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Lil Judd Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... I'm looking into getting a super long lens. I love to shoot wildlife & especially birds. My shooting style calls for a zoom - - primes just don't work for me. I'm hoping to do BIF & that means I have to be able to zoom in after acquiring my target. I can easily get myself to 500mm at this time & it's not long enough, so please no recommendation for lenses shorter than 500mm. What I'm looking for is the people who've bought this lens & still have it. Most reviews are more than one year old. How many do still have it & like it. I know it's huge & weights a lot. I have the support for it & know I'll need to lift weights to keep up with it. Does anyone still have it & how do you like it. Are you willing to post some shots for me to look at? Thank you for your time... Lil Feb 12, 2008 at 01:36 AM

Imagemaster Online Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... I am sure there are exceptions, but for the most part, I would say it is an extremely poor choice for BIF. Even with proper support it will be difficult tracking most birds, and the ability to zoom in after acquiring your target would be even more difficult. It is always nice to have more reach, but the longer the focal length, the more awkward it is to use the lens. Good luck, Tony Feb 12, 2008 at 02:57 AM

Lil Judd Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Thanks Tony. I had a chance to try it out the other day & though I didn't even attempt BIF - - I watched the owner do them. He's had it for a while though. I have a feeling more slow moving subjects is where I'll start..... Lil Feb 12, 2008 at 03:25 AM

Ted ellis Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil Judd wrote: I'm looking into getting a super long lens. I love to shoot wildlife & especially birds. My shooting style calls for a zoom - - primes just don't work for me. I'm hoping to do BIF & that means I have to be able to zoom in after acquiring my target. I can easily get myself to 500mm at this time & it's not long enough, so please no recommendation for lenses shorter than 500mm. What I'm looking for is the people who've bought this lens & still have it. Most reviews are more than one year old. How many do still have it & like it. I know it's huge & weights a lot. I have the support for it & know I'll need to lift weights to keep up with it. Does anyone still have it & how do you like it. Are you willing to post some shots for me to look at? Thank you for your time... Lil Lil.........In my opinion a prime is far superior to a zoom on this matter. Ted Feb 12, 2008 at 03:38 AM

Karl Witt Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Hi Lil Since you are at 500mm and familar with that lens, why not try out a 1.4x converter. I would tend to agree that too much lens to handle in bulk will not allow you the nimbleness to properly pan and shoot. Also you are going to be quite f/stop limited which will force up the ISO's and down the workable shutter speeds needed. I think the 500mm range with IS seem to be producing some stellar shots in the hands of those quite experienced. I do find it quite amazing how 400-500mm does not make a little bird big in the viewfinder though, guess I'll keep working on getting closer and closer, could be quite a $ savings for me! Take care Karl Feb 12, 2008 at 03:56 AM

Jude Perera Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil here is what I think. The wildlife photographers always finds their lenses are not long enough for their subjects. I think it is a fact. When you are considering a lens the following important points also must not be ignored. • The sharpness of the lens – If your lens is sharp enough and if you could obtain a 100% proper focus you could obtain a very sharp crop image. If the crop image ends up with 4-6 MPs after a tight crop from a 10MP sensor, the final results would be as good as from an un-crop image. • Focusing speed – Very important for BIF images as well as other subjects. • Low light capabilities – a minimum of F4 aperture is a great plus. Also if you have IS or VR you will have more opportunity to capture more subjects in slower shutter speeds in difficult lighting situations. Don’t forget most of the birds and animals could be spotted during early or late hours of a day. • Size and the weight – You must be able to carry your gear easily. Especially when you are spotting something you cannot always use a tripod. I always take my tripod, monopod and car-window mount in my vehicle but never use any of them. Sigma 300-800is not a very sharp lens according to most of the reviews. But I have seen some very good photograph of Sigma 300-800. Maybe if you are a very capable photographer and if you have high PP skills this lens may work for you. Try to get hold of a lens for rent before making a decision. Jude Feb 12, 2008 at 04:16 AM

alameda Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... You said you wanted to do flight shots. I suggest you check out this site and others for the some of the best in flight shooters and see what they are using. I believe you will find that most don't use zooms and 500 is about the max. Some of the most amazing shots were done with a 400 that allowed the shooter to fix focus and track the subjects. The other item is practice and more practice. Sorry for the recommendation you didn't what. Steve W Feb 12, 2008 at 04:33 AM

