These images are straight from my 5D Mark II and 70-200 2.8 IS except for Lightroom's standard conversion from the original raw file and the low screen-sharpening setting in Export. EXIF data is intact. The file "photo.jpg" in the zip file is from my wife's iPhone and shows how the lights are arranged. That's important to understand because my subject was on the move.
derek walter wrote:
"The key to good management is delegation of responsibilities."
You need to find a local photographer, who is also a customer, and give or loan him some modifiers in trade for sample photos. Get some real life pics in use. I'm sure plenty would jump on it, I know i would.
At the risk of wrath of those here who like to expound on how I should run my business and life, I find your comments assume you know considerably more about how I should go about various tasks, and that your solutions a certainly better than mine. I suspect you have vast experience in this area?
The reason I react so strongly is because of your implication that neither I nor my staff understand management and you do, followed by an unsolicited "You Need to . . . " This is telling other people what to do without them asking your opinion - a basic flaw in communications that is not constructive.
I'm sure you didn't intend it this way, but I felt the need to comment on how such a statement comes off. In my advertising and communications I make it a point to never say "You should buy this," Or "you need this". I would never presume to know what my customers need or to tell them what they should buy. Now, if they ask opinions on these subject, we will gladly go over the pros and cons of what we suggest and for what reasons. Often times the answer may be the purchase of a competitor's product. In my opinion, this is the key to excellent customer relations. . . . notice the IMHO.
On the subject of giving equipment to local photographers to test, I'm sad to say that not one in a thousand local photographers, or even the majority of magazine "testers" are capable of doing the technical analysis and measurement necessary to supply me, or my customers with much more the "Yep - it took a picture."
No offense intended. A preface such as "In my opinion" or "I am not qualified to tell you what you should do, but here's a suggestion from my point of view" would go a long way to better communications.
Coming on too strong on such a minor point? Maybe. But the state of communication today is a far cry from what it used to be in the US I grew up in.
thebeginning wrote:
Paul, please don't leave. You are very valued here.
(Just in case something stupid comes out of this)
I can handle the heat. I try to be an open book and don't plan to be pressured into the mold of what someone else might like me to be. You can always expect stupid thing to come out on any forum. Thanx for your support.
You are all correct, as I typed it, in my head, it was meant to come out on a pleasant suggestion, sorry if it didn't.
It was meant to be helpful as you are up to your ears in product development. Not a shot at what you are doing but a friendly suggestion that might help your business and allow you to focus on other things.
The problem with emotionless words typed on a black background, I guess.
My apologies, I am a strong supporter of PCB and if you check POTN you will find I spend alot of time defending your products against the other so-called "high-end" users.
Paul wrote: On the subject of giving equipment to local photographers to test, I'm sad to say that not one in a thousand local photographers, or even the majority of magazine "testers" are capable of doing the technical analysis and measurement necessary to supply me, or my customers with much more the "Yep - it took a picture."
This couldn't be further from the truth. All businesses rely on testimonials from individuals and organizations outside their inner circle. No one really takes to heart the boasts of a manufacturer about its own product, but they do consider reviews and opinions from experts and other credible critics who have nothing to gain other than sharing their professional opinion about a product within the realm of their expertise.
The thing is Paul, I don't really care about the technical minutiae of my gear. I care about what it can do under the real world conditions that I shoot in. You are not a photographer, and your findings are not only suspect to me (because you have a lot at stake in selling your product), but your skills and understanding of how the gear will perform under certain conditions is outside the scope of your experience. If you were to lend your gear to someone like Greg Gorman and then show a few shots with some positive testimonials, then you're establishing credibility that feeds into the consumers need to remove the pain from buying a product that may not hold real value to them.
