The worst mistake you can do is trying to copy photos which were done by others. IMO it is important to develop your own style and reveal your own creativity.
I was recently at a photo club meeting where one of the speakers presented lenses from a third party manufacturer. To show the excellence of lenses, he presented photos he took with a number of those lenses. Even his technique and the composition of his photos were good, he always tried to copy a style of well known photographers like Ansel Adams for example. He tried to immitate exactly the same shots as published in Ansel Adams books and journals. In his one hour presentation I only saw a few shots which showed some new ideas or more creativity.
This is a very challenging part in photography to find your own independent style.
retrofocus wrote:
The worst mistake you can do is trying to copy photos which were done by others. IMO it is important to develop your own style and reveal your own creativity. [...] This is a very challenging part in photography to find your own independent style.
The best thing to do is try to copy photos done by the masters. You will learn so much. That's how the masters of painting and photography learned their craft. When you try to recreate a lighting setup, you will learn how to make more than just that one lighting setup. When you try to recreate a composition, you will go through some of the same steps the master did while learning and finding that composition. Thus you will be able to find other compositions. So it goes with many different techniques too.
The worst mistake you can do is worrying about your "style". Make the best photos you can. Constantly challenge yourself. Years later, people will begin to say, "oh yeah, her/his style emerged around the year 20xx." You will smile because you will already be thinking about the next project.
retrofocus wrote:
The worst mistake you can do is trying to copy photos which were done by others. IMO it is important to develop your own style and reveal your own creativity.
I think copying is a great way to learn. Do not ONLY copy, but try to copy. And not just the masters - you may not be easily able (logistically) to copy them. Pick a photo from Flickr that you like, and try to shoot it. You will learn a lot in the process. I do that sometimes with studio shots, which is something that I suck at - but when I see a good photo, I ask my friend who's a studio expert what he thinks it was done, and then I try to reproduce it.
This has nothing to do with your own style. You will develop that automatically anyway.
Photography is a subjective thing, and there are different ways how things can be done. What might be a feasible way for one, might be just the opposite for another. I stated my point of view, but I am certain that others just like the opposite.
stanj wrote:
This has nothing to do with your own style. You will develop that automatically anyway.
I disagree with this - I see it too often that people who started out with copying are stuck doing it all the time. But I am glad that this method has worked for you.
If I could sum up and what I have learned, keep things simple, uncluttered simple ideas, don't try and cram everything into an image. Theres lots of images to take, lots of ideas and many different ways to shoot an object. An example: a leaf on the water, how reflections and light, and the elements themselves work upon it.
My other great discovery, turn around, look, explore,see whats going on, which reminds me of a great quote from The Peaceful Warrior "There's Never Nothing Going On."
How many times I have walked down a path, ready to leave when by some quirk of fate I turned around, and saw the light, literally.
Don't be in so much of a rush to discover something new down the road, you miss whats right in front of your face.
I only wish I could develop that eye, that some photographers have, maybe its more of an artistic background, but I'm still looking.
One more thing, listen to everything but only take what you need. Use all those senses too, sometime you may not see an image, but you might just hear one. Yes it is fun, always.
I started out in the darkroom, not behind a camera, and don't recall exactly how old I was (7,8,or 9). I didn't get to develop negatives, but did get to assist with developing the prints.
Later I used a 35mm Petri to take pictures of my own. I wasn't interested in composition or "art" at the time, just pictures of things I wanted to photograph, but while I was capable of using the Petri properly, I didn't consider myself a hobbyist by any means.
My senior year in high school I purchased an Olympus OM-1 and a book. The book was "Peterson's Big Book of Photography" for OM systems. With that book and my first SLR, I embarked on my journey into photography.
I've always been good with books and technical manuals. The Peterson's book wasn't difficult to comprehend and my knowledge started to grow.
A number of years passed while I grew older and worked in my career field, but it wasn't until about 20 years after I bought that first SLR that I started to consider photography as a profession.
