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dhlewis
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p.1 #1 · L Brackets

trekking in unknown territory. Are there any significant differences between the Kirt and RRS brands when it comes to L brackets? Is one better than the other? Is one brand better than the other when you start to purchase other components?

Thanks

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 01:30 AM

sjms
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p.1 #2 · L Brackets

not significant enough which then for some makes it difficult to choose.
its a matter of personal preference
they both do the same thing just sometimes in slightly different ways.
i prefer the RRS approach which in my opinion is somewhat better thought out and more refined in the finished product. both are finished well and will do the job they were designed to do.

as an example of the differences of approach
the 1D3 and 1Ds3 have available a wifi unit that attaches to the left side of the camera body. if you wish to use said unit with an L plate here are you choices

from RRS there is a single L plate that can be easily adjusted for use with or without the unit with 1 hex screw. cost $183

from Kirk due to its basic highly skeletonized design they needed to design 2 seperate plates to do the job with and without the unit attached. cost $185ea x 2 if you to have it both ways.

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 01:55 AM

MSC
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p.1 #3 · L Brackets

I don't think there any real difference. Personally I like Kirk brackets because they seem to use less metal, but this is not a product that requires much in the way of complicated design.

Now I will say this, the RRS bracket for the Mk3 is not well designed. I will sell mine if you want it...just have not gotten around to putting it on the B&S board. The vertical section of the bracket sticks WAY out behind the back of the camera and ruins holding the camera. Now I do not yet have the Kirk but in looking carefully at the website, it seems to be much more flush.

As for other products, this is not one that matters. You can mix and match. There seems to be an issue with RRS level clamps...which you read about on their website, no need to repeat it here. I personally have Wimberley, Kirk and RRS products and have no problems switching any of them out. But then again I don't like lever clamps.

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 02:48 AM

surly
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p.1 #4 · L Brackets

I think the RRS had a good idea that appears poorly executed:

Kirk

Having said that RRS has been great with me over emails and I have to call Kirk. They haven't answered one of my emails in years.

I have the RRS wedding flash bracket and I think its very nice. I think the finish on the Kirk stuff I have is great and I like the design better from an aesthetic point of view.I have owned 4 of their brackets, three QR plates and a ball head. Next ball head will probably be RRS (I want a big one)

I think you will like either

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 02:52 AM

MSC
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p.1 #5 · L Brackets

Good info, this confirms the design issue mentioned. Agree with Kirk, for some reason, they don't like email...but you know, it is so nice to actually talk to a human it seems OK to me!

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 02:58 AM

sjms
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p.1 #6 · L Brackets

poorly executed in what way? i have used it with the wifi unit and without and it functions as it should.
i take you have used it? or are we looking and assuming?

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:00 AM

sjms
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p.1 #7 · L Brackets

Shane Canfield wrote:
I don't think there any real difference. Personally I like Kirk brackets because they seem to use less metal, but this is not a product that requires much in the way of complicated design.

Now I will say this, the RRS bracket for the Mk3 is not well designed. I will sell mine if you want it...just have not gotten around to putting it on the B&S board. The vertical section of the bracket sticks WAY out behind the back of the camera and ruins holding the camera. Now I do not yet have the Kirk but in looking carefully at the website, it seems to be much more flush.

As for other products, this is not one that matters. You can mix and match. There seems to be an issue with RRS level clamps...which you read about on their website, no need to repeat it here. I personally have Wimberley, Kirk and RRS products and have no problems switching any of them out. But then again I don't like lever clamps.

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:06 AM

surly
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p.1 #8 · L Brackets

We? You got a mouse in your pocket?

Its my opinion that it looks great without the wifi unit attached and kludgey with it attached. I think its mostly because of that corner. I don't debate that it still works.

Mind you, I don't think buying an extra bracket is a great solution either. I am giving it some though. Really Surly Stuff coming right up.

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:16 AM

MSC
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p.1 #9 · L Brackets

sjms wrote:
Shane Canfield wrote:
I don't think there any real difference. Personally I like Kirk brackets because they seem to use less metal, but this is not a product that requires much in the way of complicated design.

Now I will say this, the RRS bracket for the Mk3 is not well designed. I will sell mine if you want it...just have not gotten around to putting it on the B&S board. The vertical section of the bracket sticks WAY out behind the back of the camera and ruins holding the camera. Now I do not yet have the Kirk but in looking carefully at the website, it seems to be much more flush.

As for other products, this is not one that matters. You can mix and match. There seems to be an issue with RRS level clamps...which you read about on their website, no need to repeat it here. I personally have Wimberley, Kirk and RRS products and have no problems switching any of them out. But then again I don't like lever clamps.

you will find the the location of the side plate is approx a little over a 0.25" further back so you have access to the most used i/o ports on the camera when it is flat against the camera. as a generality i don't handle the camera with my left hand as much as i do the lens. not an issue.
as to the less metal statement well weight wise there again within a gram or two. so much for that.
see i'll accept the minor compromises so that i only need 1 plate to do the job

The bracket sticks way out behind the camera...no other backet I have ever used does this and IMO, it is a poor design. I have not measured it but really don't care how far it is...it feels terrible in the hand. For as much money as RRS charges, I expect more.

