Sony RX1 FF Mirrorless (fixed lens)
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Makten
Registered: Jul 14, 2008
Total Posts: 4044
Country: Sweden

What do you guys think about the idea of using a decent quality fisheye or wideangle converter on the RX1? I suppose IQ will be lowered of course, but it could be fun and something to keep in your pocket. 0.5x magnification should be just enough, which isn't too extreme.

Something like this: http://www.digitaltoyshop.co.uk/RAYNOX_DCR-5000_SUPER_WIDE_ANGLE_0_5X_t932_4946



carstenw
Registered: Dec 26, 2005
Total Posts: 15814
Country: Germany

Doesn't that ruin the whole 1 camera - 1 lens philosophy?



Jochenb
Registered: May 25, 2010
Total Posts: 1811
Country: Belgium

Yes Wayne, I really hope I'm getting a good one this time because the files look and feel beautiful.

Here's another example, also at F5,6. Larger distance this time:



Left edge:



Right edge:



Small difference, but noticeable.



Makten
Registered: Jul 14, 2008
Total Posts: 4044
Country: Sweden

carstenw wrote:
Doesn't that ruin the whole 1 camera - 1 lens philosophy?


Well, yes and no! I think it could help NOT wanting "complementing" equipment. And since IQ would diminsh, I'd only use it either for fun or when it is necessary for capturing something, for example old buildings indoors.

I'm considering to sell my D700 and ZF 35/1.4, as I can't see myself ever using those bricks. The old MF Nikkors will stay though, for a future smallish MILC.

But you are of course right. It could as well throw me into upgrade land again, and I certainly don't want that.

Jochenb wrote:
Small difference, but noticeable.


Again, that's what I saw with mine. But I'd not accept even the right corner crop! I'm not kidding when I say it should be that sharp wide open, at any distance.



Jochenb
Registered: May 25, 2010
Total Posts: 1811
Country: Belgium

Ok Martin, good to know.

I bought my EVF from a different store, one that has a return policy of 14 days. Tomorrow is the last day so I returned it.
If I won't get a good copy of this camera I would've been stuck with the EVF. If I get a good RX1 it's the first thing I'll buy again. A must-have IMHO. It transforms the way this camera feels, you get more connected to a scene. You can also shoot at slower shutterspeeds.



mortyb
Registered: Feb 15, 2009
Total Posts: 1364
Country: Norway

It's interesting how we all go in different cycles. I just bought a 6D to use with my C/Ys. Yes, there's size and weight, but when I'm out photographing, I'm out photographing, so to say. When I'm back country skiing etc. I bring my Nex + CV 15/4.5. To me, the RX1 would be a great social camera first and foremost.



h00ligan
Registered: Jan 03, 2010
Total Posts: 2157
Country: United States

mortyb wrote:
It's interesting how we all go in different cycles. I just bought a 6D to use with my C/Ys. Yes, there's size and weight, but when I'm out photographing, I'm out photographing, so to say. When I'm back country skiing etc. I bring my Nex + CV 15/4.5. To me, the RX1 would be a great social camera first and foremost.



Two things prevent it from bring a great social camera, which is also what I'm looking for.

They didn't allow flash bounce. And the af in lower light is sometimes inaccurate and slowish.



sebboh
Registered: Nov 02, 2009
Total Posts: 10680
Country: United States

h00ligan wrote:
mortyb wrote:
It's interesting how we all go in different cycles. I just bought a 6D to use with my C/Ys. Yes, there's size and weight, but when I'm out photographing, I'm out photographing, so to say. When I'm back country skiing etc. I bring my Nex + CV 15/4.5. To me, the RX1 would be a great social camera first and foremost.



Two things prevent it from bring a great social camera, which is also what I'm looking for.

They didn't allow flash bounce. And the af in lower light is sometimes inaccurate and slowish.


it's abilities as a social camera are what make it seem very attractive to me. the lack of bounce flash when the NEX-7 has it is pretty annoying, though i usually wouldn't use it. poor AF doesn't really bother me as i can't imagine using AF to shoot people. how the MF with focus by wire works is more important to me.



philip_pj
Registered: Apr 03, 2009
Total Posts: 3103
Country: Australia

Seeing as how it has great base to high ISO, excellent close up capability, high micro-contrast and DR, good video, great bokeh and colour separation, the social camera niche is too strong a constraint in general.

My view on its inherent versatility is borne out by the images thread I believe. To see a variety of 'found objects', patterns, open field and intimate landscapes, close up work, cars, night time, streetscape, cafe photography and animals just take a look at the last few pages. Indeed there are few straight shots of people on that thread, save for a few environmental portraits, which is another strength.

Restricting use to a social camera omits a lot of its proven and identifiable capabilities, and argues against the very concept of this kind of camera - a jack of all trades, perhaps a master of most trades, we could even say - at the 35mm FL in any case.

But it does mean buyers can 'grow' into the camera's abilities. Even the allegedly slow AF is mitigated by good MF capability (focus and aperture rings and peaking and magnification) for those so inclined, who make up the target clientele.

Bottom line: different niches and styles are well catered for with a high level of user satisfaction. So you would need a top modern FF DSLR and excellent similar lens to get close, and how much would that cost and how much would it weigh?

It is actually good value for advanced artistic photography by discerning users, the reason why so many Leica m8/9 users have one or are eyeing it off. Fitting an integrated EVF and a simple tilt LCD would sway a lot more potential buyers, though.



h00ligan
Registered: Jan 03, 2010
Total Posts: 2157
Country: United States

Best fly by wire I've ever used. Nothing like the x100. It's very well implemented. VERY well. However

You can't get focus peaking without magnification. I have no idea why Sony made that stupid decision. I've no doubt it will be changed with firmware.

