snowboarder wrote:
sebboh wrote:
Tariq Gibran wrote:
It's very odd to me that Sony would have ditched the built in EVF for a Flash. I think that will turn out to be a big mistake. An add on EVF is just not going to be as elegant/ compact and I doubt the majority of potential users are going to be happy without any sort of built in finder. Maybe what we are seeing is just one beta/ test version and the final camera will be a bit different.

looking at the view from above it looks like the lcd takes up too much space for there to be an evf. they would have to make the camera bigger to accomodate an evf or push the lcd over a bit.


There will be an EVF and an OVF to attach to it. I think it's the best solution, pick which ever you like...

agreed, there will probably be plenty of times (going out at night) when i don't care about having a viewfinder but want to conserve space.

To be honest, this would be very tempting, but not at the price point of 2800$. I could go by with a nice fixed lens and even if I would rather have a 28mm, the 35 would be just fine. As I said, not at this price - for that I would get a 5DII and a Summicron and still have a expandable system.

$2800 and I can't take the lens with me when I upgrade bodies? This thing is going to have Maserati-like depreciation.

slungu wrote:
To be honest, this would be very tempting, but not at the price point of 2800$. I could go by with a nice fixed lens and even if I would rather have a 28mm, the 35 would be just fine. As I said, not at this price - for that I would get a 5DII and a Summicron and still have a expandable system.

Sure, whenever you go out, you grab you 5D with you
This will fit "almost" in your pocket or at least in your european men's purse... For that size
you have the quality of your 5D with better lens than anything Canon can come up with.

Well, it better be one hell of a lens for $2800. That's a lot for a non interchangeable camera with no finder imo, particularly if we see sub $2000, compact DSLR bodies using the same sensor. So, perhaps Sony IS testing the market with this thing.

Tariq Gibran wrote:
Well, it better be one hell of a lens for $2800. That's a lot for a non interchangeable camera with no finder imo, particularly if we see sub $2000, compact DSLR bodies using the same sensor. So, perhaps Sony IS testing the market with this thing.

Look, I paid over $3K for my 35 Cron. Many people did. So there is a market for a high end tiny FF camera
with such a lens... I think I'll get one just for fun and to support Sony

snowboarder wrote:
Sure, whenever you go out, you grab you 5D with you
This will fit "almost" in your pocket or at least in your european men's purse... For that size
you have the quality of your 5D with better lens than anything Canon can come up with.

Hm, I downgraded last year from 1DS plus 2 Zeiss C/Y to NEX plus 2 Zeiss ZM and one little 90/4, but while my back is much better now on a day trough the city, that NEX is not going to fit in my pocket and I am not expecting this from this one either. So yes, it sure has to deliver big time and even then, I am not sure I will take the bite.

I think this will be a boutique camera that likely lays both the technical and marketing groundwork for a FF ILC coming within the next year.

No EVF.
No tilt screen.
No interchangeable lenses.

I might have been convinced to spend $1500 on this, but $2700? No way. Not me.

I do like the 35mm FL, and F2 is just fine. But without the wide world of FF lens options I really don't need the IQ of FF. Current APS-C sensors are good enough at the moment. The day Sony announces an EVIL FF camera I will be all over it. Honestly, I would hope the price for such a beast would be in this range +/- a few bux, sans optics anyway.

I see this as an example of the typical Sony strategy of offering a product which differentiates itself from the competition in a "soft," rather than a "hard" or techical manner, and then playing chicken with the pricing to see how far they can go.

snowboarder wrote:
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Well, it better be one hell of a lens for $2800. That's a lot for a non interchangeable camera with no finder imo, particularly if we see sub $2000, compact DSLR bodies using the same sensor. So, perhaps Sony IS testing the market with this thing.

Look, I paid over $3K for my 35 Cron. Many people did. So there is a market for a high end tiny FF camera
with such a lens... I think I'll get one just for fun and to support Sony

Sure...but this is not a Leica 35 Cron. It's a Sony Zeiss which means it's probably a good lens but not anything close to your Cron (going by my experience with ZA 24/2). I'm most curious to see how it actually performs though.

