1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

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jonbrach
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p.4 #1 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

damn thing doesn't cook my dinner

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 15, 2007 at 01:51 AM

jvvjvv
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p.4 #2 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

A lot of this ...........(as stated by others) .......is JUST personal preferences. I owned a multi, multi brand motorcycle shop years ago. The opinions of which bike features were best/worst varied greatly. As with most anything. I had my MKII for 2+ years with 166K clicks on it. I have had the MKIII for about 2 months and have not used the II till last week. The III handles way, way better and produces better images. The II felt very clunky......(IMHO).....the III is a dream to use. I just received my 2nd III yesterday and the II is for sale.

Having the + button fire up the display would be a winner!!!

Just my $.002.

One question...............what/where is the "set" button?

Jack

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 15, 2007 at 04:42 AM

Normcar21
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p.4 #3 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

Everyone has their ideal camera and sending "lists" to Canon to me simply confuses the issue if the lists are like this one, because the list is simply too subjective, and subjective specifically to individual tastes. If you took the time to think about it, what an exhaustive and impossible task it would be to make the masses happy. Canon has created a product that is somewhat confusing because the inherent potential of the camera is way, way beyond any idea of grab and shoot. Even the pros I'm sure have picked up this camera and thought that it was going to be a breeze working it out, since they were familiar with the series 1. Well, I now own one and have owned a Mark II for years, I was one of the first batch of owners of that camera. My first impressions of the Mark III is this...work slowly, carefully, and understand every freaking jot and tittle of what you do with this camera, because it is not a "light" upgrade, it is an entirely new dimension.

I personally believe that "part" of the issue relates to those who have neglected to understand the above.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 15, 2007 at 05:01 AM

brainiac
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p.4 #4 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

How could enabling an OPTION for joystick focus point selection 'confuse an issue'? Are there people who have an individual taste for camera parts which fall off? If there are, should Canon try to keep them happy? Normcar, like I said, why don't you go and discuss the camera on the successes thread or the main 1D3 thread?

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 16, 2007 at 10:04 PM

Valerie S
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p.4 #5 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

brainiac wrote:
Normcar, like I said, why don't you go and discuss the camera on the successes thread or the main 1D3 thread?

Isn't this an open forum?

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 17, 2007 at 01:39 AM

brainiac
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p.4 #6 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

Yes Valerie, it's absolutely open. However, it's good manners to keep a thread on topic, like you have. In this case on-topic means discussing problems found with the camera, personally, even if you are not a member of some scientific board of enquiry. When there are omissions as serious as joystick focus point selection, we needn't be told that we have 'neglected to understand' our cameras.

Speak up everyone, and keep the problems coming in, even if you aren't sure if you have misunderstood your camera, because there are lots of good ideas and helpful people here.

I will certainly be mentioning to Canon the complaints of others. The more of us that complain, the more likely it is that improvements will appear in the next generation. I hope others will complain about things they don't like too. It is a $4500 camera, let's not forget. We have a right to make suggestions.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 17, 2007 at 09:35 AM

bcaslis
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p.4 #7 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

I've read these forums for a long time, but haven't posted much. But I have to say that I find this whole thread very strange. The title says it's for problems. But most of the "problems" I see posted are very very much just personal preferences. I don't mean to offend but I find I have to disagree with virtually every point that brainiac has posted. The one thing I do want is the joystick to be able to select focus points. And the LCD on the 1D3 is the best I've seen on any camera I've held. It certainly not "yellow" by any stretch of the imagination.

I would have no problem if this thread was about "suggested improvements". But it's way off base as a list of "problems".

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 17, 2007 at 06:12 PM

gbee
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p.4 #8 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

Succinct point. I was not a fan of the double push buttons, but their replacements have added treble single push instead and IMO not enhanced the camera as much as I’d have expected

stanj wrote:
The dual action buttons on the 1-series so far (press & hold button while twiddling wheel) were all fine and good, and always touted as a pro feature. And I agreed. Now they are gone, for ease of use as they say, (a) without an option to work the old way and be indeed error proof, and (b) without having gained any of the Nikon simplicity..