The other reason the camera is selling to Leica users, they have the money to buy one.



Yakim Peled
Registered: Nov 18, 2004
Total Posts: 16903
Country: Israel

Jochenb wrote:
Ok Martin, good to know.

I bought my EVF from a different store, one that has a return policy of 14 days. Tomorrow is the last day so I returned it.
If I won't get a good copy of this camera I would've been stuck with the EVF. If I get a good RX1 it's the first thing I'll buy again. A must-have IMHO. It transforms the way this camera feels, you get more connected to a scene. You can also shoot at slower shutterspeeds.


I fully agree though I never tried the RX1. Yesterday I tried the LCD-only RX100 and it was a horrible shooting experience. Not comfortable to shoot (MR described it as a "dirty diaper" position) and not very visible when the sun is out. Yikes.

Happy shooting,
Yakim.



joe88
Registered: Oct 23, 2009
Total Posts: 2240
Country: United States

h00ligan wrote:
You can't get focus peaking without magnification. I have no idea why Sony made that stupid decision. I've no doubt it will be changed with firmware.


Probably because live view in manual focus mode is stopped down to f/4 and not wide open? So without magnification, the peaking would not be as accurate or would pick up too large of an area in focus. I found this to be true with my own test shots so I rather use magnification and look for actual sharpness on the LCD with peaking turned to minimum. I haven't received my EVF, so I don't know how focus peaking works with one.

The manual focus could be improved via new firmware. I would like to have a better distance scale especially with markings for distances from 5ft to 12ft where we could lock in hyperfocal distances. A must have for me is a memory for the last manual focus distance when camera shuts down. Its fine for slow deliberate shooting but useless for street shooting. Snap focus similar to Ricoh GRD where you can lock focus for preset distances would be great but I doubt Sony will implement it.



sebboh
Registered: Nov 02, 2009
Total Posts: 10680
Country: United States

joe88 wrote:
Probably because live view in manual focus mode is stopped down to f/4 and not wide open? So without magnification, the peaking would not be as accurate or would pick up too large of an area in focus. I found this to be true with my own test shots so I rather use magnification and look for actual sharpness on the LCD with peaking turned to minimum. I haven't received my EVF, so I don't know how focus peaking works with one.


wait what!?!

you can't control working aperture in MF mode?



xbarcelo
Registered: Nov 04, 2010
Total Posts: 573
Country: Spain

This doesn't make any sense at all…



Jonas B
Registered: Jun 05, 2005
Total Posts: 2433
Country: Sweden

I'm sure you can. I haven't even seen a RX1 but from using several mirrorless cameras since 2008 (the original Panasonic G1) I've learned different manufacturers have different solutions to a possible problem with "overloading" the sensor.
The camera may set the aperture to f/4 while focusing when in MF mode but surely the aperture blades opens up or stops down to whatever you want them to when taking the image.
With the E-M5 I use now you can keep focusing manually at any aperture opening as long as you press the DOF control.
OK, that's some guessing but it makes more sense than thining the camera can be used at f/4 only unless using AF.



joe88
Registered: Oct 23, 2009
Total Posts: 2240
Country: United States

sebboh wrote:
wait what!?!

you can't control working aperture in MF mode?


Yes you can, maybe I did not explain in detail. Live view closes it up to f2.8 or f/4 for the display and focus peaking is based at around f/2.8 or f/4, definitely not f/2 and it opens it back up to f/2 or other when you take the picture. Even Lloyd Chambers mentioned it in his review. I think its the similar issue the Fuji X100 had in the beginning with the aperture chatter?

For shots up close or at MFD this is not an issue as you can easily see the focus region without magnification but at shots further away, it could be an issue. So this is probably the reason why they had the magnified view on all the time?



sebboh
Registered: Nov 02, 2009
Total Posts: 10680
Country: United States

joe88 wrote:
sebboh wrote:
wait what!?!

you can't control working aperture in MF mode?


Yes you can, maybe I did not explain in detail. Live view closes it up to f2.8 or f/4 for the display and focus peaking is based at around f/2.8 or f/4, definitely not f/2 and it opens it back up to f/2 or other when you take the picture. Even Lloyd Chambers mentioned it in his review. I think its the similar issue the Fuji X100 had in the beginning with the aperture chatter?

For shots up close or at MFD this is not an issue as you can easily see the focus region without magnification but at shots further away, it could be an issue. So this is probably the reason why they had the magnified view on all the time?


sorry, i phrased the question wrong. you can't manual focus at working aperture or even wide open!?! WTF!

that officially kills it for me.



xbarcelo
Registered: Nov 04, 2010
Total Posts: 573
Country: Spain

That's at least surprising, considering that the NEX cameras don't do this and let you have the liveview at your chosen aperture…



sebboh
Registered: Nov 02, 2009
Total Posts: 10680
Country: United States

xbarcelo wrote:
That's at least surprising, considering that the NEX cameras don't do this and let you have the liveview at your chosen aperture…


that's what i was thinking. there must be a setting somewhere in the menu where you can tell it to simulate actual exposure like there is on the NEX-7?



Chris Crevasse
Registered: Apr 05, 2012
Total Posts: 4
Country: United States

While I find the AF on my RX1 to be accurate, it behaves in a somewhat unusual fashion. I've watched Steve Huff's video comparing AF on the RX1 with AF on the Fuji X-E1. His RX1 seems to lock focus quickly. Mine often moves past the point of focus once or twice before locking. For example, if I change from distant focus to near focus, the AF will first focus too closely, then too far, then settle on correct focus. This happens fairly quickly, and focus ultimately is accurate, but the behavior strikes me as less than optimal. I use center point focus. The amount of available light and selected aperture don't seem to make much difference. Is this "normal" AF behavior for the RX1? Thanks.



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