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Archive 2013 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography
  
 
PetKal
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p.1 #1 · p.1 #1 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


A few days ago, Steve, who is also an FM member, asked for my opinion of 1DsMkII as a "birding" camera.
I told him I liked 1DsMkII, and that I had been still using it on a variety of birds, in parallel to 1DX, although the older camera has some serious limitations one has to work either with or around. One of such limitations is a low FPS/burst depth capability. Therefore, shooting faster BIF with 1DsMkII, as an example, is a rather trying experience, and there are always some sure-fire shots missed.

Today I went to 3 different shooting "theatres" of mine, sporting 1DsMkII cum 600 f/4 IS MkII + 1.4xTC III, and within 2.5 hrs total shooting time, managed to get something like 40 diverse keepers. Obviously, they are not a Nat Geo material, but that's not the point: 1DsMkII can get you some nice shots, and the camera performs dependably-predictably and with precision. I have fun using it as well as looking at the files it produces.

Here's Pt. 1 sampler of my today's shots. Again, all of them were done with handheld 1DsMkII + 600 II + 1.4xTC III.

Edited on May 05, 2013 at 04:34 PM · View previous versions



May 03, 2013 at 08:43 PM
Tapeman
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p.1 #2 · p.1 #2 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Anybody who live near pidgin heaven can get buy with almost any camera!


May 03, 2013 at 08:54 PM
PetKal
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p.1 #3 · p.1 #3 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Tapeman, not exactly "near"....I did clock close to 135 mls today driving from one place to another.


May 03, 2013 at 08:58 PM
StillFingerz
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p.1 #4 · p.1 #4 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Peter, them older FF pro pixels still really do shine! You've managed to produce a great set of images and for those that might want to venture into a 1D body, have demonstrated their viability.

Questions...given the age of 1D2 or 3 bodies, are there any limitations with supporting software; i.e. firmware updates etc., must a potential buyer maintain an older PC or Mac, or does the newer Canon software maintain backward compatibility with older bodies? Do these bodies require older hardware as well; usb v1.0, firewire 400, etc.?

Not having a digital body older than the 40D, I'm wondering how well 3rd party software products support the bodies as well; ie. Lightroom, Photoshop, etc...

As you know I'm looking to possibly get a 1D2N or 1D3; or perhaps an 'S' variant, if I end up opting for 6D instead of the 5D3, if the software/hardware requirements are unique; old like the bodies, I'd be glad to research this for the FM family given the 'extended horizontal' time at my disposal

Jerry



May 03, 2013 at 09:16 PM
Cicopo
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p.1 #5 · p.1 #5 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


As another 1Ds2 shooter it's my understanding that you need a computer running XP to communicate with the camera to set the custom (personal) settings and owners name etc but you don't need to do that very often once you get it more or less to your liking. You DO need to do it by firewire on the 1D2n & 1Ds2 but I think the 1D3 uses USB but I'm not sure about that one.


May 03, 2013 at 11:31 PM
jcolwell
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p.1 #6 · p.1 #6 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Cicopo wrote:
.... You DO need to do it by firewire on the 1D2n & 1Ds2 but I think the 1D3 uses USB but I'm not sure about that one.


Yes, Larry, that's right. The 1DIII, 1DsIII, 1DIV, and 1DX cameras all use the USB interface, not FireWire (IEEE 1394).

The basic problem with respect to operating system is to find support for FireWire hardware and drivers. My old Win XP desktop had an integral FireWire connector on the front panel, and so it was a breeze to connect my old 1DII cameras. My new Win 7 desktop doesn't.

I've attached a photo of my old desktop's FireWire port, and both ends of the connector cable.








May 03, 2013 at 11:43 PM
OntheRez
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p.1 #7 · p.1 #7 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


and the camera performs dependably-predictably and with precision
Petkal


While I've had to move on from my 1DsII, the fact that it worked in an absolutely predictable manner every single time and was - within its design limits - capable of as good a photo as any camera around makes it my all time favorite camera. Yes newer ones can do things undreamed of by the 1DsII, but inside its limits it was king.

Jerry,

As Cicopo noted you have to use FireWire 400 to set the personal functions. Note this is not the camera based custom functions. Frankly unless you have a quite specialized need, you never really have to deal with the PF. (I did things like set the RAW file name to use my initials.) There are firewire to other protocol adapters but Macs dropped support of FireWire maybe 3 years ago. I think XP was the last version of windows with native support.

As for software, the camera was once king and everything knew how to deal with it. Unless some idiot at Adobe gets the bright idea of throwing away support for older cameras (something I've never seen them do), you don't have any thing to worry about. At the end of the day the 1DII, 1DIIn, and 1DsII are all superb cameras available for a song. I only moved on because I was forced to work in very low light. 25600 was unheard of when the 1DsII was new.