Edited by Jeff on Sep 17, 2007 at 01:24 PM GMT (Reason: quote tags for clarity)

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 17, 2007 at 06:19 PM

Valerie S
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p.4 #9 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

I agree with Jeff and bcaslis regarding most of these listed as personal preferences, rather than bona fide problems. They are not in the same realm as the Servo focus problems that a number are facing.

For example, on the topic of the joystick. I never found it to be accurate on my 30D to select an AF sensor and set my camera to use "the Big Wheel" for AF point selection. On the Mk III, I really like using it for switching back and forth between my last chosen AF point and my set "home" focus point. I love that.

My LCD was a bit yellow until I switched to a different Picture Style (Faithful), even though I shoot RAW exclusively. I would expect different styles to display different colorings or color casts. I don't see that as a "problem".

I don't believe that brianric's email alone, was the sole engine for changes that were made to the 5D, but I'd be disappointed if the joystick function was changed. Furthermore, I would hope Canon is putting all of their energies at this point to address the basic function complaints of some users rather than mess about with a relatively minute number of complaints about a color cast in one's Picture Style.

Excuse me while I post about a bunch of OOF shots using fast normal primes under Tungsten and mixed lighting.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 17, 2007 at 06:25 PM

Mfarbin
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p.4 #10 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

My view finder has a slight greenish cast when used in low tungsten light ie. strobe modeling lights. I am also annoyed by the complicated custom white balance setting function. I am not seeing yellow images on the LCD. Does anyone else notice the greenish cast in the finder?

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 17, 2007 at 09:58 PM

brainiac
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p.4 #11 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

My original post asks: "Apart from the AF issues, which I am unlikely to encounter, what are the things that could and should easily be changed by Canon in a revised version?" For me there is little difference between a problem and something which needs improving. Either way we are obstructed in our uses of the camera. I can see that the semantics are confusing, so I have changed the title of the thread to disambiguate. Hope that's OK.

I agree with Jeff and bcaslis regarding most of these listed as personal preferences, rather than bona fide problems. They are not in the same realm as the Servo focus problems that a number are facing.

They were not intended to be in the same realm. Of course joystick FP selection is a personal preference. I am not suggesting that Canon should disable the much loved method of pressing a button with your thumb and then scrolling on two different scroll dials with forefinger and aforementioned thumb. I am suggesting that those of us who like the intuitive method available on other Canon cameras like the 5D should have an option to use the existing joystick as a focus-point selector. I shot 4000 images at the weekend under difficult and rushed circumstances, and the absence of joystick FP control slowed me down and denied shots hundreds of times. I call that a problem.

I also call it a problem if features which used to exist and could easily exist get disabled, even if I personally don't need them. I have no idea what stanj's X-assist preference is about, but I have put it in the list here because it seems like that particular configuration should be an option and would make life easier for stanj without making life worse for me. With a camera this configurable there is no line in the sand between someone else's preferences and poor usability.

>...I really like using it for switching back and forth between my last chosen AF point and my set "home" focus point. I love that.

Great, and I hope Canon always gives you that option, even though I myself would never use it. I respect your personal preference and I think you would have a right to call it a problem if Canon removed your preferred method from the camera for no known reason even though the relevant controllers were there.

>My LCD was a bit yellow until I switched to a different Picture Style (Faithful), even though I shoot RAW exclusively. I would expect different styles to display different colorings or color casts. I don't see that as a "problem".

It is a huge problem because, while shooting, the monitor is the only way to judge how to make colour adjustments. It should not be accurate for some Styles and inaccurate for others, and frankly I don't believe it is.

>I don't believe that brianric's email alone, was the sole engine for changes that were made to the 5D

Nor do I. Each of us has only one tiny voice, but that doesn't mean that we shouldn't use it. Like Churchill said, "where democracy ends, there slavery begins". I hope that each of us will let Canon know about the things we do want changed in a 1D4. I am sure that helps to bring about a better camera. If Normcar wants to ask Canon NOT to introduce an OPTION to enable joystick focus-point selection, as he suggested, then he is free to do that. I hope more photographers ask for that option, and that Canon listens and solves the problem. Stanj can count on me to ask Canon for that feature he wants even though I don't need it myself.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 12:29 PM

brainiac
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p.4 #12 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

Does anyone else notice the greenish cast in the finder?

