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stanj
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p.4 #1 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


snowboarder wrote:
Stan, can you tell me what Canon realistically could have done better?


As a preamble, I know people at Canon in Japan because of my job. As such, I know for a fact that the 20D could have had the dust cleaning sensor, but it didn't. Technology held back, one example.

My biggest example of what one could do better and where only artificial reasons are holding it back is buffer size. There is absolutely no reason that with today's technology, the 1Ds3 could not have a 30 frame raw buffer. My 1Ds had a 10 frame raw+S buffer; the 1Ds2 has 9 frames in that configuration; the 1Ds3 I would expect to have 11 in that configuration. At the same time we went from 3fps to 5fps. Now tell me that my expectations are too high.

Second example, the LCD. Everyone is all excited about the 3" display - did you see the 1D3? Did you see the iPhone? I am not talking size, I am talking dpi. They sell a $8k camera and use a totally crappy display on it. At least the 1Ds had a better display than the 1D.

I have no doubt that they could bring 25MP into the sensor at the same noise level, if they wanted to. Frame rate would probably suffer, but I think most 1Ds class customers prefer resolution over frame rate. My standard print size is 24x36 and yes pixels do matter and yes there are lenses that can deliver it. And yes I have shot with the P45

14 bit is a yawn because per se it doesn't mean more dynamic range. I'd rather get 2-3 more true f-stops of dynamic range at 12 bit than the other way around, which is what we got. More dynamic range doesn't mean more bit depth as a requirement.

Just look at what the engineers did between the 1D and 1D2, and the 1Ds and 1Ds2. I have used / owned all four cameras, as well as the 1D3. Of the above, the 1D3 is the biggest yawn because it simply has the least technological advance. It's not thinking outside the box (like the 400DO as an example, just to show something else innovative, creative, even if not for everyone). I have no doubt that out of the trio 1D / 1D2 / 1D3 the 1D3 is the best, but it's the least exciting one.

It feels to me that there was more innovation between the 1N and 1V, and that was film. Anyone who thinks that digital photography is "mature" now should look back in 10 years.

When Nikon announces the FF D3 this week at 10fps+ and who knows how many pixels, people will be able to look there for innovation. Relative innovation: maybe it still won't be absolutely better than the Canon, but it will be a much more marked improvement over the D2x than the Canon MK3 series is over the MK2, kinda like when Canon was playing catch-up with the MK2.

I am fortunate enough that I can simply buy the 1Ds3, but I think that doesn't deny me my right to point out that I am way less excited about it than I was about the two predecessors.

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 03:26 AM
Andrew Gough
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p.4 #2 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


On order, the 14 bit and dust removal/mapping is worth it for me alone.

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 03:27 AM
snowboarder
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p.4 #3 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


stanj wrote:
snowboarder wrote:
Stan, can you tell me what Canon realistically could have done better?


My biggest example of what one could do better and where only artificial reasons are holding it back is buffer size.

Second example, the LCD. Everyone is all excited about the 3" display - did you see the 1D3? Did you see the iPhone? I am not talking size, I am talking dpi. They sell a $8k camera and use a totally crappy display on it. At least the 1Ds had a better display than the 1D.



Stan, thanks for such a complete answer. I have to agree with you, partially
on the first two. The RAM buffer probably could have been bigger, but you can't
be sure if there are not any additional factors here, like a physical size and
space available/assigned for RAM modules inside the very compact (for what it is)
body. The LCD quality could have been better for sure, I just think they chose
to produce 1Ds MkIII on the same line as 1D MkIII - the cameras are identical outside,
so they didn't want to include a different kind of LCD screen for such a low volume
product. Why is this LCD used in 1D MkIII? Not sure....



I have no doubt that they could bring 25MP into the sensor at the same noise level...



Maybe yes, maybe no. Remember the sensor in 1Ds MkIII is more than half of its price,
any larger size could have increased the total price. Also at this levels, a "small"
jump from 21 to 25MP means a big jump in production, used elements etc...



14 bit is a yawn because per se it doesn't mean more dynamic range. I'd rather get 2-3 more true f-stops of dynamic range at 12 bit than the other way around, which is what we got. More dynamic range doesn't mean more bit depth as a requirement.



I'm not sure... I love 14-bit color and I think it's a DR improvement...
Don't know enough about available technology to increase the dynamic range,
but I doubt they wouldn't use something available in a camera which will stay
their flagship for at least 4 years...



I am fortunate enough that I can simply buy the 1Ds3, but I think that doesn't deny me my right to point out that I am way less excited about it than I was about the two predecessors.



I think you are judging 1Ds MkIII from an upgrader's point of view, for me it's here
finally and I don't feel I,m buying something 3 years old anymore...
It's my first 1Ds camera and I feel quite excited about it

Andrew


Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 03:51 AM
mark1958
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p.4 #4 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


I am not sure how anyone can be making a comparison and comment on the differences between the 1DsmkII and mkIII before the camera has even been released and we see some real testing. The other point is that the list price is the same as the 1DsmkII. That camera has been discounted to some extent now but new they are still close to 7K and I know that if the list price of the new camera is 8K other places will sell it for less right off the bat.

Edited by mark1958 on Aug 19, 2007 at 08:08 PM GMT

Edited by mark1958 on Aug 19, 2007 at 08:09 PM GMT

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 03:54 AM
snowboarder
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p.4 #5 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


BTW, I can still check my order on amazon.com, if there were any doubts
it would have been cancelled by now...


Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:00 AM
EOS20
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p.4 #6 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


http://www.dpreview.com/news/0708/07082009canoneos1dsmarkiii.asp



Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:19 AM
EltonTeng
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p.4 #7 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Canon USA website announcement:

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=139&modelid=15710

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:37 AM
EOS20
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p.4 #8 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Canon Australia's site:

http://www.canon.com.au/products/visual/cameras/digital_slr/eos1dsmarkiii.aspx

http://www.canon.com.au/products/visual/cameras/digital_slr/eos1dsmarkiii_image_library.aspx



Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:45 AM
RobertP
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p.4 #9 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Official announcements are so refreshing to see. Tasty.

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:47 AM
mark1958
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p.4 #10 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Also says Nov release

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:51 AM
EltonTeng
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p.4 #11 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


RobertP wrote:
Official announcements are so refreshing to see. Tasty.


As opposed to rampant rumors?

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:55 AM
CMOS
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p.4 #12 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


mark1958 wrote:
Also says Nov release


That makes more sense. A mid-August announcement of a mid-December release seems really underwhelming.


Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 04:57 AM
Studio58
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p.4 #13 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


It is now on the Canon Japan site
http://cweb.canon.jp/camera/eosd/1dsmk3/index.html


Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:04 AM
Ivo Silva
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p.4 #14 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Found this sample taken with the 1DS Mark III: http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/eos1dsm3/eos1dsm3_sample-e.html

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:05 AM
EOS20
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p.4 #15 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


There is a preview thats just been posted on DPR:

http://www.dpreview.com/previews/canoneos1dsmarkiii/




Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:06 AM
stanj
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p.4 #16 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Ivo Silva wrote:
Found this sample taken with the 1DS Mark III: http://web.canon.jp/imaging/eosd/eos1dsm3/eos1dsm3_sample-e.html


Doesn't seem to suck

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:36 AM
Jordan Roberts
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p.4 #17 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


i'll have to see what nikon is coming out with, and the 5d upgrade before I make a decision on what camera to get...

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:40 AM
madmax200
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p.4 #18 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


And the USA (canon) Monday news flash.

http://www.usa.canon.com/html/templatedata/pressrelease/20070820_1dsmk3.html

And
USA DS3 page

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=139&modelid=15710

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:42 AM
snowboarder
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p.4 #19 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


madmax200 wrote:
And the USA (canon) Monday news flash.

http://www.usa.canon.com/html/templatedata/pressrelease/20070820_1dsmk3.html

And
USA 3 page

http://www.usa.canon.com/consumer/controller?act=ModelInfoAct&fcategoryid=139&modelid=15710



Michael, you have some of the best pictures on your website and I think
we might be neighbours, is it Huntington Beach Pier on your front page?
Great job!


Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 05:47 AM
EB-1
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p.4 #20 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Throw out your old, slow Extreme III cards, this one can use UDMA cards (and needs to based on the small buffer).

EB

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 06:01 AM
Klane
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p.4 #21 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


21mp is over kill on that size sensor.....a new 14bit 16.7 would have yielded better results...

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 06:25 AM
stanj
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p.4 #22 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


Klane wrote:
21mp is over kill on that size sensor.....a new 14bit 16.7 would have yielded better results...


I guess we will have to see.

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 06:49 AM
hahr
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p.4 #23 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


16.7 at 16-bit and 12 full stops of DR would have been even better.   it'll be interesting to see if the 5D replacement gets 16.7 at 14-bit or if it stays down around 12.7 mp to help keep the 1Ds2 second in line in the FF game.

-erik

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 07:25 AM
jwstudios
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p.4 #24 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


What worries me a lot is the fact that the new camera has the same AF system as the 1D mark III !
There are tremendous problems with that AF system. It seems to me that nobody here is aware of that

Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 07:41 AM
Alistair Watson
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p.4 #25 · •Eos 1Ds MkIII Master Thread•


jwstudios wrote:
What worries me a lot is the fact that the new camera has the same AF system as the 1D mark III !
There are tremendous problems with that AF system. It seems to me that nobody here is aware of that


Having read this thread from start to finish I can see some of the posters who also have M3's, some of which have also reported AF problems. I was also one of the lucky few in the UK to receive my 1D3 is the early batches, after 3 weeks I returned it for a refund. The June 07 built 1D3 I have now is brilliant, focusses as well as the 1D2N so I don't think people are forgetting about the focus problems of the 1D3.

As far as Canon Belgium not recognising your 1D3 problem, I would send it back for a service, I know a few people in the UK who have done this and the camera has returned far more accurate, apparently all 'electrical adjustment changes' whatever that means.

Anyway, the 1Ds3 looks very nice, an impressive spec. I can't really see me buying one though, selling my 1D2N and getting a 2nd 1D3 is my current priority.


Edited on Oct 12, 2007 at 02:08 AM


Aug 20, 2007 at 07:55 AM

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