During my career in the Navy I had an unusual opportunity to use a Kodak DCS 420 (Nikon N90 body mated to a kodak digital back). It helped me realize the potential of digital photography and I "caught the digital bug", but the price of one of those bodies was well out of my reach.
Enter the personal computer boom and the world wide web explosion.
I learn well on my own, but can't say I'm "self-taught". I've been taught by the those that have gone before me and put their knowledge into the books and web articles which I've purchased and read.
Studio lighting was the hardest thing to learn, not because there are no good books out there about lighting, but because few books really talked about all the equipment options out there, and I almost never have "simple" questions to be answered.
I'm one of those guys that always asks the question no one else thought to ask (or even considered yet). Most educational material usually stops providing information at the point I start to have questions.
I believe the key to photo composition and photo "art" is to first innately understand all the technical aspects of your photography so the technical side is second nature. Once you know how to use your technical knowledge to emulate photo styles you like, you will know how to use your knowledge to "create". Finding that point where you are technically competent enough to embark on your creative journey is different for everyone.
Don't be afraid to experiment and don't forget to take notes to help you understand your results.
Any time you read something in a book that you don't understand.., read it again. If it's a technique or process, TRY IT. If you don't understand it well enough to try, see if an associate can help you with it.
If you're not a book learner, seek conventional classes. If you're better at hands-on learning, join a club. You'll find that almost everyone in photography club is willing to share their knowledge by showing you the answers to your questions.., if you ask the right questions.
The internet is full of both good and bad photography information. The more you learn, the more you learn to recognize the difference.
Photography consists of two part: creativity and capability.
I will never have the creativity part, it's not in my chromosomes or genes or brainwaves, or wherever it's supposed to reside.
The capability part, however. I consider myself to be a capable photographer, i.e., have a decent selection of lenses and bodies and accessory gear, and have figured out how to fit the various combinations together to capture a "capable" shot.
Where I started on the road to capability was with John Shaw. I'm guessing his books are still available. One of the best teachers ever to the self-taught. He covers all the basics from ISO speed to aperture to shutter speed - the "basic basics" of photography.
Completely self-taught might work if you're young enough. Would be tough otherwise.
Two things I decided early on: digital, and shoot RAW. I'm not pretending I knew what I was doing with either of those decisions, but I'm glad I made them and never looked back. I was lucky.
I never did learn. I just keep taking pictures and hopefully getting better as I go. It's taken a long time, but my eye for what makes a good photo vs a boring photo is slowly getting better. When I started out I would just take pictures of anything and everything and maybe I'd get lucky every so often. Now I'm a little more picky before pushing the shutter button.
But anyway, this is a hobby for me and the challenges are what keep me at it. It's sort of like playing golf. Every once in awhile you hit an amazing shot and then you keep playing and practicing hoping you can do it again (and more frequently)
Oh, you know what else is important? taking the damned camera with you! going out looking for shots is great, but you miss a ton of potential shots if your camera is on your desk back at the house. your wife/husband/friends/etc will make fun of you for carrying a camera everywhere, but do it anyways. every day I bring my camera with me to work, to play, to whatever. lots of times I'm never driven to actually take a photo. but it's there.
and we've all heard the quote but I swear I find myself repeating it to myself constantly: "if your photographs aren't good enough, you're not close enough" (Robert capa). I was shooting down by the water last Wednesday and actually found myself grumbling it under my breath as I uprooted my tripod to get closer to a set of steps I was photographing. and I found myself saying it while photographing people downtown, chimping the shots, realizing they were too wide, and realizing I needed to get my lazy chicken ass in there and get closer. a telephoto lens ain't gonna cut it. it can be tough to do. I'm convinced it's the best piece of advice I've read to date.
Started on film about 25 years ago...still haven't learned how to make good photographs...but I'm having fun...and I've found that if you shoot enough you can get lucky once-in-a-while...
In order of importance for me, when I was getting started I learned from
1. Reading books
2. Taking classes at a local college
3. Attending workshops by photographers who were inspiring instructors (John Sexton, Bruce Barnbaum, Ruth Bernhard, et al)
I continue to learn every day but now it's more from experience and the internet.
