I am looking for something that is reasonably portable. The only thing I have right now is my flash(550EX), a 45" Westcott umbrella and a Manfrotto 3361 comapct stand. I know flashes are of course the most portable but I am not looking for a flash only solution. At home, I have a relatively small space to work with at about 15'x10' with a 8.5' ceiling. Elsewhere, it will obviously depend. I will probably use this outdoors occasionally but mostly indoors.
First off is the brand of lights. Right now I am leaning towards Alien Bees. I have looked at other brands such as the Elinchrome but I keep coming back to Alien bees. I am thinking two AB800 for the cost/performance factor. I may just start off with one as many suggest but I figure 2 is twice the fun!
Light meter- Sekonic LS358. This seems to be the popular choice.
Softbox- Looking at the Westcott Apollo 28"x28"
Grids/reflectors/etc - Any suggestions?
Remote control - Cyber commander + receivers
Carrying case - Something sturdy that I can fly with if necessary
Portable power - low down on the list right now but I am looking at the Vagabond II
If you have alternative systems or other suggestins I should be lloking at I am all ears. Thanks.
Your list sounds perfect for ABs except the Apollo 28" softbox. Had one, didn't like it. I prefer Photoflex boxes (if going cheap) with a dedicated speedring. Vagabond2 is the only real option for portable power and ABs.
Considering it's your first foray (assuming) into studio lighting, I think ABs are a good place to start.
Also, unless you really understand lighting, start with 1. Too many people try to start off with multiple lights and it hardly ever does any good. Use one light, learn how to master it. You'll know when you need a 2nd/3rd light.
Thanks for the feedback. Yes this would be my first foray into studio lighting so I guess I better stick with one light which is what everyone says.
What specifically did you not like about the apollo? Is the Photoflex compact and easy to setup and breakdown? Also should I go with a small or medium size box? I know that bigger the better. Just keeping an eye to portability. I dont mind spending extra when it's worth it. One thing I have learned is that it usually doenst pay for me to go too cheap because then I outgrow the equipment too quickly and I end up stuck wheeling and dealing on Buy&Sell
I think you're on the right track with 2. Key and fill. Lots and lots of combinations with 2. A lot of single light setups still require another source, whether it be a reflector or a window.
Meter is useful...LS358 is popular.
I have the Apollo 28" x 28" and use it with a beauty dish in the studio or with a speedlight on the go. As a general purpose softbox, it's rather small. Aside from the low ceiling, your room dimensions are not too bad. You might prefer small and close versus large and farther.
Would definitely get more familiar with your lights before you invest in additional modifiers.
Cybersyncs are useful. Not sure how useful a commander will be to you.
Probably looking at a Pelican case...at least a 1600 to fly with.
Vagabond and the battery from the Phillipine place are pretty much your <$400 options. I looked at DIY and you end up spending close to the cost of a Vagabond and not nearly as refined.
As far as the lights are concerned, if you're thinking about a Vagabond, you're probably thinking about outdoor shooting and I don't think you'll be happy with only AB800's. An AB1600 and an AB800 seems much more versatile IMO.
Before buying anything at all, I'd go through Chuck Gardner's website. I've almost hit all of the links myself and if you study it, you'll have a great conceptual background on which to build your skills through practice.
I have been looking at getting just about the identical setup for both outdoor shoots and some indoor stuff. I have been using a 580ex off camera with some great results but I want some strobes for indoor stuff, and more power outside, even though the sync is not anywhere near where I can sync in ETTL off camera with my 580.
The equipment list list looks OK except for the SB. I'd suggest a med (24 x 32) Photoflex MultiDome Q39. It has interchangeable white/silver/gold liners. The gold isn't of much use, but if you use the silver without diffusers on the front you get a nice, punchy source which creates specular highlights which is ideal for furry and feathered pets. The specular reflections make hair and feathers look more 3D and with white fur you need both specular highlights and distinct shadows. A controlled silver source is the ideal tool.
As for 1 light vs 2 consider this:
Control of lighting requires independent control of key light, which creates the pattern, and fill, which controls the tone of the shadows and the illusion of "hard" and "soft" in the overall lighting pattern. If using one light the fill must come from a reflector. Reflectors are easy to used outdoors where there is light coming from all directions to bounce, but indoors if you are short lighting a full face view the key light is facing the subject making it difficult to position a reflector where is can both catch the light and do its job effectively.
Most beginners and many pros don't really comprehend the role fill plays. It's job is to put detail in the areas the key light doesn't hit EVERYWHERE the camera sees. The fill source can fill if it creates shadows. Where there are fill shadows, which occurs when fill is moved off axis, there will be dark voids on the face is low places like smile lines and the corners of the mouth.
In a two light strategy you simply park the key light over the camera where it creates few shadows and pretty much forget about it. In lighting rations the fill is the constant 1. What changes is the strength of the fill relative to the fill which is lifting the shadows. The key light overlaps the fill. That is how contrast is controlled so both the shadow and the highlight detail can be recorded at the same time.