I certainly have, although I called it yellowy. You are right. It is greeny too. About six people on this thread have mentioned this so far, so clearly a number of cameras are afflicted by this. It is an especially disconcerting problem if you (have to) shoot JPEG because you have no indication while shooting that the skin tones you are capturing are anything like realistic. Like I said, a JPEG shooter mustn't use the camera screen for careful colour adjustment, or she will end up with way-off captures.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 01:01 PM

bcaslis
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p.4 #13 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

I would say the image in the viewfinder has a very slight greenish cast in certain light. But the viewfinder in a 5D has a slight reddish cast in the same light. I don't think I've ever seen a viewfinder that I'd call pure white. The tint is also less the faster the lens. With an f1.2 lens I can hardly see it.

Mfarbin wrote:
My view finder has a slight greenish cast when used in low tungsten light ie. strobe modeling lights. I am also annoyed by the complicated custom white balance setting function. I am not seeing yellow images on the LCD. Does anyone else notice the greenish cast in the finder?

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 02:29 PM

brainiac
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p.4 #14 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

The tint is also less the faster the lens. With an f1.2 lens I can hardly see it.

Forgive me for questioning this, but how on earth could a lens' maximum aperture affect colour cast on camera monitor? Can anyone confirm this remarkable idea? If it's true it needs investigation.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 03:16 PM

Mykal
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p.4 #15 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

Brainiac you are talking about the LCD Moniter on the back of the camera while they are talking about the viewfinder that you look through. Two completely different things.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 03:26 PM

Lars Johnsson
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p.4 #16 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

No UDMA support for compact flash cards

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 07:20 PM

Daniel K
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p.4 #17 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

I sometimes wonder what all this is about. I see no negatives in my cameras (with the one exception being about the slow write times for my ol 10D)

I guess my mentors always taught me its all about the user and not the camera. That the controls and features are for our convenience so learn your camera the best you can and deal with its pro's and con's. Cause what it all comes down to is still framing and pushing the button. Simple, no?

Stop complaining about it and go out and learn it and shoot! I love my mark 3 just as much as I love my 10D, XT, Mark2, Dsmark2, 30D, 5D, Leica dlux-3 and A710! Complaining about a slight greencast is kinda dated since they gave means to fix issues like this, no?

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 07:49 PM

bcaslis
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p.4 #18 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

brainiac wrote:
The tint is also less the faster the lens. With an f1.2 lens I can hardly see it.

Forgive me for questioning this, but how on earth could a lens' maximum aperture affect colour cast on camera monitor? Can anyone confirm this remarkable idea? If it's true it needs investigation.

Viewfinder, not LCD monitor. Faster lens means more light which looks more white.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 18, 2007 at 07:50 PM

brainiac
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p.4 #19 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

I am finding that compared to the AWB on the 5D, the 1D3 fails to cope with mad colour balances brought about by strange lights. I shoot events and sometimes there are a lot of gelled lamps/spots which change colour with time or from one table to the next. I can't find any setting on the 1D3 which copes with crazy coloured light well in an automatic way. I know it's a tough call, but the 5D has an uncanny ability to retain the atmosphere of coloured lighting while not blowing a channel out or going too crazy. Does anybody have any ideas why the 5D might be superior in this respect?

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 19, 2007 at 11:08 AM

brainiac
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p.4 #20 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

bcaslis wrote:
>>The tint is also less the faster the lens. With an f1.2 lens I can hardly see it.

brainiac wrote:
>...how on earth could a lens' maximum aperture affect colour cast on camera monitor?

Viewfinder, not LCD monitor. Faster lens means more light which looks more white.

Wow - thanks a lot. Sorry for not reading your post properly. I was indeed thinking of the monitor. You are absolutely right, and I hadn't yet noticed it. My viewfinder does indeed have a very slight green cast. I can't say that it is green enough to annoy though.

Edited by brainiac on Sep 20, 2007 at 02:29 PM GMT

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 20, 2007 at 08:17 AM

brainiac
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p.4 #21 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

After reading the thread below I think I would like an AI focus mode so that I don't have to keep switching between one-shot and servo:

http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/572567

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 20, 2007 at 10:24 AM

brainiac
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p.4 #22 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

>...I sometimes wonder what all this is about. I see no negatives in my cameras...
> ...I love my mark 3 just as much as I love my 10D, XT, Mark2, Dsmark2, 30D, 5D, Leica dlux-3 and A710!
>...its all about the user...learn your camera...deal with its pro's and con's...it all comes down to...framing and pushing the button...

