Wedding Hardware and Settings?

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cgardner
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p.2 #1 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Sjjindra wrote:
How much will I lose without the flashes?

With the low-noise @ high ISO capabilities of today's cameras the problem isn't not having enough light but the fact it's usually not coming from a very flattering direction.

What exactly is a flattering direction? Eyes get shaded by the brow in steep overhead lighting indoors and out. Look for light in both eyes, how the nose shadow is falling and how dark it it.

There is no "rule" you need light in the eyes all the time, but on a cause and effect level in a photo shaded eyes send a "go away and leave me alone" body language message in photos even if the person is looking at the camera. The direct eye contact/shaded orbits send a conflicting engage/leave me alone message. By comparison brightly lit eyes looking at the camera say. "Come and engage, share the fun that's making me smile. Hence, keeping light in both eyes is more flattering.

The clues about the shape of the nose come from the shape of the shadow. When it falls at a 45/45 downward/sideways angle it falls nicely over 1/2 the nose and models it accurately. If the light angle is too much sideways or lower than 45 degree the nose shadow hangs out or falls into the far eye hiding it. The tone of the nose shadow provide a clue that is part of the impression that light is "hard" or "soft", or more accurately if the object casting the shadow is hard edged or rounded. Dark shadows make wrinkles obvious / Light shadows hide shadows. Light shadows are more flattering that those which seem darker than normal.

The only way to get the ambient light in the eyes is to catch people looking up. You might look like a fool but the simplest foolproof way to get people looking up is to stand on chair and say, "Hey guys, look up here and smile". Not only does it get light in the eyes it also gets ALL THE FACE LOOKING AT THE CAMERA. That's better than a totally candid shot of a group where some of the people have their backs to the camera.

Flash on a bracket only solves part of the "racoon eye problem". It gets the flash light past the brow into the eyes a flattering downward modeling angle, but if the people are not looking up the ambient light (which becomes the fill when the brighter flash highlights the face) still be shaded and in the photos the eye sockets will still look dull and dead compared to the cheeks below getting hit by the flash and 100% of the ambient. The solution is the same. Get the people looking up to get the ambient in the eyes before adding the flash.

The way to get a flattering ambient light angle on the face is situational awareness of the dominant direction and the angle of face and camera relative to it. For a full face pose you ideally want the "key" light 45 degrees to the side and 45 above, which gets it in the eyes and models the face nicely.

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Then if you move around to the oblique view the lighting on the face is the same, but now the source is 90 degrees from the camera axis.

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Move around for a profile shot and the lighting pattern on the face is the same, but the key light is not 135 degrees away from the camera axis:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

The lesson there is to think in terms of angle of light to the nose (45/45) first, then move around the subject to capture the different views. The advantage of shooting with dual flash at an event like a wedding is you can move the OCF to 45/45 regardless of where they are looking and overpower the ambient to control the modeling:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

When I can't position the OCF precisely I use it behind as rim light:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

The background is dark in those shots because it was a gym with the ambient lights down low and there wasn't much bounce spill. These shots I took as a guest at a wedding is more typical of results a small low ceiling room with dual flash:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

I left the OCF in the shot here to show it's placement (which isn't critical) and how the light from the back bouncing off the ceiling meeting the light from the front from the bracket lights the space evenly in a way that creates an impression of 3D a single flash shot from the front lacks:

This image is copyrighted by the owner

Jan 23, 2013 at 06:30 PM

boingyman
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p.2 #2 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Body and lens wise you have more than enough. I do agree to have at least 1 flash.
I've seen top wedding photographers that use a lot a variety of lighting setups and some that use just 1 on camera flash for mainly the reception/dancing. However, what they all have in common is their vision, storytelling ability, creative use of light, composition, timing and being able to capture the decisive moment. I'm pretty sure if you met all of them as well that their easy going, people skills are excellent and probably have a good sense of humor that helps the bride, groom, family, wedding party and guest feel relaxed and comfortable around them. The actual photography is the easy part.

Jan 23, 2013 at 08:23 PM

BrianO
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p.2 #3 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Sjjindra wrote: ...I have a Sunpak PZ40X II I purchased used, but have never used it. Would the Sunpak do the job or be more trouble than it is worth, especially with no flash experience. It seems the Canon 600EX-RT is the top tool. What are the advantages/disadvantages, if I using 1 flash on camera?

I wouldn't spend more money on a flash at this point. The Sunpak isn't as powerful as a 580EX or 600EX, but it'll do the job in most situations.

It is a little low to the lens, though; even lower than a 430EX, so you'll definitely want to look into getting a flash bracket to move it off the hot shoe, and you'll need an ETTL off-camera shoe cord to connect it to the camera.