Robert



May 03, 2013 at 11:48 PM
StillFingerz
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p.1 #8 · p.1 #8 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Larry, Jim and Robert...thank you all, your input clears up my main questions, I've a few XP machines; lap and desktop, and each supports firewire 1384 v400; just need get a cable if a 1D2 body is picked up...great info guys

Decisions 6D and an older 1D body, or a 5D3...coming from a 40D/50D any would be usable. I shoot mostly f4 glass and while slower, being able to AF at f8 could be a huge benefit in the future; 300f4LIS w/2x or 400f5.6L w/1.4x...the f2.8 glass is out of my budget range thus the f4s.

Jerry



May 04, 2013 at 12:10 AM
PetKal
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p.1 #9 · p.1 #9 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Here's photo sampler Pt.2:

I suspect mine may look different than what you see on various birding fora, but they are indeed the old Redneck pijuns.

Handheld 1DsMkII + 600 II + 1.4xTC III.

Edited on May 05, 2013 at 04:34 PM · View previous versions



May 04, 2013 at 12:52 AM
PetKal
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p.1 #10 · p.1 #10 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


StillFingerz wrote:
Questions...given the age of 1D2 or 3 bodies, are there any limitations with supporting software; i.e. firmware updates etc., must a potential buyer maintain an older PC or Mac, or does the newer Canon software maintain backward compatibility with older bodies? Do these bodies require older hardware as well; usb v1.0, firewire 400, etc.?

Not having a digital body older than the 40D, I'm wondering how well 3rd party software products support the bodies as well; ie. Lightroom, Photoshop, etc...

As you know I'm looking to possibly get a 1D2N or 1D3; or perhaps an 'S' variant, if I end up opting
...Show more

Jerry, there are no more firmware updates for 1DsMkII and 1DMkIIN camera bodies, so you do not need to worry about that. As far as setting up "personal functions" goes, I do not think there is anything really practically useful there to set. I have never even attempted to access that inane old feature. Yet another thing you may forget about.
Lastly, I have never encountered any photoshop problems or DPP problems with those older bodies.

However, cameras such as 1DsMkII are quite heavy and inferior in performance to 5DMkIII, or even 6D in some ways. Therefore, I think you should keep your sights on the current crop of small form gripless cameras.



May 04, 2013 at 01:18 AM
 

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jcolwell
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p.1 #11 · p.1 #11 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


PetKal wrote:
... As far as setting up "personal functions" goes, I do not think there is anything really practically useful there to set.


I used it to disable the AF-assist light, and to enable "original image verification data". Just sayin'.



May 04, 2013 at 01:29 AM
Cicopo
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p.1 #12 · p.1 #12 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


I've shot the 1Ds2 as my primary body for 4 seasons of radio control events using several different lenses but the best lens I used on it was the 35-350 L (versatility wise) and it ALWAYS got the shot if I could keep the plane in the view finder. Keep in mind these events are almost always in decent light & suspended while it rains. 4 FPS wasn't great BUT I also had a 1D2n with me until I finally felt the 7D did as well but offered the extra pixels for cropping. I always shoot RAW + Large fine jpg & try to get by with the jpg's (generally do too) so the buffer was my only issue. The 7D has been replaced by a 1D4 but the 1Ds2 will see lots of action this summer again but I haven't decided on which lens will live there most of the time. At current prices for used 1D bodies being where they are I'll shoot my 1Ds2 & 1d2n until they die because they still get the job done for me & frankly when they don't it's because I screwed up in settings or panning.


May 04, 2013 at 01:33 AM
Cicopo
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p.1 #13 · p.1 #13 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Like Jim I enable "original image verification data" but that's because I do insurance appraisals to collector cars & have had to be accepted as an expert witness in court. Not something many need but something to consider.


May 04, 2013 at 01:40 AM
StillFingerz
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p.1 #14 · p.1 #14 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


PetKal wrote:
Jerry, there are no more firmware updates for 1DsMkII and 1DMkIIN camera bodies, so you do not need to worry about that. As far as setting up "personal functions" goes, I do not think there is anything really practically useful there to set. I have never even attempted to access that inane old feature. Yet another thing you may forget about.
Lastly, I have never encountered any photoshop problems or DPP problems with those older bodies.

However, cameras such as 1DsMkII are quite heavy and inferior in performance to 5DMkIII, or even 6D in some ways.

Therefore, I think you should
...Show more

Thanks Peter, indeed the gripless bodies offer us; Linda and I; lighter weight solutions and we both are leaning more each day to a 5D3. As in the past my bodies tend to last 5-7 years easy and when I move to FF my budget will expect the same in the future.

My possible using a 1D body are a ways off and are mostly motivated by AF at f8. Given the 5D3's new firmware addresses this f8 issue, and a few other lackings of the 6D. I'm guessing a 5D3 refurb will be my best buy in the long run. I gave up my 1V HS back in 07 to move to digital and because it's weight was tough to manage comfortably. My pondering a 1D body is born from that 1st taste of the 1V; that feel/functionality for action shooting is hard to forget.