I'm still learning, but trial and error and a lot of reading taught me what I know. Forums like here and photo.net helped a lot. I also looked at a lot of photos.
Every time you shoot you grow and your vision becomes more refined. The best way to become proficient at anything is to practice, study your own work and learn from your mistakes. Do not spend all your time looking at the web and the work of others. It's great to see images to help you find what's compelling to you, but at some point there is no substitute for doing it yourself.
Final point... don't be afraid to expose your work to the greater public... friends, colleagues and invisible web critics (like here and other sites), but... and here is the cautionary piece... don't get discouraged by those who trash your images and don't fall into swollen head syndrome by those who praise them. Very few people will offer an honest critique as it is easier to say "great image," and move on. Just look on Flickr or the boards on DPreview or FM and you will see lots of "love it, amazing, great, superb..." While this praise may be warranted for some work, it is often false praise in an attempt to be polite or get some reciprocal response in the future.
Be your own critic and find a friend who will be honest with you about your images. In the end, this will help you to grow and be a better photographer.
Like anything else, greatness comes from practice... get out there and begin logging your 10,000 hours ... it pays off!
Great thread, but one thing about practice, and a short story.
I use to love playing golf, ever since i used to do it with my dad. He played for awhile, but he was a big man, at least back then, about 6' 4",and i think that little ball and those clubs frustrated him, I think most people just figure If your big and powerful you can hit the ball a mile.
Eventually one day while playing with him, his ball went in the water, and shortly afterwards so did his whole bag and all his clubs.
Well I kept playing and actually broke 90 a few times.I practiced all the time at the course and at the driving range. One day a friend told me they were doing swing diagnosis with video. So i went up and had my swing done. The gentlemen came out and I asked what I needed to do to improve. In as few a words he basically told me to go back and start from scratch. I told him I practiced all the time. He said yes and you practiced so much the wrong way, now you need to start fresh and lose all those bad habits.
But thats golf, maybe you can't learn the wrong way in photography.
Rather then address where to start....as you continue to grow and gain insights with your photography...make a point of examining on where you've been and where you're going.
Many a time I've looked back on where I was going with my photography. I usually came to the same conclusion that many of my periods, times when I felt like I was going nowhere, were due to my own ego. I was so busy comparing myself to others and competing against them that I’d lost sight of my initial goal which was to focus on my personal development in the photography..
The most important thing to remember is that this is your art. You have to make it yours if you want to become proficient at it. Once you realize that you are developing your own unique representation of the art, you'll also realize that it is pointless to compete against others. You should be focused inwardly on your own development and become completely unhindered by the progress of others.
The learning years is your time to experiment and strengthen your own skill. If the main reason is to show how much better you are against others, then you are simply setting yourself up for a huge disappointment.
Depp wrote:
Rather then address where to start....make a point of looking back on where you've been and where you're going with your photography.
Many a time I've looked back on where I was going with my photography. I usually came to the same conclusion that many of my periods, times when I felt like I was going nowhere, were due to my own ego. I was so busy comparing myself to others and competing against them that I’d lost sight of my initial goal which was to focus on my personal development in the photography..
The most important thing to remember is that this is your art. You have to make it yours if you want to become proficient at it. Once you realize that you are developing your own unique representation of the art, you'll also realize that it is pointless to compete against others. You should be focused inwardly on your own development and become completely unhindered by the progress of others.
The learning years is your time to experiment and strengthen your own skill. If the main reason is to show how much better you are against others, then you are simply setting yourself up for a huge disappointment. ...Show more →
Maybe "Copy" is not the right word used here. Exchange it with "orientation".
Of course one can learn a lot about photography in copying others pictures. But if you do it all around you will get a copy of an existing picture done by somebody before you. I guess that is what retrofocus wanted to say. Using an image you like as an orientation (I guess that is what Monito thought about) is a very good way to learn technics to achive a result you like.
