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Archive 2012 · 7D or 1D4? (used)

  
 
Liquidstone
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p.2 #1 · p.2 #1 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


uz2work wrote:
I'm not sure what tests you are looking at, but every controlled test that I've seen gives a clear advantage to the 7D with regard to resolving detail in focal length-limited situations. I have no doubt that the 5D Mark III is an outstanding camera and that it can do a better job than the 7D in many situations, but focal length-limited situations are not included in the list of those situations,

As an owner of both a 1D Mark IV and a 7D, my assessment would be that the 1D Mark IV is, without question, a better camera than
...Show more

+1...... nicely put, Les. Your experience exactly mirrors mine.



Aug 19, 2012 at 10:44 PM
Ralph Thompson
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p.2 #2 · p.2 #2 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


I own both a 7D & a 1D4. Here's my completely unscientific take on it. My 7D sits on the shelf. It rarely gets used anymore. With all the pixel peeping digtial algorithms and all the other technacrap.... I just find the 1d4 images easier to process, they hold up better and I just plain like them better. That's just me... can't explain it it's all based on intangibles that I can't explain. And to top it off, I like the 1d4's build quality ect....


Aug 22, 2012 at 11:45 PM
M Lucca
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p.2 #3 · p.2 #3 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Since you have a 5d3, I cannot see what might a 1.3x 1d4 would give you that a 5d3 can't after cropping a bit for reach. AF wise the 1dx derived 5d3 >>> 1d4. So it can't be AF performance. So the only logical reason is reach. You didn't mention you plan to go to the Antarctic to shoot mating Emperor Penguins either. Therefore the 1d4 makes very little sense.
You either get another 5d3 or a 1.6x 7d. See how I made it easier for you.



Aug 23, 2012 at 12:48 AM
Angry
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p.2 #4 · p.2 #4 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


If you go the 7D route, just make sure you spend the time setting up the AF , then you'll love it..

For moving targets, Set the AF to centre point or centre point expanded these two are the best AF points for moving targets, if not,.. it will latch onto other targets ,...
it will pay dividends as when not set up correctly it hasa mind of its own..

Al



Aug 23, 2012 at 01:55 AM
Bones74
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p.2 #5 · p.2 #5 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


I have a 1D4 and 5D3. I sold my 7D to help fund the 5D3 and dont miss it or the reach (pixel per duck if you wish). I'd rather have the less, but higher quality pixels from the 1D4 and the 1 Series build that comes with it. However as you say, you are budget limited and after some fine glass; a 7D with the new firmware could be a nice toy If you can stretch to the 1D4 though, don't hesitate!


Aug 23, 2012 at 02:55 AM
PetKal
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p.2 #6 · p.2 #6 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Since your main camera is a very capable 5DMkIII, I think you could settle on a 7D as a backup, or perhaps even 40/50D, so that if your main camera fails you could still maintain a minimum sort of photographic functionality until the 5DMkIII is restored to service.

No doubt, 1DMkIV is a very well liked camera, unfortunately, good specimens are still very expensive......for that kind of money you could get another brand new 5DMkIII.



Aug 23, 2012 at 05:55 AM
TeamSpeed
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p.2 #7 · p.2 #7 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


I did a head to head against these 2 cameras in the past, and the photos used for that comparison can be found here: http://teamspeed.smugmug.com/Electronics/7D-vs-1D4

The side by sides are straight raw->DPP->JPG and then 100% cropped on each, and I used the same lens, but tried to change my distance on each to try to keep the material somewhat similarly sized. Note that I used DPP, which means it honors the in-camera settings of NR, and the 7D is set up to be a bit more aggressive than the 1D4 from the factory.

I also have comparisons of the reach advantage of the 7D vs 1D4 on different targets.

My take? It mirrors many comments here. When you don't want the bulk of a 1D or want more reach, take a 7D, it will get you very close to the quality you like from the 1D4, but is less forgiving of missed exposures (ie. shooting to the left), and the files do take more finessing, the 1D4 files are better out of the box. If you want a more refined and sure-footed experience, take the 1D4.



Aug 23, 2012 at 06:27 AM
mikeinctown
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p.2 #8 · p.2 #8 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


PCKit wrote:
I'd take a 1DIV for 2500 or 2600.


QFT, I haven't seen any one posted for less than like $3k, maybe $3300. I was gonna post that the 7D bodies can be had for a grand or less now which makes the 1D body triple the cost. I'd buy the 7D now plus the L gladd and in a year the 1D body will be $500 or more less than it is now while the glass will be worth about the same.



Aug 23, 2012 at 09:37 AM
Sneakyracer
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p.2 #9 · p.2 #9 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


eyal.ma wrote:
The price of a used 1D4 is a bit over twice the price of a used 7D, so I wonder if its worth the difference that much.

.


No it is not. I would get the 7D. It also uses the same battery as the 5D3 so no need for different batteries and charger.



Aug 23, 2012 at 09:41 AM
anselwannab
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p.2 #10 · p.2 #10 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


I think the 7D has been a better match to the 1dMKIII than the IV?