This is a fundamental ploy used in advertising and branding every day. If you take a look at the below link, you'll see what Profoto wisely did to give credibility to their line of monolights. Their previous line was a disaster, if not an outright afterthought to the idea of a functional light, and I believe they sensed that they needed to assure wary consumers that this line was safe to buy and perfect for their needs. In fact, the photographer starts out with the comment, " I started using Profoto for one reason; the amazing quality of these lights." It just doesn't get better than that.
And don't jump to the conclusion that I'm picking on you. I would correct anyone on this opinion since it does not jive with the principles of brand and advertising. You have plenty of advocates here who can readily share positive experiences and much better photos than you're capable of producing, not to mention the impact that a positive review has when it comes from a third.
When I logged on to this particular forum. The first 5 threads were all about Paul Buff products. It would seem that you have a good number of people to utilize to your own benefit. Your mistaken belief is your loss.
In my uneducated opinion (I have no formal marketing experience), I agree with Deezie's basic viewpoint that positive testimonials from industry notables are surely a good thing.
I wonder just how much a positive testimonial from Scott Kelby would affect sales of Paul's excellent gear.
I completely understand Paul's point of view about most photographers not being able to give him the technical measurements he seeks (though Chuck Gardner is one exception that comes to mind), and that's why he should have his own crew provide that information. But the captured image is where the rubber meets the road, and when an industry notable says he uses certain gear to achieve his images, it has impact in consumers' minds.
Whatever floats Paul's boat, though. Paul's sales aren't my responsibility. I do hope Paul continues to innovate, develop, and deliver premium photographic lighting equipment, and I have some fear our unsolicited suggestions for Paul may drive him away. Aside from my boom clamp, I really love all of my Buff gear, which includes four lights, two softboxes, grids, three umbrellas, two stands, snoot, gels, five-in-one circular reflector, background shovel reflector, and CyberSync transmitter and two receivers.
I can hardly wait to get my hands on Cyber Commander and the new beauty dish.
I have priceless images of my son and the rest of my family, and I have the cover image of an Elite-represented model's comp card thanks to Paul's excellent gear.
Derek -My response was not against you or your suggestion at all. I apologize if it came off that way. I know you are not an antagonist. It was all about "You need to . . ." It's just there are too many in the world telling others what they "Need to do"
Jaddie - I find your views well founded
Deezie - You statements: "This is a fundamental ploy used in advertising and branding every day. If you take a look at the below link, you'll see what Profoto wisely did to give credibility to their line of monolights. Their previous line was a disaster, if not an outright afterthought to the idea of a functional light, and I believe they sensed that they needed to assure wary consumers that this line was safe to buy and perfect for their needs." sums it all up.
My 27 year photo biz history has no disasters - nothing but day by day and year by year increases in sales, profits, innovations, notoriety and customer accolades. I have never been faced with the need to use advertising ploys or to reassure my 500,000 or so customers it was safe to buy. My customers tell this to each other and to our staff daily.
Perhaps your advice might be suited for struggling or failing public corporations. Me? I'm quite happy to to have been a successful industry leader in pro audio and photo lighting since 1969 without the need or "benefit" of marketing degrees, agencies or ad ploys. I like to think my customers are wise enough to make their own decisions without relying on paid endorsements from heros and superstars. FYI, this is called "seat of the pants marketing" - a chapter apparently missing from your playbook.
My methods might be considered tacky or amateurish by professional pitchmen but my customers like them (or so they tell me with their wallets and daily testimonials and in their posts whenever the topic is "What do you think of AB or Buff?")
As for "Your mistaken belief is your loss." and "I would correct anyone on this opinion since it does not jive with the principles of brand and advertising" . . . you think I'm arrogant and misinformed? I'm sure you have a mirror around somewhere.
I'll put Paul C. Buff, Inc up against Profoto any day of the week in terms of innovation, sales, profits or customer satisfaction. It's your "inner circle" vs the real world IMHO. So my advice is simple: If you like my company and products, buy them. If you don't . . . have a ball telling me I don't know what I'm doing and what I ought to be doing instead. But it's puzzling . . . what are you trying to accomplish? Is this a benevolent attempt to save someone from themselves or an opportunity to self promote?
Buff wrote: I have never been faced with the need to use advertising ploys or to reassure my 500,000 or so customers it was safe to buy. My customers tell this to each other and to our staff daily.
You conveniently neglect to mention the plethora of unhappy statements directed toward you on this site for products that you released too early without the benefit of beta testing or sufficient information. For example, you released a ringlight that many buyers expressed concerns over its rather feeble build. And as I recall, you had to send out replacement parts to those early buyers. There have been numerous questions about your new Para-umbrella in relation to its usage. And instead of providing photo samples, you have relied on early buyers on this forum to present examples of what the para actually looks like and criticism of its use in application.
You've applauded many of those here who posted shots, including the efforts of a poster named Ellis Vener, who reviews products for a column. You've been chummy and forthcoming with him, yet you seem to insist that his opinion amounts to no more credibility than a "Yep - it took a picture."
You are constantly contradicting yourself. Boasting that you're number one in sales (which would make you one of the big guys), yet casually spewing insults at photographers who use gear of the big guys, like Profoto, as being snobs. And yes, your methods are amateurish and unprofessional. Your policy of policing this site for any naysayers and using aggressive tactics to discredit them is well known, and you've been admonished by many here for it.
You even offended your most hardened fan base when you took down a forum on your own site and resorted to blaming them and name calling. Their angry posts are still here on this site. I guess if you want to call this "seat of the pants marketing," a lot of us veterans from the ad agencies would be asking you, "How's that working for you?"
You ask, "what are you trying to accomplish? Is this a benevolent attempt to save someone from themselves or an opportunity to self promote?" I'm a photographer and this is a site for photographers to commune with one another by sharing ideas and information. My clients are the advertising agencies, film studios and networks. They have no presence on here, so there's nothing to promote. You, on the other hand, are here for no other reason than to sell your goods. You're really in no position to play the self-promotion card.
Question from Deezie:
"I guess if you want to call this "seat of the pants marketing," a lot of us veterans from the ad agencies would be asking you, "How's that working for you?"
It's obvious that you're one sharp cookie. (I say this with no sarcasm whatsoever.)
But did you think your well-written post, whose diction alone makes it worthy of <i>The New Yorker</i>, would elicit any constructive response from Paul?
I'm a big fan of Paul's gear, and I reckon that does relegate me to rank-and-file fanboy, but I will concede that I still feel the sting of his forum's abrupt closing. My wife tells me, "Jaddie, STFU about that. I've heard enough." I'm thankful for Fritz's picking up the ball with pixelburners.com.
Isn't it clear by this point that no matter how intelligently you criticize Paul, your effort isn't going to bear fruit?
Paul's not going to change himself or his practices unless he wants to.
Actually, I'm not, either.
Let's live and let live, or try to.
And if that doesn't elicit any positivity in you, maybe these unedited images from tonight's session in our basement studio will:
http://www.jaddie.com/jpg/max_unedited_7233.jpg
http://www.jaddie.com/jpg/max_unedited_7270.jpg
http://www.jaddie.com/jpg/max_unedited_7282.jpg
At camera left was Paul's X1600 driving a seven-foot Photoflex OctoDome (I would've been using Paul's new 86" white parabolic modifier if my wife had given me time to go get it). Over Max's head is Paul's B800 with his gridded, foldable stripbox; at camera right is Paul's five-in-one circular reflector; and on the back, camera-right of the image is Paul's B400 with the seven-inch reflector with twenty-degree grid (though it's being blocked by the top of the chest).
The subject's grandfather was sheriff of Gwinnett County, Georgia, for sixteen years. Gwinnett was the fastest-growing county in the nation for four years in a row (back in the '80s, I think, which was when Daddy was sheriff). Daddy was born to poor and unwell parents but worked hard and prospered. He was on my butt about having children from a long time ago, but cancer found his liver, and three weeks and two days after he found out, he passed away. Ten years after he died, in vitro fertilization enabled us to produce a healthy, handsome son, whom he would have adored. They referred to Daddy as sheriff at his funeral, even though he'd been out of that office for fourteen years. He'll always be the sheriff to the old timers in our town, but there is a new sheriff on the loose.
Nice shots Jaddie. Glad to see the people who got kicked off our forum for being obnoxious now have a place to bitch about me. Haven't seem much but bashing at Pixel Burners. They get about 4 posts a day when I bother to look and now have their hands out for donations.
Paul Buff wrote:
Glad to see the people who got kicked off our forum for being obnoxious now have a place to bitch about me. Haven't seem much but bashing at Pixel Burners.
There was some of that, and there'll probably be some of that in the future, too, given the forum's genesis.
There are a bunch of your customers on there, too, who continue to use and purchase your excellent gear.
Paul Buff wrote:
They get about 4 posts a day when I bother to look and now have their hands out for donations.
I donated. There are a lot of folks on the forum who know a whole lot about photography. I try to ignore the vitriolic bits and soak up the good stuff. I became a member of photography-on-the.net just to follow YinkaMD, an exceptionally talented photographer who was a beacon of light on your forum.
Maczilla wrote: But did you think your well-written post, whose diction alone makes it worthy of <i>The New Yorker</i>, would elicit any constructive response from Paul?
No, I'm under no illusions that Paul will ever change. My responses are more to the newer members unaware of Paul's typical antics. Paul seems to think he can exert his will upon the members of this board to constantly control his public image. A member here simply offered a well-intentioned suggestion (and a very good one, at that), and instead of merely saying, "Thanks, I'll consider it," Paul proceeded to write a treatise about people telling him his business. And the poor guy wound up feeling a tad guilty for making a helpful comment and apologized.
I have never liked school-yard bullies, and Paul is the poster-child for internet ruffians. As a previous owner of his gear (which I liked, good customer service, too), I found myself too appalled by his rotten behavior to remain an owner. If Paul were the CEO of a public company, he would've been kicked out long ago for his misdeeds. As an owner of a private company, his company details remain private, and his disclosures on this board may largely be hyperbole or outright fictions. We don't know. We do know that his motivation is to sell his gear, and given his often aggressive comments, it would seem likely that he might say anything to demonstrate his credibility to prospective buyers.
I just shake my head when guys come on this board and express profound glee that an owner of a small company would actually come here to chat with them, as if Paul's some benevolent soul reaching out to enlighten them with his kernels of knowledge, when his only objective is for them to open up their wallets. Paul has actually found a perfect fit for his needs: no costs to advertise, plenty of eager, inexperienced buyers, and no one to really confront his bad behavior.
The last time I checked, this was still Fred Miranda's site, not Paul Buff's. Paul had his own forum of submissive followers, but shut that down so he could come over here. Go figure...
I don't quite understand what your agenda is. I am an open book and my customers like that. Like any human, I make mistakes. When I do, I admit them instead of following your advice to cover them up with ad agency tricks.
Your life seems dedicated to campaigning against anything I say or do. But, hey, keep it up . . . it just increases my credibility and leaves you a sourpuss who keeps my good name at the top of these threads. When you have 500,000 supporters and a handful of antagonists you sleep well at night.
Gee a business owner that wants to sell his product. That takes alot of nerve.
You showed him how you feel by not buying his gear anymore, and so you should. But now you jump on this thread to bad mouth him? Now who's the bully?
Notice that this thread was started by, and continued by people who like his new PLM's? Why are you here? Just to stir up arguments and get this thread locked? I like having Paul here, even if I don't always approve of what he says, he has a right to say it, and most of his comments are friendly and helpful.
The last time i checked, this was still Fred Miranda's site, not Deezie's