Thus I ponder/wonder about that old big pixel goodness
Jerry



May 04, 2013 at 01:56 AM
Cicopo
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p.1 #15 · p.1 #15 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Jerry I don't fully understand you're handycap but I think I've read enough to know weight or controlling a weight load is an issue and if that's right I wouldn't hesitate to recommend the 7D as a crop body (from 3 years of use) or a 5D3 from everything I've read as better alternatives but with a price either in $ or across the board features vs an older 1 series body. I'd have a 5D3 if I thought it would get me more keepers but to date my equipment is superior to my skill set & another vacation outranks another camera body.


May 04, 2013 at 02:27 AM
_SBS_
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p.1 #16 · p.1 #16 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


PetKal, thanks so much for these and your help with the 1DsmkII questions!

In the end I decide to wait and see what comes down the Canon pipeline (rumored "big" mp) and save for a 1dX, or most likely, a 5d3 and a 500 f4 v1. As whatever camera I get would have to serve the studio first and the birds second, I think holding off investing 1k+ is the better option for me. My wife, not surprisingly at all, agrees with my good judgement.

My current 1d2 will have to serve, even with the weird noise artifacts I get at iso 800+ at times....But...

...Your advice also sparked an idea, which led to talking to an old friend I havent spoken to in years. To make it short, he is giving me his 1d2N since he no longer has need for it, so weird noise problem solved My 1d2 will serve as my 2nd camera, as a wide or macro under 800 iso.

Thanks Peter!

-Steve




May 04, 2013 at 03:52 AM
StillFingerz
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p.1 #17 · p.1 #17 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Cicopo wrote:
Jerry I don't fully understand you're handycap but I think I've read enough to know weight or controlling a weight load is an issue and if that's right I wouldn't hesitate to recommend the 7D as a crop body (from 3 years of use) or a 5D3 from everything I've read as better alternatives but with a price either in $ or across the board features vs an older 1 series body. I'd have a 5D3 if I thought it would get me more keepers but to date my equipment is superior to my skill set & another vacation outranks
...Show more

Larry, your 7D suggestion has been a thought, a serious possibility, one I'm pondering as an upgrade to my 40D; which is still going strong. I've picked up a 2nd crop body; a 50D, and am getting use to the larger files and increased noise. I probably should have picked up a 5Dc instead but I'm hooked on live view...

As for my disability, it can be tough to describe as many a physical therapist classifies my physical abilities as a lower C7 break, but other issues are in-fact typical C5 level. I have a high level spinal cord injury and am pretty much paralyzed from the neck/shoulders down, the paralysis is permanent, at least for 34yrs so far

I've some upper body abilities, minor back/chest, pretty strong shoulders/biceps and partial use of my arms, with no grip, use of my fingers; except as wedges. So while I can lift a good bit; had a 1VHS and 400mm with 2x TC, overall weight is an issue. I'm not really able to grip/hold anything solidly, so I kind of cradle body and lens in my hands, use a wired remote switch between my teeth to fire the shutter; it's not pretty but I wasn't/aren't anyway...I'm a caveman ex surfer rollin with powerwheels under me and Canon in hand

I'm still debating my move to FF, stills are my main focus but video is of great interest as I'm thinking of making some instructional tutorials for the disabled community. The 5D3 is looking like my best solution, it will meet several needs/wants. Video is important and even tho there is a 3rd party filter for the 6D's moire issues, it's over $400 and adding that to the body only cost, well a 5D3 refurb via CLP will be near the same out-of-pocket cost. I'm still struggling with my choice, have lots of time to decide. Gps/wifi are attractive but so is the newer 61pt AF; the new firmware makes the 5D3 even more likable/wanted, AF at f8 is a biggie...time will tell.

I'm in no hurry...as for skills, my 40D and L glass still have the edge and are much sharper then I...still learning as it should be even after 40yrs of shooting...

Just need to get rollin and out shootin...we'll see what happens if/when the 7D2 arrives
Thanks for your thoughts!
Jerry



May 04, 2013 at 03:56 AM
15Bit
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p.1 #18 · p.1 #18 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


Jerry, i definitely wouldn't recommend the 1DsII for you as changing settings like ISO involves pushing two buttons at once and requires a level of dexterity that frustrates many of us fully able-bodied folk. My one afternoon with the camera was immensely satisfying but for that one incredibly annoying design feature


May 04, 2013 at 06:52 AM
PetKal
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p.1 #19 · p.1 #19 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


_SBS_ wrote:
...Your advice also sparked an idea, which led to talking to an old friend I havent spoken to in years. To make it short, he is giving me his 1d2N since he no longer has need for it, so weird noise problem solved My 1d2 will serve as my 2nd camera, as a wide or macro under 800 iso.

-Steve



Steve, 1DMkIIN is also a great camera in its own right, and it sure fixes the FPS/buffer limitation of 1DsMkII. More useful LCD display too.
I can get a shot like this one using 1DsMkII with some difficulty. However, with 1DMkIIN such captures are easier, although the file may not have as much "depth".


Edited on May 05, 2013 at 04:34 PM · View previous versions



May 04, 2013 at 10:53 AM
mt-m
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p.1 #20 · p.1 #20 · Steve, 1DsMkII and bird photography


1Ds MKII is a GREAT camera for birds. Not sure about fish








May 04, 2013 at 02:30 PM
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