...and I think you can be sure that Canon and Leica love you too. But just think of the money you could have saved by sticking with the camera in your phone! :)

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 20, 2007 at 02:46 PM

Daniel K
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p.4 #23 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

funny thing is that I actually liked the camera in this sumsung phone I had, but I hated the phone itself! And now that Im back to a motorola i dont use the feature anymore. ( I miss my nokia camera phone!

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 20, 2007 at 06:12 PM

brainiac
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p.4 #24 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

johnnydanger has started a thread about the absence of any equivalent to the 5D's C-mode: http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/573785

This got me thinking about why the 1D3 has been difficult to use in this regard. I shoot a lot of evening events in the dark. People are impatient, and I need to be able to switch to my standard flash setup very quickly. The genius of the 5D's C setting is that I can switch to it in the dark, by feel, without having to concentrate on submenu selections. It sets everything, but still allows me to go straight back to where I was before I invoked it, again, just by turning a physical click-dial. As soon as I turn the dial back to Av my previous colour balance, picture style, iso, shutter speed and aperture return. I can carry on where I left off.

The 1D3's 'Basic camera settings' does not include iso, as I have mentioned. It also requires fiddling about in the menus, and it loads surprisingly slowly. The settings are at least saved in camera, though, so if they included iso and most importantly had a physical switch on the camera to enable them by feel, then that would suffice.

The 'save settings to card' option is a non-starter as I shoot a lot of pictures, in a hurry, and every time I change cards the settings will be gone. I could save them on an SD card I suppose, but even then I still have to fiddle around in the menus to get them to load. But most annoyingly they overwrite current settings, so after keeping my victims waiting while I fiddle with my camera (loading saved settings), and using the new settings for a moment, I can not then return quickly to previous settings.

The 1D3's 3rd way of applying stored settings does allow you to return to previous settings, but requires holding down the * button, and does not include white balance, which is pretty crucial for flash, so that's a non-starter too.

Who will use this plethora of badly designed half-implemented features which don't fit well with how real photographers work? The 5D designers got it right. 1-series should have a C1, C2, and C3 mode, each exactly like the 5D's. Why was that software and interface not adopted in the 1-series?

This is analogical to the joystick focus point issue. With a joystick you can start moving the focus point to position before you have even brought the camera to your eye. You don't need to know where the FP is in order to put it where you want. The controls physically mimic the thing controlled, and that's intuitive. I accept that a better joystick would be an improvement, one which gave better force feedback, especially for the diagonal directions, but that, and legacy, are no reason to disable it.

I increasingly feel that this camera is crippled by a legacy of things done wrong which Canon hasn't got the guts to change for the better.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 22, 2007 at 07:45 PM

johnnydanger
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p.4 #25 · 1D3 shortcomings NOT AF

What the heck! I just got my sweet sweet new 1D Mk III and was all amped on the improved pro handling of the 1-series body. Lot's of things about it are nice, but I dare say that my 5D is at times more flexible to shoot with. Why is there no equivalent to the Register Camera Settings option on the 5D? It's so easy on the 5D (and the new 40D I might add), but on the 1D Mk III you have to go through the menu system to save and load settings, and there is no easy way to overwrite or delete camera settings. And to top it all off the settings are saved on the media card so if you change cards you lose the ability to use them.

On the 5D I can setup two different shooting settings on the 5D -- one without flash and set for shade, and one with flash and set for sun or whatever -- and easily switch back and forth between them with the twist of a knob. How can my new supposed pro 1-series body not be able to do that easily? Boggles the mind. I thought this thing was about speed and getting the shot at all cost, but it seems to have missed the boat in a couple places.

Any workarounds? Firmware updates? Anything? This is a bit of crutch for an otherwise superb camera.

Oh yeah and did I mention that it's a bit slow loading the settings on the 1D Mk III even when you get to the right menu? It's instant on the 5D with the twist of a knob... Grrr.

Edited on Oct 04, 2007 at 12:13 PM

Sep 23, 2007 at 12:18 AM


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