I'm in the same boat. I wonder if the 1DX filling orders will spike the number of IVs on the market and depress prices or if the 7DII materializes and has MKIV like properties it may drag the used IV price down a bit. Cameras get cheaper, it is only a matter of time.



Aug 23, 2012 at 02:29 PM
Netgarden
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p.2 #11 · p.2 #11 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Les, i hear ya on the 7D noise being manageable. but what i discovered was not only the files on the 7D noisier, but the creamy sharpness of the 1 D was so superior, i decided to go back to the 1D series again. If the 7D was superior to the 1 D, both 3 and 4 , i would have known it, and not parted with it. I know i only have 92 galleries of wildlife photos, lol, and many wildlife experts agree with me, we are comparing apples to oranges here. Thats not saying the person should not choose the 7D. Its more bang for your money in that class of cameras.

Anselwannab, yes the 7D was generally compared to the 1D mkIII, even then i preferred the 10mpx , i was hoping iD get closer, larger files to my targets with the7d, but even trying downsizing, it did not rank up there with the 1D. My experience was the 7D owners who did not come from the 1D cameras seemed happier with it.



Aug 23, 2012 at 11:49 PM
TeamSpeed
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p.2 #12 · p.2 #12 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Could you explain "creamy sharpness"?

In my personal experiences, having shot them both side by side with the same lens on the same subjects multiple times, my copies didn't exhibit such a profound difference. The 1D4 is better definitely, and I love mine to death, but the 7D is a great backup to the 1D4, with the only worries I have with it is to nail exposure more perfectly than on the 1D4.

Here is a test shot taken from my head to head at ISO 100, the best you are going to get from both. This shows the reach advantage, and if I resize that 7D down, the 1D4 is just a tad sharper, basically nothing a photoshop USM of 40% at .4 radius, 0 threshold doesn't fix up. That is a very small amount of sharpening needed. Now at higher ISOs, the differences are a bit more noticeable since the 1D4 does better higher ISOs, and thus less detail lost to NR overall.



Here is ISO 1600 side by side, with no resizing, what I did here was change the focal length from 100mm on the 7d to 130mm on the 1D4. If I had kept them both at 100mm, I could have resized the 7d down to the 1D4 resolution, and it would have reduced the differences between them. This at least shows the noise difference between each of them at 100% view, the impacts of 30mm on DOF, and what the difference in AA filter (I assume) is doing to the IQ on each.

Here, a USM of 70, .4. 0 brings the 7D in alignment with the 1D4, so we have gone from a USM % of 40 to 70 in 4 stops ISO, almost double. I don't have a test as such, but if I extrapolate out to ISO 12800, I would need a USM of nearly double again, so a value of around 140, .4. 0 to equalize or better the 1D4.



As to wildlife galleries, I am confined to what is in my back yard, and what is at the local zoo, so nothing crazy or dramatic to compare.

1D4 duck shot at ISO 6400


7D duck shot at ISO 6400 (using the drab female vs the drake above just doesn't seem fair does it? )


All these comparisons are probably making everyone feel like this little fellow, so I will stop!





Aug 24, 2012 at 12:47 AM
Pixel Perfect
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p.2 #13 · p.2 #13 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


I'm not sure the 1D IV will give you much you don't already get in the 5D III as long as you can get by with the lesser build quality and lower fps. I have 7D, 1D IV and 5D III and although of course 1D IV is an overall better camera than the 7D, the AF of the 5D III is even better than that of the 1D IV. I bought the 1D IV before I knew about the 5D III and maybe now I would not do so, although I immensely enjoy using the 1 series.

If you are not going to be shooting FL limited scenarios very often, then I'd recommend the 1D IV, which has about 10% more reach than the 5D III, otherwise the 7D is a very nice camera for the money and I couldn't imagine being without it as at least a backup for my other cameras for birding in particular.



Aug 24, 2012 at 05:31 AM
uz2work
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p.2 #14 · p.2 #14 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Netgarden wrote:
Les, i hear ya on the 7D noise being manageable. but what i discovered was not only the files on the 7D noisier, but the creamy sharpness of the 1 D was so superior, i decided to go back to the 1D series again. If the 7D was superior to the 1 D, both 3 and 4 , i would have known it, and not parted with it. I know i only have 92 galleries of wildlife photos, lol, and many wildlife experts agree with me, we are comparing apples to oranges here. Thats not saying the person should not
...Show more

I've shot thousands of photos with the 1D Mark IV and thousands with the 7D. When I look at prints, without going back and checking the file information, I couldn't tell you which prints came from the 1D Mark IV and which came from the 7D.

Les



Aug 24, 2012 at 06:17 AM
eyal.ma
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p.2 #15 · p.2 #15 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Just updating to say thank you to the posters.

I decided to get a used 7D. I found one with less than 15,000 shots + grip for a good price.
I'll save the difference for a new glass (hopefully a 180 macro)



Aug 26, 2012 at 03:07 PM
Gary Petersen
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p.2 #16 · p.2 #16 · 7D or 1D4? (used)


Lars Johnsson wrote:
Yes the 1D4 is worth the difference in price.


Or even a 1D3.



Aug 26, 2012 at 03:22 PM
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