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:23 AM

dhlewis
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p.1 #10 · L Brackets

glad I was able to give you guys a place to "talk" things over re RSS v. Kirk. In the interim you all helped me a great deal. Thanks a bunch!

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:28 AM

sjms
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p.1 #11 · L Brackets

as to the lever lock that is a leverlock issue in that it has an max open dimension and a max closed dimension. they are two fixed points. in order to work correctly the plate width must be within a specified dimension. both RRS and Wimberly use that dimension. all they say is that theirs does but won't guarentee that any one else prescribes to their dimension. everyone in the past has just about done whatever they wanted because of the forgiving nature of the screw type lock (essentially a vise type lock. its real simple if you want to use the lever lock just make sure it fits the dimension designed to work with the lever if not don't go there.

Edited by sjms on Nov 09, 2007 at 10:33 PM GMT

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:30 AM

MSC
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p.1 #12 · L Brackets

dhlewis wrote:
glad I was able to give you guys a place to "talk" things over re RSS v. Kirk. In the interim you all helped me a great deal. Thanks a bunch!

Yeah, this is kind of religious war...who knows why.

Anyway, in the end, these products are so close that you can't go wrong with either.

But I'm working on a portfolio and helping the boredom of endless PC work by hanging here on FM inbetween resizing and labeling shots. So it is a nice distraction.

And even when it gets feisty, there is good info here.

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:31 AM

MSC
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p.1 #13 · L Brackets

Steve, I don't get the comment about '2 brackets" what does that mean?

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:32 AM

surly
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p.1 #14 · L Brackets

dhlewis wrote:
glad I was able to give you guys a place to "talk" things over re RSS v. Kirk. In the interim you all helped me a great deal. Thanks a bunch!

Now lets get you a new computer

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:32 AM

surly
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p.1 #15 · L Brackets

Shane Canfield wrote:
Steve, I don't get the comment about '2 brackets" what does that mean?

I think he was refering to the fact that the RRS bracket slides over to fit the wifi unit. Kirks solution is to own two different brackets

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:34 AM

dhlewis
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p.1 #16 · L Brackets

surly wrote:
dhlewis wrote:
glad I was able to give you guys a place to "talk" things over re RSS v. Kirk. In the interim you all helped me a great deal. Thanks a bunch!

Now lets get you a new computer

well if you have any banged up, dirty, ugly Kirt or RRS pieces and parts stuff laying around send it my way

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:38 AM

sjms
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p.1 #17 · L Brackets

Shane Canfield wrote:
Steve, I don't get the comment about '2 brackets" what does that mean?

with the kirk you get 2 choices
a L bracket that works with the camera only NO wifi. fixed position no option to adjust for fitting the wifi unit

or you get the one that does work with the wifi unit and hangs out the rest of the time about an inch of clear air fixed position when the unit is not attached. in short the the wifi version if you remove the wifi unit there is no adjustment to bring L arm back close to the camera body

that makes two complete seperate brackets to do the job of one

the reason that is is the kirk base skeletonization makes no material available for design of adjustment capability.

Edited by sjms on Nov 09, 2007 at 10:41 PM GMT

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:39 AM

MSC
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p.1 #18 · L Brackets

OK, that sounds weird...I'm going to check it out...

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:40 AM

sjms
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p.1 #19 · L Brackets

show and tell
wifi version

This image is copyrighted by the owner

no wifi version

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:44 AM

MSC
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p.1 #20 · L Brackets

OK, I see that now...I don't want to buy two brackets. Good info. Now does the Kirk that takes the transmitter stick way out in the back too? If it does, then it is no better than the RRS. Also it does not look like it slides so you can use it either way? Hmmm, if both of these are true, better off with RRS then...

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:46 AM

sjms
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p.1 #21 · L Brackets

where the RRS fails is access to the i/o ports on the wifi unit.
this is basically for a hard wire to ethernet and a USB 2.0 port for GPS input

my feeling about that is

its not as elegent as the kirk but you can access the usb 2 port on the unit but forget the ethernet port. but then again it is wifi

Edited by sjms on Nov 10, 2007 at 08:13 AM GMT

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:55 AM

sjms
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p.1 #22 · L Brackets

Shane Canfield wrote:
OK, I see that now...I don't want to buy two brackets. Good info. Now does the Kirk that takes the transmitter stick way out in the back too? If it does, then it is no better than the RRS. Also it does not look like it slides so you can use it either way? Hmmm, if both of these are true, better off with RRS then...

the kirk NON wifi model is further fwd by about 1/8" making if just hanging out a bit less vs the RRS which is in position approx 1/4" back in the breeze
the kirk wifi model is approx the same as the RRS in it positioning but is approx 1/2" higher in position to fit over the wifi unit itself.
neither the Kirk cannot be adjusted as they are fixed position plates

Edited by sjms on Nov 10, 2007 at 08:18 AM GMT

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 03:57 AM

MSC
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p.1 #23 · L Brackets

Good info, thanks for the education...RRS stays then.

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 04:07 AM

sjms
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p.1 #24 · L Brackets

everything is a compromise. it just what are you willing to give and take?

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 04:07 AM

Lars Johnsson
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p.1 #25 · L Brackets

Do you know if these L-plates (both RRS and Kirk) will work together with the 1Dsmk3 also ?

Edited on Nov 13, 2007 at 07:47 PM

Nov 10, 2007 at 07:51 AM


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