mrladewig
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 p.3 #6 · The BEST Carbon Fiber Tripod | |
Wow, talk about a topic that has derailed. Everybody agrees that Gitzo makes the very best tripods.
I wasn't suggesting that quality comes without a premium or that you can buy the same quality stuff a K-Mart as at Nordstrom as Thomas suggested. In fact, I don't think I've seen a single carbon fiber tripod at K-Mart, but I'm sure its just a matter of time. And I certainly haven't accused anyone of being foolish for buying a Gitzo nor have I accused Gitzo of price gouging. I don't think any of these are the case. But I also don't believe that Gitzo walks on water or that it is the only company that can build a competent durable tripod.
As John pointed out, pricing is meant to get maximum profit from your product and outside the commodity markets is usually tied to intangible factors some of which may be out of the control of your company and some of which are driven by brand or image. People often have the perception that the expensive product from a prestigious brand will be the better product even if empirical evidence shows that there are problems with the item. Sony is a good example of this brand loyalty trend. Likewise, people place a value on style or fashion or appearance.
In many industries, there are several manufacturers who create equivalent products, even at the highest quality level. John made a point about buying cheap offshore boating clothes. Perhaps in boating there is only one company who makes a decent slicker and everything else is cheap garbage. This isn't the case in many industries.
I don't know boating very well, but I do know mountaineering. In this field, Marmot, North Face, Mountain Hardware, Patagonia and probably a couple others like Lowe fill the very top quality levels in clothing. I own mountaineering clothing from all of these manufacturers, not the cheap stuff. With the years of experience that I have gained climbing and spending time in the outdoors, I can say that they all create equivalent levels of quality and functionality. All of them offer lifetime warranty on the workmanship and against material defects and all of them wear out eventually. Of those four, Patagonia used to charge a premium for an equivalent item. The other three were always pretty evenly priced. I have no idea what the reason was for a higher price on the Patagonia items. Perhaps they do not manufacture their goods in China as Marmot, North Face and Mountain Hardware now do. Patagonia does not have a better Gore-Tex or a better polymer fleece or a better 40d nylon shell material or better stitching. They had a brand with better recognition and prestige.
I am suggesting that the same may be the case with Gitzo versus other established tripod manufacturers. I refuse to put Feisol, Benro/Induro into the class of established tripod manufacturers. I see them as Chinese knockoffs, as do you. But Manfotto certainly has a long heritage of tripods in professional use and Velbon has been making tripods for 40 years and make tripods of their own design in Japan and Taiwan (in full disclosure, they have recently added a Chinese facility).
Also, I had seen your testing John. As I recall, there was no other test sample for comparison and no measurement of movement at the floor or on the tripod. You have confirmed that you can jump around next to your Gitzo on a wood floor and it will not result in perceptible vibration at the film plane. Did you prove that you cannot jump up and down next to a mid-priced or low priced carbon model, or even an aluminum model? Wood is arguably the best tripod material for vibration absorption, but this wasn't tested either (wood tripods are often quite expensive too). Did you measure the vibration at the head with any type of instrument and have a baseline of what would be acceptable and what would not? Unless the company is testing according to ISO or ASTM standards, they are generally "testing" for marketing reasons. We know that there are not standards in the tripod/head industry because we know that all of the manufacturers are using load ratings that do not compare evenly.
John also stated that Gitzo must have thought very carefully about the fiber layup so that the tripod could support the average American male. I have to argue this to the contrary as well. 10 years ago I was riding a Trek carbon fiber road bike. I could easily sit across the top tube of this bike without the tube shattering and it was a fairly early and crude carbon fiber design (the bike was probably 5 years old when I bought it). That bike was significantly lighter than an aluminum equivalent of the time. I am absolutely certain that the Gitzo tubes are far stronger than would be needed to meet the design spec and as I said before, the leg locks have been the weak link.
I didn't buy my Velbon on price alone and I didn't buy it to prove every Gitzo owner wrong. I bought it because it met my needs and because a landscape photographer who I know has been using a Velbon El Carmagne for a decade in conditions similar to what mine will see. Snow, sand, below zero F temps, occasional bashing on rocks in slot canyons, desert heat, submersion in water, rough and dusty rides in the back of a jeep, occasional use as a walking stick, tropical humidity and occasional salt water exposure. These are what his has seen, what my Bogen 3021 has seen and what my Velbon will see. I would say that I put my gear through demanding conditions just as many others here do and I have no doubt that it will survive.
I would say that the opportunity for failure is similar in all three brands and that it is low. In fact I would say that the aluminum Bogen 3021 has the least chance of catastrophic failure because the aluminum tubes can bend, not shatter if something heavy landed on them. From this point of view, I don't see any increased risk in using the mid-priced tripod versus the Gitzo. All of them are designed so that they can be torn down, cleaned and repaired. Considering that parts availability for Bogen/Gitzo is limited (as in almost non-existent) in Denver and completely non-existent in Colorado Springs (a city of 400,000), I would say for any remote travel, if your tripod should break you will be up a creek regardless of the brand. You better have a backup or have spare parts in advance.
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