetting and Image Circle Considerations |
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Graham Mitchell Registered: Jul 14, 2005 Total Posts: 3697 Country: United Kingdom |
Wow, quite a write-up. Thanks! |
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Bob Bell Registered: Sep 04, 2004 Total Posts: 1304 Country: United States |
Very nice Mike, After seeing the review on the Hartblei 85 I was looking for a 35mm solution and only found the ARAX one which doesnt seem as nice as the Hartblei. |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
Bob Bell wrote: |
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Rainer Registered: May 18, 2004 Total Posts: 505 Country: United States |
Thanks, Mike! This is a very nice review. It would have been interesting to see how well the TS-E 24mm did with the 1.4x extender, providing a focal length very comparable to the Hartblei. I've taken a few shots with that combination on the weekend (I have a rental TS-E 24mm right now) but we'll have to wait for the results until I get the film developed (yep, I'm not digital yet). |
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rico Registered: Jul 13, 2003 Total Posts: 3031 Country: United States |
Mike, thanks for a super write-up. Other than the bulk, this Hartblei looks like a nice general-purpose lens! My tilt/shift rig is limited to 100mm, near-macro range, and the use of a bellows unit. Would love access to a combo of infinity focus, portrait orientation, front fall, and front tilt. |
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john_edwards Registered: Jun 30, 2005 Total Posts: 1602 Country: United States |
Very nice review, thanks for sharing. One thing I noticed on your test and comparing my 24-70 2.8L @ 24mm and my 24TS-E was that the 24-70 is sharper, especially close in. It seemed to me that the 24 TS has more depth of field when at a 2 degree tilt with both lenses focused 50" from sensor plane. Haven't tried using the 24 TS with a 1.4 but thats interesting. John |
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tennclay Registered: Jul 02, 2002 Total Posts: 2106 Country: United States |
It would be interesting to see a comparison of the 2 T/Ss with distant scenery - kinda like your stitched shot. |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
john_edwards wrote: |
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tennclay Registered: Jul 02, 2002 Total Posts: 2106 Country: United States |
Thanks - I guess 4-5 miles is little far ! |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
Mike K wrote: |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
Canon TSE with 1.4x TC ![]() the sharpness is very close, sometime I prefer the Canon/Canon, while sometimes the Hartblei seems to hold a slight edge. Whoa, but look at the color! The Hartblei is very red, the sky looks like sunset while the Canon is an icy blue. I think reality isa bit closer to the Canon, but not that blue. I just checked the Thumbs (these were shot in RAW and boosted during conversion) and they still have the reb/blue trend, but not anywhere near as strong. Thus much of the color difference is the 2/3 EV difference in exposure upon conversion. The Hartblei got a lot redder while the Canon got slightly bluer. However if you go back over all of the comparative shots the red/Hartblei tendency is always there. umm, interesting. Its supposed to rain some more tonight, now I know how Seattle folks feel. Mike K |
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madguy Registered: May 06, 2005 Total Posts: 379 Country: United States |
Mike, this is a great way of making a highres image. Thank you for the report. I'm wondering, would it be possible use both shift and tilt and combine all 9 images (3x3) for final image. My quick guess is one can use one of those tripod that have the center column raised with a crank or maybe shims/washers to vertically move the camera body. |
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Mike K Registered: Mar 01, 2002 Total Posts: 1810 Country: United States |
madguy wrote: |
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AJSJones Registered: Jan 22, 2002 Total Posts: 1417 Country: United States |
Mike |
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Rainer Registered: May 18, 2004 Total Posts: 505 Country: United States |
Mike, thanks for testing the 24 TSE with the 1.4x TC. It looks like it did reasonably well! |