For years I used the inexpensive Stroboframe Flip-flash bracket at weddings. It gets the flash a little higher off the lens axis during horizontal shots, and keeps the flash aligned over the lens during vertical shots with a simple flip (thus the name). There are more expensive brackets out there that flip the camera rather than the flash (less stress on the flash foot), but for the first time out you don't need to spend that much since you aren't a heavy flash user.

Since you have a few weeks until the big day, I highly suggest one book to help you get the most out of your single flash:

http://www.amazon.com/Camera-Techniques-Digital-Portrait-Photography/dp/1584282584

Get it as soon as possible, and start practicing the techniques it gives you.

Good luck.

Jan 23, 2013 at 10:59 PM

AmbientMike
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p.2 #4 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Do not post this in the wedding forum. You'll get beaten. Very informative here I am impressed.

Checked out a good wedding photo book at library. By Bill Hurter. Published by Amherst Media. Had good posing tips I thought, although I didnt agree with everything.

Remember if you don't do it they will probably wind up with worse photos. You can do a better job than the other guests and they probably weren't hiring a pro anyway.

Jan 24, 2013 at 01:17 AM

AmbientMike
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p.2 #5 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Ive only shot half a dozen weddings or so but Id take a 50mm or zoom to cover the 35-70 range I believe.

Jan 24, 2013 at 01:29 AM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #6 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Continued excellent tips.

BrianO
I ordered the Flash book, delivery tomorrow.

The wedding shower is this Saturday, so will have a chance to try some suggestions in a less formal atmosphere.

For on-camera flash only, is it best to have a bracket to put flash directly above lens, as opposed to off to one side and above?

Doing the wedding without cost, I will just lurk the Wedding forum.

Great illustrations on lighting with the snow head.

Thanks again all.
Steve

Jan 24, 2013 at 06:00 PM

PhilDrinkwater
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p.2 #7 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Sjjindra wrote:
Continued excellent tips.

BrianO
I ordered the Flash book, delivery tomorrow.

The wedding shower is this Saturday, so will have a chance to try some suggestions in a less formal atmosphere.

For on-camera flash only, is it best to have a bracket to put flash directly above lens, as opposed to off to one side and above?

Doing the wedding without cost, I will just lurk the Wedding forum.

Great illustrations on lighting with the snow head.

Thanks again all.
Steve

Yes - directly above the lens is best in most circumstances.

Jan 24, 2013 at 07:07 PM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #8 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

I purchased the book "On-Camera Flash Techniques for Digital Wedding and Portrait Photography" and just ordered a 600EX-RT (grey market) and a Sto-fen Omni Bounce diffuser from Adorama today. I figured that long term, I will get my money's worth from it. I intend to use it at the wedding with the bounce flash technique. Since the lighting is all fluorescent to use a green gel.

Next Sunday am going to the couple's favorite park for outdoor photos. Still have about 3 weeks before their wedding, so still open to tips, particularly for my updated setup.

Thanks again.
Steve

Feb 05, 2013 at 04:16 AM

dmcharg
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p.2 #9 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

If this is the first time you have shot a wedding then i would keep things very simple, the less kit the better. I did my first wedding about 2 years ago and i used 50D+24-70+580EXII and i had some other kit as backup. I always shoot manual mode as it gives me complete control. With the flash ETTL worked perfectly. My setup was ideal, it mean't i could focus more on capturing the events of the day, composition and less time fidgeting with kit.

Feb 06, 2013 at 07:47 PM

BrianO
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p.2 #10 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

dmcharg wrote: If this is the first time you have shot a wedding then i would keep things very simple...

Good advice.

dmcharg wrote: ...i had some other kit as backup.

This is essential! It's a once-in-a-lifetime event; no do-overs if a camera locks up or a flash dies.

If you only have one camera, then buy, rent, or borrow another for use on the big day. Same for a flash. Extra batteries are a must.

dmcharg wrote: ...I always shoot manual mode as it gives me complete control. With the flash ETTL worked perfectly.

That's my setting of choice most of the time, too. Manual mode for camera and ETTL mode for flash (unless I'm using multiple Speedlites, in which case I'll put them in manual as well).

Feb 07, 2013 at 03:59 AM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #11 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

I would like to offer my appreciation to those offering sound advice for the hardware and techniques to use for the couple's wedding. The wedding was yesterday and all went well.

I just went through selecting and editing the photos I will be giving the couple. Between trip to park, rehearsal, wedding and reception, I took about 500 photos, deleted about 50 for technical reasons, then selected about about 150 of the best to edit and deliver on a thumb drive. I will probably have 3 sets of 4x6's printed at Walgreens or CVS, 1 for the couple, 1 for me, and 1 to share with common friends and for the couple to share with family.

Purchases I made base on recommendations were:

-The book: On-Camera Flash Techniques for Digital Wedding and Photography
Chapter 10 on use of bounce flash technique was just what I needed, particularly to use walls when appropriate for some better directional light and not just the ceiling.

-600EX-RT Flash. Although rental was recommended, I decided to purchase a grey market unit from Adorama. Great tool.

