New 24MP Leica M and M-E full-frame rangefinders
/forum/topic/1150033/0

1
       2       end

Fred Miranda
Registered: Dec 31, 2001
Total Posts: 17819
Country: United States

Leica has announced a new Leica M line replacing the M9 rangefinder. The new M will come with the company's first full-frame 24MP CMOS image sensor and ISO range of 200 to 6,400. It also becomes the first M capable of movie shooting - capturing 1080p footage at 25 or 24 FPS and accepts the same plug-in EVF as used by the X2. While it retains the classic M-series "look", the rear now features a 920k dot 3" LCD with Gorilla Glass cover and live view. Availability is scheduled for early 2013 with a retail price of $6,950.

The "stripped-down" Leica M-E model available at the end of the month comes with 18-megapixel full-frame CCD sensor and a 2.5" 230k dot LCD for $5,450.

"In every respect, the new Leica M is the most innovative and versatile model the modern M-System has ever created. Looking to the future, the Leica M is the first in a long line of Leica rangefinder cameras to feature a completely new development in sensor technology; the Leica Max CMOS image sensor. This 24 MP, full 35 mm format sensor was designed and constructed in collaboration with CMOSIS especially for the camera and its use with M- and R-Lenses. This new development successfully transfers the characteristic advantages of CCD sensors, such as natural and brilliant color rendition and impressive reproduction of details, to a CMOS sensor."

For more details, visit Leica's website



VladiD
Registered: Apr 14, 2008
Total Posts: 982
Country: United States

Any ISO 6400 shots public yet? Any idea on AA? Battery lifetime?



LizWangPhotog
Registered: May 24, 2011
Total Posts: 1517
Country: United States

I wonder how the M lenses will adjust from 1.3 crop (vignetting, etc...)...



Mikeality
Registered: Nov 10, 2010
Total Posts: 85
Country: Australia

LizWangPhotog wrote:
I wonder how the M lenses will adjust from 1.3 crop (vignetting, etc...)...


Errr... M9 was already Full Frame...



LizWangPhotog
Registered: May 24, 2011
Total Posts: 1517
Country: United States

Haha, I've only shot M lenses briefly on my Fuji XPro. Never mind...



rwalshphoto
Registered: Jan 26, 2012
Total Posts: 33
Country: United States

I will just never understand the logic behind the Leica elitism and their price strategy. I appreciate the build quality and the glass and everything but the pricing is just ridiculous considering the tech and the alternatives that you could buy for $6950 plus the additional $2-8k+ per lens. Woof



FlyPenFly
Registered: Feb 14, 2011
Total Posts: 6425
Country: United States

Then don't buy it?

It seems like a lot of other pople are buying them quite well.



aleksanderpolo
Registered: Jan 18, 2010
Total Posts: 880
Country: United States

What alternative has rangefinder and LV in the same body?



Dan Grisez
Registered: Feb 12, 2007
Total Posts: 372
Country: United States

The same could be said for Ferrari's elitism. Yet, people still buy their cars even though the job could be done through far less expensive means.



deebo7
Registered: Mar 30, 2006
Total Posts: 1705
Country: United States

i wonder how used M9s will fare now?



edwardkaraa
Registered: Sep 27, 2004
Total Posts: 7479
Country: Thailand

Leica attracts a lot of jealousy from people who cannot afford or cannot justify the expense. It has always been like that. It will always be. Thus is human nature. And I'm not a Leica owner... yet.

http://www.bjp-online.com/british-journal-of-photography/news/2206260/photokina-2012-leica-will-never-release-an-affordable-m-camera-managers-say



Ariel70
Registered: Sep 23, 2010
Total Posts: 97
Country: United States

Oops, so am I jealous, or maybe I just don't understand a lot of marketing "truths"?
Even worse, could be both.
I could easily solve this if I gave them my money.



VladiD
Registered: Apr 14, 2008
Total Posts: 982
Country: United States

Pretty please, not again the whole "Leica is for snobs and is overpriced crap" drivel that every...single...Leica...thread deteriorates to.

We get it, you love your dSLRs, they get the job done.

There are plenty of people who happily submit to the high-priced RF concept that Leica offers.

Don't like it? Don't buy it.



photo.guy
Registered: May 26, 2010
Total Posts: 33
Country: N/A

Maybe this is the wrong place to ask, but with the introduction of the new M and it still using an external EVF, can someone explain why a rangefinder system is preferable? I've never had the opportunity to use one, and it seems like rangefinder is the worst option for cameras today.

Optical viewfinders on an SLR views through the lens, so you can have precise framing, focus, and depth of field, though they require some calibration.

Electronic viewfinders on mirrorless cameras (particularly Sony's OLED) are bright and offer 100% exact framing, show the exposure accurately, can overlay the image with additional information, offer a magnified view for the most accurate focus possible (as it reads off the sensor) and don't black out when taking an image.

Rangefinder doesn't show focus, framing, or depth of field through the lens, exhibits parallax error and can be blocked by bigger lenses. They require extremely precise calibration between the lens and the body - something even Leica struggles to do at the prices they charge.


Is it just the heritage of the company / nostalgia, status, or is there something I am missing?



JonasY
Registered: Aug 25, 2008
Total Posts: 416
Country: Sweden

photo.guy wrote:
Is it just the heritage of the company / nostalgia, status, or is there something I am missing?


As of today, no EVF is even close to a good optical viewfinder. The vf in a Leica M offers a large, bright view, is great for precise focusing and doesn't have any shutter black-out. It's also possible to see what's happening outside the frame.

Ofc as technology advances the optical viewfinder becomes less and less attractive. As someone said, a RF is not necessarily better, but it's different. I'd urge anyone to take the chance to use a RF.

But what Leica does here, and no other manufacturer will ever do, is to combine the amazing OVF with all the advantages of a EVF. That's both unique and awesome, literally eating the cake and having it too.



freaklikeme
Registered: Apr 08, 2005
Total Posts: 5714
Country: United States

rwalshphoto wrote:
I will just never understand the logic behind the Leica elitism and their price strategy. I appreciate the build quality and the glass and everything but the pricing is just ridiculous considering the tech and the alternatives that you could buy for $6950 plus the additional $2-8k+ per lens. Woof


I think a case could be made that you just described the Canon 1DX and the L-lens line-up. And Leica is a tiny little company compared to Canon. They should be proud that they can make anything priced competitively with the big dogs, much less anything as high quality.



carstenw
Registered: Dec 26, 2005
Total Posts: 15694
Country: Germany

JonasY wrote:
As of today, no EVF is even close to a good optical viewfinder.


Certainly in enjoyment. Although I really like the VF-2 for my E-PL3, and really enjoy using it, there is just no comparison, what so ever, to the joy I get from using my D800, or especially Rolleiflex 6008i.



Gary Clennan
Registered: Mar 29, 2007
Total Posts: 5020
Country: Canada

VladiD wrote:
Pretty please, not again the whole "Leica is for snobs and is overpriced crap" drivel that every...single...Leica...thread deteriorates to.

We get it, you love your dSLRs, they get the job done.

There are plenty of people who happily submit to the high-priced RF concept that Leica offers.

Don't like it? Don't buy it.



Exactly. Geez...



Ariel70
Registered: Sep 23, 2010
Total Posts: 97
Country: United States

Let me start by saying that I wish I could afford buying Leica stuff, the IQ is what it is, but is just not for me. Those who can afford it, great, enjoy it, and thanks for sharing your images.

When I saw that new CMOS sensor and the movie shooting capability, my first thought was, wow, I really would like to see a video taken with this thing. I hope they are able to keep with the same IQ with this new sensor.



Jack Balthasar
Registered: Jan 15, 2007
Total Posts: 173
Country: United States

I have an X100. Isn't that a rangefinder with LV, Optical and Electronic Viewfinders? It has an APS-C sensor, so not full frame, but it's pretty reasonably priced.
I get the Leica cost, so I'm not jumping into that argument, but there are alternatives out there.
Just like a Corvette is an alternate to a Ferrari, Leica has competition like the X100. I'm just pointing out the alternatives, as some folks are questioning that.



1
       2       end