Conceptually it works like this: If you started in a dark room and put the fill over the camera, you'd want to raise its power until you saw detail in the darkest objects in the foreground:
Then to add separation with a dark background you might add a background light: http://super.nova.org/TP/LE02.jpg
or alternately just use a lighter background if all you have is two lights.
Then when the "key" light is added in front and to the side it doesn't change the shadows which were lifted by the fill, it simply creates highlights on top of the fill. http://super.nova.org/TP/LE03.jpg
Now it doesn't really matter if you turn on the key first and fill second the cause and effect is the same: key overlaps fill. Exposure simpler if you start with fill. We've already got the shadows exposed perfectly in step 1. In step 3 where the key light is added we just keep adding it until the highlights are just below clipping in the camera playback warning.
The fill is the "cake" and key light is the "icing" on top of it. If you want to decorate the icing a bit more you add some piping in the form of back rim lighting.
Rim lighting actually creates the strongest illusion of 3D shape. Stop and consider the phases of the moon. When flat lit and full it looks like a flat disk and it looks most like a ball when rim lighting define the curved edge and most of the front is in shadow. That's true of most 3D objects. The reason we put the key light in front is because we humans react emotionally to eye contact and in a portrait its necessary to put light in the eyes to enable the eye contact dynamic and create natural modeling on the face . So the final step in a classic / conventional portrait set-up is to add a rim light component:
There is no rule saying how many lights must be used or where they should be placed. I just happen to have the four light exercise on line as a demonstration of the cause and effect of a classic four light strategy in defining 3D shape. It provides a good road map leading to the underlying goal of the exercise of lighting, fooling the brain of the viewer with a pattern of contrast into thinking a 2D photo is a real 3D object.
I had the good fortune at age 20 to get a job with a master portrait and wedding photographer named Monte Zucker. At the time he did all his portraits by widow light with a reflector. I learned how to light that way. He did all the reception photos with direct dual flash - no modifiers - in an overlapping key over neutral fill from a flash over the camera on a bracket. The advice to start with two lights is based on the cause and effect learned from that experience.
If you start with fill over the camera when learning, the only variables you need to focus on is the position and strength of the key light relative to the fill. The fill will do its job without your intervention. Once you master the basics of short, butterfly and broad lighting that way you can then set up a lighting pattern with fill starting over the camera, and then without moving the subject or key light move the fill light around to the side and be able to better see when it is shaded and why there are dark voids in the pattern. You can then decide whether the lighting on the face looks better with the dark voids. If you start with a reflector and place it too far back behind the face in an attempt to catch can reflect the key light you may come to accept dark voids in low places as par for the course.
Either way eventually you will want and need to learn how to use two, three and perhaps four lights effectively, so starting with two just gets you up the learning curve a bit faster
Thanks for the info chuck. That is a lot of information to digest but your examples are very helpful. What do you think of the suggestion to go with a AB1600 and AB800 versus 2 AB800s?
Battery - Is the phillipines battery you referred to the Explorer?
On the softbox, I realize bigger is better. I was just looking to get something that was portable as well as useful. I think I'll check out the photoflex suggestion.
Cybersyncs - I know the Commander is overkill I was just looking to get something that might serve me down the road. I'd hate to grow out of the cybersyncs and then sell them off at losses when I could have just spent the money upfront and saved myself the hassle of selling my stuff. OTOH, I don't want something too complicated that I end up using them as hockey pucks. Decisions, decisions.
Thanks for your input.
jdben622 wrote:
I have the Apollo 28" x 28" and use it with a beauty dish in the studio or with a speedlight on the go. As a general purpose softbox, it's rather small. Aside from the low ceiling, your room dimensions are not too bad. You might prefer small and close versus large and farther.
Cybersyncs are useful. Not sure how useful a commander will be to you.
Probably looking at a Pelican case...at least a 1600 to fly with.
Vagabond and the battery from the Phillipine place are pretty much your <$400 options. I looked at DIY and you end up spending close to the cost of a Vagabond and not nearly as refined.
As far as the lights are concerned, if you're thinking about a Vagabond, you're probably thinking about outdoor shooting and I don't think you'll be happy with only AB800's. An AB1600 and an AB800 seems much more versatile IMO.
Before buying anything at all, I'd go through Chuck Gardner's website. I've almost hit all of the links myself and if you study it, you'll have a great conceptual background on which to build your skills through practice....Show more →
danielsan wrote:
Thanks for the info chuck. That is a lot of information to digest but your examples are very helpful. What do you think of the suggestion to go with a AB1600 and AB800 versus 2 AB800s?
Depends on your needs.
Outdoors battling the sun is or shooting wedding groups or baseball teams is where you'd need the extra power of the 640 WS of the 1600, but if you are going that route a WL1600 would be a better choice because it is bank switchable with a 1/4 power range which allows it to use 640WS outdoors when needed, then switch to 160 WS (equivalent to an AB400) for indoor use.
If all you plan on doing is indoor portraits then a pair of AB800 would be adequate. You don't need to buy everything at once, and Buff has a very liberal upgrade policy where you pay only $25 plus the difference in the cost of the units if memory serves. Check with Buff customer service for the details: they are very helpful folks who sometimes answer the phone before you even hear the first ring on your end