I used the 5DIII camera, 600EX-RT flash, 70-200 2.8 IS II and 35 1.4 lenses exclusively. Very few missed focus photos and overall the bounce flash worked great. Shot Manual mode, usually at F2.8, 1/160 to 1/200 shutter speed, ISO 800 to 1600, and let the ETTL do it's magic. I intended to save RAW to CF and JPEG to SD, but had wrong setting and ended up saving JPEG to each, so no RAW. Fortunately exposure was consistently close and JPEGs were okay. Cropping and small adjustments to the mid levels on some of the photos was the extent of my post processing.

I believe the young couple will be very happy with the photos.

I'll try to post a few photos in the next day or two.

Thanks for advice.

Steve

Edited on Feb 25, 2013 at 05:06 AM · View previous versions

Feb 25, 2013 at 04:57 AM

BrianO
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p.2 #12 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Sjjindra wrote: I would like to offer my appreciation to those offering sound advice for the hardware and techniques to use for the couple's wedding. The wedding was yesterday and all went well.

That's great news, Steve. Glad it went well.

Sjjindra wrote: ...I will probably have 3 sets of 4x6's printed at Walgreens or CVS, 1 for the couple, 1 for me, and 1 to share with common friends and for the couple to share with family.

I'd suggest giving a set to both of the couple's mothers.

Feb 25, 2013 at 05:05 AM

PhilDrinkwater
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p.2 #13 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Feb 25, 2013 at 09:11 AM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #14 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Sjjindra wrote: ...I will probably have 3 sets of 4x6's printed at Walgreens or CVS, 1 for the couple, 1 for me, and 1 to share with common friends and for the couple to share with family.

I'd suggest giving a set to both of the couple's mothers.

Followed this advice too and ordered 5 sets of 4x6 prints this morning at Walgreens to pick up on the way home. One set for me, one for the couple, one for bride's mom, one for groom's mom, and one for the couple to distribute among friends and family. Walgreens had 40% off coupon, so total with tax was only $86 for 760 prints.

Thanks again
Steve

Feb 25, 2013 at 04:45 PM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #15 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Posting a few of the photos from wedding and reception. The lady in the steel blue dress, between the couple, is my bride of 37 years. The shortest of the 2 girls is one of my grandchildren. Open to comments. The shots on stage were without flash.
Thanks
Steve

2013 © Sjjindra

Feb 27, 2013 at 05:36 PM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #16 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Feb 27, 2013 at 05:41 PM

BrianO
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p.2 #17 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Overall they're quite nice, and capture they the event.

Several in the second set show a common problem, though; one that happens when there's more than one person taking pictures at the same time: some of the subjects are looking somewhere other than at you. That causes a loss of "connection" in the photos.

In the future, take command of the situation and don't press the shutter release until you have the full attention of everyone in the group. They're the "actors," and you're the "director" -- so direct!

Feb 27, 2013 at 07:46 PM

Sjjindra
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p.2 #18 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

BrianO

I agree. At the last minute, the bride's mother hired another photographer (probably when she found out it was being covered by an amateur (me). It came as a surprise at the wedding, even to the couple. Since this was his livelihood, I made it a point to coordinate with him and have him take the lead. I was still the bride and groom's photographer and he was the mother's family's photographer. I described my plan of where I planned to be for the procession and ceremony and be said it would not interfere with his plan. Looking back, the attention in the posed photos was split about 50-50, at times within a group in the same photo (too many cooks...).

Good catch and comment though.

Thanks
Steven

Feb 27, 2013 at 09:04 PM

BrianO
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p.2 #19 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Sjjindra wrote: ...At the last minute, the bride's mother hired another photographer (probably when she found out it was being covered by an amateur (me).

I had that happen to me, although it was the groom that hired another photographer. The bride was my sister, and it was only my second wedding. I made sure that he shot first, but when it was my turn I took full control for that moment.

It turned out to be a good thing I was there; he left right after the ceremony (he double-booked the day, and had to get to the other wedding), so I was the only one taking photos at the reception and the get-away in the "Just Married" car.

In the end, they liked my photos better than the pro's, and that was what encouraged me to make it a part-time business.

Feb 27, 2013 at 09:20 PM

PhilDrinkwater
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p.2 #20 · Wedding Hardware and Settings?

Cool

I would say there's a fair difference in white balance and colour tone between them. Post production takes a long time to get right - I real *really* right - especially under tungsten lighting. Even a white balance tweak (many of the indoor ones are too green) would help quite a lot.

Also watch for the details of the backgrounds. You don't want to shoot with someones head in front of a light and the girls shot could have been taken higher to avoid the legs in their heads

A few of them could do with some straightening too, or taking straighter to avoid perspective, which can make them seem unstraight (even if they're not)

www.phildweddingphotography.co.uk

Feb 27, 2013 at 10:04 PM

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