I don't think the camera is going to be as "tiny" as you think. It might not fit to well in your man purse. but we will see. Personally, I would jump all over this if it had either a built in finder (adding the extra dimensions would hot have altered size too much I think) OR was not fixed lens.

snapsy wrote:
I think this will be a boutique camera that likely lays both the technical and marketing groundwork for a FF ILC coming within the next year.

+1

FWIW, we don't know whether this has a Nex-style flip up LCD or not. Hope so.

Tariq Gibran wrote:
snowboarder wrote:
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Well, it better be one hell of a lens for $2800. That's a lot for a non interchangeable camera with no finder imo, particularly if we see sub $2000, compact DSLR bodies using the same sensor. So, perhaps Sony IS testing the market with this thing.

Look, I paid over $3K for my 35 Cron. Many people did. So there is a market for a high end tiny FF camera
with such a lens... I think I'll get one just for fun and to support Sony

Sure...but this is not a Leica 35 Cron. It's a Sony Zeiss which means it's probably a good lens but not anything close to your Cron (going by my experience with ZA 24/2). I'm most curious to see how it actually performs though.

I don't think the camera is going to be as "tiny" as you think. It might not fit to well in your man purse. but we will see. Personally, I would jump all over this if it had either a built in finder (adding the extra dimensions would hot have altered size too much I think) OR was not fixed lens.


You're right. But even if its a good, not great lens, it's still a Zeiss 35 f2 FF, so at least $900 right?
The cheapest FF camera is supposed to be $1500 - FF and the simplest DSLR body for probably not more than $100.
This R1 requires some serious R&D, I don't see why people think it could be cheaper today.
In a few years - yes. But today, $2800 seems like a fair price to me.

I don't think the camera is going to be as "tiny" as you think. It might not fit to well in your man purse. but we will see.

snowboarder wrote:
Tariq Gibran wrote:
snowboarder wrote:
Tariq Gibran wrote:
Well, it better be one hell of a lens for $2800. That's a lot for a non interchangeable camera with no finder imo, particularly if we see sub $2000, compact DSLR bodies using the same sensor. So, perhaps Sony IS testing the market with this thing.

Look, I paid over $3K for my 35 Cron. Many people did. So there is a market for a high end tiny FF camera
with such a lens... I think I'll get one just for fun and to support Sony

Sure...but this is not a Leica 35 Cron. It's a Sony Zeiss which means it's probably a good lens but not anything close to your Cron (going by my experience with ZA 24/2). I'm most curious to see how it actually performs though.

I don't think the camera is going to be as "tiny" as you think. It might not fit to well in your man purse. but we will see. Personally, I would jump all over this if it had either a built in finder (adding the extra dimensions would hot have altered size too much I think) OR was not fixed lens.


You're right. But even if its a good, not great lens, it's still a Zeiss 35 f2 FF, so at least $900 right?
The cheapest FF camera is supposed to be $1500 - FF and the simplest DSLR body for probably not more than $100.
This R1 requires some serious R&D, I don't see why people think it could be cheaper today.
In a few years - yes. But today, $2800 seems like a fair price to me.


consider R&D, it might be lots of invest, but why costumer care that. I really doubt it will sell. $1800 for FF might sell well.

Fixed lens. Bummer.

Good thing though is that Sony have much shorter product cycles than Canon/Nikon. And since this is a Full-Frame something really nice could be just round the corner instead of "within 2-3 years".

Goodbye NEX-7.

A 35mm F2 on SONY FULL FRAME. sign me up.

I guess it helps that 35mm is my favorite focal length.

snowboarder wrote:
Damn, Sony is really pushing it!

http://www.sonyalpharumors.com/sony-rx1-costs-2799-same-a99-sensor/

I think it's amazing what Sony, Fuji and Oly are doing. Quite a shame where Canon/Nikon
are at the moment...

If rumours are correct and Nikon does bring us the D600 for a reasonable cost, Nikon has nothing to worry about. Canon on the other hand seems dedicated to a me-too lineup.

douglasf13 wrote:
FWIW, we don't know whether this has a Nex-style flip up LCD or not. Hope so.

that looks like a flip up lcd to me: