Mamiya 80mm 645 options

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Archive 2008 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

jcolwell
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p.2 #1 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Cableaddict wrote:
Another question:

I see some 645 lenses that say BOTH "C" and "N" for example:

" Mamiya-Sekor C 80mm f:2.8 N "

So is this a C or an N

?

They're both C, only one is N.

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Aug 06, 2009 at 11:22 PM

Cableaddict
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p.2 #2 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Thanks, Jim.

I kinda' figured this was the case, but then what exactly does the "C" stand for?

BTW, it looks like both of these have the same coating, at least on the front. Is it visually different on the rear element?

Aug 06, 2009 at 11:32 PM

jcolwell
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p.2 #3 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Cableaddict wrote: ... what exactly does the "C" stand for?

I don't know. It's a series brand. They also have the A series. I've never seen the B series.

Edited on Aug 07, 2009 at 12:38 AM · View previous versions

Aug 07, 2009 at 12:28 AM

mawz
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p.2 #4 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Cableaddict wrote:
mawz wrote:
The 55 has C and N variants (confusingly there is an L/S 55, which isn't an S but is actually a C with a leaf shutter). .

Now that's odd. In another thread, someone wrote that the 80mm Leaf Shutter lens was sharper than even the "N," which made me assume the Leaf was made later than the N.
Could what you are saying here be true of ONLY the 55mm?

The 80 Leaf Shutter is an L/N series lens, concurrent with the 80 2.8 N. It's the only one of the leaf shutter lenses which did not have a C (or L/S) version as it replaced the older 70/2.8 L/S.

There are C and N versions of most 645 Lenses except for the A lenses, which are all N series. The few exceptions include both 70mm's (C only for the L/S and also IIRC for the non leaf-shutter variant) and the 80N/L (No C version).

Aug 07, 2009 at 12:38 AM

mawz
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p.2 #5 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Cableaddict wrote:
Thanks, Jim.

I kinda' figured this was the case, but then what exactly does the "C" stand for?

BTW, it looks like both of these have the same coating, at least on the front. Is it visually different on the rear element?

IIRC C stands for Coated, original series RB67 lenses lack it and are only single-coated. All M645 lenses other than the A series have the C labeling.

N has updated coatings, but both C and N are multi-coated lenses. You cannot visually differentiate coatings with the Mamiya lenses but they are actually different.

Aug 07, 2009 at 12:43 AM

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p.2 #6 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

OK, thanks, The fog is lifting a bit. If my head explodes, it's really gonna' be a mess, so more clarification needed:

mawz wrote:

The 80 Leaf Shutter is an L/N series lens, concurrent with the 80 2.8 N. .

So is the Leaf Shutter theoretically the same optical design as the N, or did it have more changes than just the shutter? I'm guessing the former, with Jim's preference for the Leaf version explained simply by sample-to-sample variation. Does anyone know for sure?

----------------------

Also, L/N stands, I assume, for "leaf version of an N-series" correct? Then what is L/S, "leaf version of an S series? - But the "S" is supposedly the same formula as the "N" so...

Is it also possible that the slight negative comments about the 80/1.9 are based on the "plain C" version, and that the "N" or maybe the L/N would be as sharp as the 80/2.8?

(Head threatening to explode once again. Getting out the Bounty towels as I type this.....)

Aug 07, 2009 at 01:30 AM

jcolwell
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p.2 #7 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

You will always find conflicting information on lens performance and "IQ". After all, many aspects of it are very subjective, and so there will always be different opinions. Even direct measurement of parameters such as resolution are subject to variation due to test methods and (as you said above) sample variation. I think the best you can do is to use information from places like this forum to identify lenses that you think might work for you, and then try one. Most of the alternative lenses have stable or increasing prices, and so you can't go too far wrong with the "buy & try" approach - as long as you don't pay too much at the front end.

Aug 07, 2009 at 10:49 AM

mawz
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p.2 #8 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

L/S stands for Leaf Shutter, N/L is N L/S.

I suspect the difference in performance between the plain 80 and the Leaf Shutter version is all in the QC. The plain 80 is a kit lens and likely didn't receive the same level of QC as the much lower production leaf shutter variant.

There is no N/L version of the 80/1.9, only a C and an N version. Both perform well, although my experience is the plain 80/2.8 is optically a bit better. I suspect the mixed reviews are from those expecting the more expensive version to outperform the already superb basic 80, rather than simply offering an extra stop and a slightly different rendering.

Aug 07, 2009 at 11:39 AM

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p.2 #9 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Conner999 wrote:
There is also an S or interim version of some older lenses - older C metal-centric style body, but N style coatings. Love the 80/1.9 and agree with CA about Bokeh and color. Have yet to try an M645 lens I didn't like.

This could be true as far as the construction. I found this comment on some review: "55/2.8 N has cheaper build quality and compressed focusing scale when compared to 55/2.8 S"

-but I'm not sure about the time frame:

I saw a 55/2.8 "S" which had a later serial number than some "N" versions I've seen. I also see NEW 55/2.8 "S" versions on the Amazon & Calumet websites. (with ser #'s not showing)

One Ebay seller wrote me: "N = new S = short as in shorter lens"

Shorter? Hmm. See the pic, below. The brand new "S" is indeed shorter than a vintage "C" and is seemingly the same as the "N" - but the vintage "S" is longer. Also, the new "S" looks to be plastic, while the vintage "S" looks to be all metal.

So, here's my guess: The original "S" was exactly as Conner wrote. Old construction with new coatings. -but Mamiya must have recently revived the "S" designation and slapped it onto the newest "N" models.

Well, I sure hope this is true, as that vintage "S" is on the way to me.
That would mean it has a 180 degree focus ring, instead of the "N"'s 100 degree ring. No idea about optical quality, though the new lens isn't exactly expensive at $650. Fingers crossed that the old ones are superior.

I also have an "N" version coming, so at least I can compare those two samples.

Also note: There is an even bigger difference between the 80/2.8 "C" and "N" - enough to assume that there is a mechanical difference in the optical path.

55/2.8 comparison:

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Edited on Aug 23, 2009 at 04:43 AM · View previous versions

Aug 23, 2009 at 01:35 AM

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p.2 #10 · Mamiya 80mm 645 options

Regarding the N/L versions possibly being superior:

Mamiya specifically states that the 55/2.8 N/L is optically identical to the non-leaf version. Yet, the 55/2.8 N'l has a larger filter size than the 55/2.8 non-leaf: 67mm vs 58mm

Perhaps that's just to accomodate the barrel, but maybe the front element is larger, requiring more careful polishing?

Aug 23, 2009 at 01:39 AM

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