Lil Judd Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Karl Witt wrote: Hi Lil Since you are at 500mm and familar with that lens, why not try out a 1.4x converter. I would tend to agree that too much lens to handle in bulk will not allow you the nimbleness to properly pan and shoot. Also you are going to be quite f/stop limited which will force up the ISO's and down the workable shutter speeds needed. I think the 500mm range with IS seem to be producing some stellar shots in the hands of those quite experienced. I do find it quite amazing how 400-500mm does not make a little bird big in the viewfinder though, guess I'll keep working on getting closer and closer, could be quite a $ savings for me! Take care Karl Thanks for voicing in Karl. I'm using a 300mm with a TC 1.7 to take me to 500mm - - I don't want to double up nor go to a 2x TC. And in any work like this I'm always ready to bump ISO for shutter speed... I know - - how is it that 500mm is not enough!! Thanks for giving me your opinion - - it does give me something to think about.... & maybe save or not - some money. Lil Feb 12, 2008 at 04:57 AM

Lil Judd Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Ted ellis wrote: Lil.........In my opinion a prime is far superior to a zoom on this matter. Ted Thanks Ted.... I just don't seem to do well with long primes.... But I'll keep your comment as something to consider.... Lil Feb 12, 2008 at 04:59 AM

Lil Judd Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Jude Perera wrote: Lil here is what I think. The wildlife photographers always finds their lenses are not long enough for their subjects. I think it is a fact. When you are considering a lens the following important points also must not be ignored. • The sharpness of the lens – If your lens is sharp enough and if you could obtain a 100% proper focus you could obtain a very sharp crop image. If the crop image ends up with 4-6 MPs after a tight crop from a 10MP sensor, the final results would be as good as from an un-crop image. • Focusing speed – Very important for BIF images as well as other subjects. • Low light capabilities – a minimum of F4 aperture is a great plus. Also if you have IS or VR you will have more opportunity to capture more subjects in slower shutter speeds in difficult lighting situations. Don’t forget most of the birds and animals could be spotted during early or late hours of a day. • Size and the weight – You must be able to carry your gear easily. Especially when you are spotting something you cannot always use a tripod. I always take my tripod, monopod and car-window mount in my vehicle but never use any of them. Sigma 300-800is not a very sharp lens according to most of the reviews. But I have seen some very good photograph of Sigma 300-800. Maybe if you are a very capable photographer and if you have high PP skills this lens may work for you. Try to get hold of a lens for rent before making a decision. Jude Hi Jude, this is a very thought through reply & I thank you for your time & effort. You're so right - - nothing is long enough (for me) as far back as I can remember all I've wanted is long lenses. Could not care less for wide angles. Sharpness - - you're right. Has to be sharp. Focus speed - - well, I'm slow to focus so I don't worry about the lens being slow. Low Light - - knowing myself as I do, this is not really an issue. I know it sounds strange, but believe me - - it's true. Size & weight - - yes, this has been something I've been thinking about. But even when my husband read & calculated the weight with camera/tripod/Wimberley Gimbal my husband didn't even react. He knows how strong I am. I almost always work off a tripod. I can handhold, but prefer tripod work. I have a monopod - - never used it - - yet. Jude I did get to shoot with it Saturday for a while. I held the lens, granted not attached to the camera nor tripod.... But I did shoot with it. I don't expect miracles, but..... Also, I've read a lot of positive reviews of this lens. I must have visited the wrong reviews...... I'll do some more research.... Thanks for input. Lil Feb 12, 2008 at 05:12 AM

Lil Judd Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... alameda wrote: You said you wanted to do flight shots. I suggest you check out this site and others for the some of the best in flight shooters and see what they are using. I believe you will find that most don't use zooms and 500 is about the max. Some of the most amazing shots were done with a 400 that allowed the shooter to fix focus and track the subjects. The other item is practice and more practice. Sorry for the recommendation you didn't what. Steve W Steve, I posted here for several reasons. One is simply - - you guys have experience. I listed to people with experience. I wanted feedback & I'm getting it. There's something to be said for the voice of reason after all. No, don't feel bad. I do appreciate your feedback. This is what I need to hear - - if I wish to hear it or not - - is not the issue. I do need to hear it. That's all there is to it. Lil Feb 12, 2008 at 05:16 AM

Chris Maccubbi Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil: For my 2cents... I was just in the same position as you. After reading and research I was leaning toward the Sigma. Then I met with a camera club at Conowingo dam to shoot eagles. The guys there were some of the best photo people I ever met. I shot a Canon 400 2.8, 500 4.0, 500 4.5, and 600 4.0 and the big Sigma. After shooting probably 30 grand worth of glass and post processing, I bought a Canon 500 later that same week. It's not the Sigma was bad, but for "me" the 500 was the best fit. After 6 months, I do not regret my choice. Good luck in your search. -Chris Nice website by the way! Very touching. Feb 12, 2008 at 12:17 PM

anthony whitmo Online Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil, I guess my opinion is a little different. I was in the same boat about 4 months ago. I was debating between the 500 IS , 600 IS, Sigmonster. The opinions posted here always lean toward the 500 IS. Reasons : For the 500 Lighter Excellent IQ Easily portable Handholdable for some. Others claim it's too heavy to handhold 600 Cons were that it was just to heavy and not hand holdable for BIF 800 Sigmonster > No IS, not hand holdable, RESALE WILL KILL YOU as you won't get what you paid for it unless you find a real bargain (WHich is even harder to come by) I've been trying to find a bargain Sigmonster for 6 months and haven't found one yet. After having a 500 now for 3 months plus I can tell you this.............. I ALWAYS have a 1.4x or a 2x on my 500 AT ALL TIMES In good light I hand hold the 500 WITH the 2x with a focal Length of 1000mm Of course if you have birds that are close you won't need that much reach. My keeper rate isn't 100% ... Heck it's probably 40% or maybe a little less... But I'm hand holding 1000mm. I've only been experimenting with this for about a month but I'm getting much better at finding my target and IQ is good. It takes lots and lots and lots of practice. I still have lots of practicing to do But I most definately see an improvement each time I go out....... Example: Mark III, 500 IS, 2x extender = 1000mm I have some Raptors from this past weekend at 1000mm handheld but have not processed them yet. My first run through they looked good but have not pixel peeped yet. the 500 is a very versatile lens and holds up well to extenders. After waiting a month plus for the new 800mm IS to come out I think i've decided to go for the 600 IS for awhile >> Sounds like the 800mm will be over 11 Grand. The resale value of the 500 and 600 IS is Great. If you buy used you can pretty much get back what you bought it for. If you buy the 500 now you can always sell and get a 600 later >> Or Vise Versa. If you buy new you will of course take a bigger hit on resale........................ I say go for the 600 first >> If it's to much sell and move down.... I wish I had gone for the 600 first....... But that was my choice............. Good luck with your decision and we'll look forward to your first post with a new toy. Feb 12, 2008 at 02:25 PM

Ted ellis Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil Judd wrote: Ted ellis wrote: Lil.........In my opinion a prime is far superior to a zoom on this matter. Ted Thanks Ted.... I just don't seem to do well with long primes.... But I'll keep your comment as something to consider.... Lil Hi lil. My swans and hawk shots last two week were all with the 300mm and the 1.4 tc, I shot all my eagle shots with the 100-400 and never once zoomed out. I justed wanted to echo the other wise photographers. Lastly birds in flight, practice, practice and more practice. Ted Feb 12, 2008 at 03:06 PM

thehotel Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Hi Lil, another opinion. I find the 500 with a 1.4 converter to work best for me. I use a BushHawk 100% of the time and I find it makes in flight shots at least 5 times easier for me. What ever you decide best of luck and like every one has said it is a matter of practice. Wacky roger Feb 12, 2008 at 03:13 PM

Tim Kuhn Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil, for what it is worth I would have to cast another vote for a prime. Which prime is dependent on your wallet. I would have to really push you to try a bushhawk, I absolutely love mine. Tim Feb 12, 2008 at 04:51 PM

Imagemaster Online Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Jude Perera wrote: Sigma 300-800is not a very sharp lens according to most of the reviews. Jude, I don't know what reviews you are reading. If you check the reviews on this site, you will find the majority of owners consider it extremely sharp and as good as an "L" lens. http://www.fredmiranda.com/reviews/showproduct.php?product=106&sort=7&cat=37&page=2 "I own a good number of L lenses for my Canon digital bodies and I can truthfully say that this is the sharpest (with the possible exception of my 200/1.8) lens in my arsenal." etc., etc., etc. Lil, be sure and check out Liquidstone's review and visit the links he has posted. Tony Feb 12, 2008 at 05:01 PM

anthony whitmo Online Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... If you look through his history of shots (And man there are a lot of them) Most of his BIF shots are with a 500 IS + 1.4x OR a 400 f/5.6 ... I'm sure there are some BIF with the sigmonster somewhere but everything I looked at were with a White lens. Not to say it can't be done > But for long focal lengths IS Helps. http://www.pbase.com/liquidstone/best_fliers&page=1 Here's a link to liquidstones web page................ A lot of good Sigmonster info and comparisons. Feb 12, 2008 at 05:12 PM

lbuscher Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Lil Tony is right as for the zooming part; you just never have the time. OK I have both the Canon 500/4 and the Sigma 800MM 5.6 HSM EX (No zoom) in my opinion a zoom of this size is a waste of time for BIF but OK for filling a frame when your to close to a stationary subject. Here is a squirrel I am following for the F&W here in Ma. and both taken with the 800 off a tripod with my 1dm2n. The sharpness is there, as I have owned two of these lenses. As for BIF it’s a bit tougher as you must shoot with a tripod and tracking with a tripod is always harder but I still have many eagle photos that I have taken with the 800 off of my converted surveyors tripod made from hard maple. I have also laid my 800 on the roof of my wagon in a blanket and took still nest subjects with a 20D on it and had one used for a magazine story on the nesting pair. Anthony also brought up a good point and that being plan on keeping it, as you will never get your money back like you would for a Nikon or Canon glass but I still use mine in a lot of situations, as I don’t need to add any TEs. Remember one other thing and that being on a hot hazy day the power can be a problem as the lens will pick up a lot of junk in the air the same as a scope. I think it’s a good glass for the money as long as you have a use for it. Lou Feb 12, 2008 at 06:24 PM

lbuscher Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... 2 Both these photos were FF and at 12 X 18 Feb 12, 2008 at 06:24 PM

Imagemaster Online Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... anthony whitmo wrote: If you look through his history of shots (And man there are a lot of them) Most of his BIF shots are with a 500 IS + 1.4x OR a 400 f/5.6 ... I'm sure there are some BIF with the sigmonster somewhere but everything I looked at were with a White lens. I am aware of that. My posting was specifically in reply to: Sigma 300-800is not a very sharp lens according to most of the reviews. The longer the lens, the more impractical it becomes for BIF, with or without IS. Feb 12, 2008 at 06:30 PM

lbuscher Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... PS Even Canons Chuck Westfall will tell you avoid TEs for better photos. Also if you have good eyes try sticking a 2X on that 800 and a shutter releae and the mirror locked up. I don't do it often but I have for nest photod from about 6 to 700 feet and if I get the focus right they are awsome.But also lucky BTW B&H has a used Canon 1200 5.6 used for sale. $99,000.00 rated at a 9 Lou Feb 12, 2008 at 06:36 PM

lbuscher Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... Beging your pardon you all as I did take the first squirrel with my Canon 500 and no TE. Lou Feb 12, 2008 at 06:45 PM

bias_hjorth Offline Image Upload: Off Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... As far I remember the 300-800 has no focus limit lock - That could be an issue. liquidstone is using this lens (http://www.pbase.com/liquidstone/ ) for examples Feb 12, 2008 at 09:17 PM

Ted ellis Offline Image Upload: On Calling out to any Sigma 300-800 Wildlife photographers out there.... lbuscher wrote: PS Even Canons Chuck Westfall will tell you avoid TEs for better photos. Also if you have good eyes try sticking a 2X on that 800 and a shutter releae and the mirror locked up. I don't do it often but I have for nest photod from about 6 to 700 feet and if I get the focus right they are awsome.But also lucky BTW B&H has a used Canon 1200 5.6 used for sale. $99,000.00 rated at a 9 Lou Hell Lou.......I'll buy it. Ken, Cris want to chip in Ted Feb 12, 2008 at 09:44 PM

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